Does anyone else think present day Blizzard coasts off past Blizzard's achievements?

**RoKPaNda** · 2017-03-27, 02:08 PM

Nope, Blizzard is just doing what Blizzard has always done. People have had the same complaints since I started playing my very first Blizzard game (WarCraft 2)

**Plutarch78** · 2017-03-27, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by YouAreSick

Hearthstone and Overwatch are not amazing games. The fact that we'd even consider them as such proves how fucking terrible video games are now.

Methinks someone forgot to take their meds this morning.

**Toppy** · 2017-03-27, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by rda

Like what? Hearthstone is the only game that can be said to "dominate" its genre if you define it as "card games". Everything else that Blizzard did does not dominate a thing: Overwatch is way smaller than CSGO, HotS is way smaller than DotA / LoL, next to nobody is playing D3 and next to nobody outside of Korea is playing SC2.

WoW is still the most succesful MMO on the market. Something else comes along occasionally that might have a brief high, but then quickly diminishes to obscurity.

Hearthstone is the most popular online card game.

SC2 dominates the RTS market. The only problem is the RTS market is kinda dead.

Overwatch has substantial growth. CS:GO tends to average about 700k. Though it also has a substantial gambling market going, with lots of bots. At this point Overwatch may very well be the biggest FPS on the market. Its growth has been staggering.

D3 is dead in the water.

HotS may be the least popular of the MOBAs.

So out of their 6 games. Four have a significant if not largest share of the market, and two are failing. Though in D3's case when it was active it was far and away the most successful game in its genre. Its just had many months of no content and being ignored.

**Lady Dragonheart** · 2017-03-27, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by rda

Like what? Hearthstone is the only game that can be said to "dominate" its genre if you define it as "card games". Everything else that Blizzard did does not dominate a thing: Overwatch is way smaller than CSGO, HotS is way smaller than DotA / LoL, next to nobody is playing D3 and next to nobody outside of Korea is playing SC2.

You're going to need proof of these many unfounded claims.

**Ifeanychukwu** · 2017-03-27, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by YouAreSick

Hearthstone and Overwatch are not amazing games. The fact that we'd even consider them as such proves how fucking terrible video games are now.

Assholes are like opinions.

**rda** · 2017-03-27, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Toppy

So out of their 6 games. Four have a significant if not largest share of the market, and two are failing. Though in D3's case when it was active it was far and away the most successful game in its genre. Its just had many months of no content and being ignored.

By your own count, out of 6 games:

1. WoW is merely "still" a success - ie, it is falling down continuously, but since it was so big once, it is still larger than others,
2. Hearthstone is a success (what I said),
3. Overwatch is kind of fine but does not dominate a thing because there is CSGO - if you think Overwatch is bigger than CSGO (really???), please say so clearly and we will look into this in more detail,
4. SC2 can dominate its niche however much it wants and no one would care because the niche is so tiny now (hey, maybe if SC2 was actually good, maybe more people would have played it and the niche would have been larger?)
5 and 6. D3 is dead, HotS is dead, neither is a success.

That's 1 item for WoW which is kind of pointless to include because we all agree it WAS a success - but it is hardly a success now, because it is reducing, not growing + 1 item for a real success (HS) + 4 kind of failures with one of them (OW) looking questionable might-still-be-a-success some time later.

So, pretty much what I said - mostly meh, some degree of success in places but certainly nothing of the scale of WoW.

**Toppy** · 2017-03-27, 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by rda

By your own count, out of 6 games:

1. WoW is merely "still" a success - ie, it is falling down continuously, but since it was so big once, it is still larger than others,
2. Hearthstone is a success (what I said),
3. Overwatch is kind of fine but does not dominate a thing because there is CSGO - if you think Overwatch is bigger than CSGO (really???), please say so clearly and we will look into this in more detail,
4. SC2 can be whatever and no one would care because its so niche, it does not matter (hey, maybe if SC2 was actually good, maybe more people would have played it and the niche would have been greater?)
5 and 6. D3 is dead, HotS is dead, neither are a success.

That's 1 item for WoW which is kind of pointless to include because we all agree it WAS a success - but it is hardly a success now, because it is reducing, not growing + 1 item for a real success (HS) + 4 kind of failures with one of them (OW) looking questionable might-still-be-a-success some time later.

So, pretty much what I said - mostly meh, some degree of success in places but certainly nothing of the scale of WoW.

Even if WoW is on a decline, its still the head game of the MMO genre.

Concerning Overwatch. It reached over 20 million in sales in less than a year. CS:GO maintains an average of 700k but is also notorious for farm bots due to its gambling scene.

SC2 isnt niche. Its an RTS. The genre is dying, but your point was that blizzard games arent dominating. SC2 very much is dominating RTS.

Four out of six of their games outright dominating genres is not "some degree of success". Please note I'm not saying any of these games are especially amazing. Only that they are dominating their genre.

Stop back peddling.

Deleted · 2017-03-27, 02:40 PM

Legion is the best version of WoW that ever existed, since and including, vanilla. There have been a number of awesome innovations like LFR, personal loot, WF/TF, WQ's, and so on.
Present day blizzard is doing awesome!

**rda** · 2017-03-27, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by Toppy

Four out of six of their games outright dominating genres is not "some degree of success". Please note I'm not saying any of these games are especially amazing. Only that they are dominating their genre.

My point was always that (a) they have been reducing effort put into WoW and moving it to other projects, yet (b) these other projects saw pretty limited success, nothing on the scale of success that WoW had. Maybe I should have been clearer, but "dominating" a tiny niche like SC2 does is not much because you can not function on the niche this small and that was my point. The big question is what Blizzard are going to do when WoW finally dies - nothing they created looks like something they can really live off. It was foolish to move effort from WoW into everything else. Well, in my opinion.

**ComputerNerd** · 2017-03-27, 02:53 PM

People who want to see blizzard as the bad guy for not catering solely to their whims will do so no matter what anyone else says.

Deleted · 2017-03-27, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by rda

My point was always that (a) they have been reducing effort put into WoW and moving it to other projects, yet (b) these other projects saw pretty limited success, nothing on the scale of success that WoW had. Maybe I should have been clearer, but "dominating" a tiny niche like SC2 does is not much because you can not function on the niche this small and that was my point. The big question is what Blizzard are going to do when WoW finally dies - nothing they created looks like something they can really live off. It was foolish to move effort from WoW into everything else. Well, in my opinion.

Legion has been the most content-filled expansion, ever. People are complaining about how fast new patches and new raids are coming out. Stating they've been reducing effort put into wow is simply wrong.

**Gimlix** · 2017-03-27, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by YouAreSick

Hearthstone and Overwatch are not amazing games. The fact that we'd even consider them as such proves how fucking terrible video games are now.

Not that i am a big fan of the games, but both of these games are a massive success among the gaming community.
I just wish they made a WC4. To bad we gotta wait or never have it^^

**McNeil** · 2017-03-27, 03:29 PM

Overwatch has shown that they can still pull off some great new games, but this is the only new IP since.... literally forever. Both HotS and Hearthstone have to thank their popularity due to the major IP's they're using, they wouldn't be nearly as popular if they were using brand new IP's. Hearthstone is very succesfull but has been declining lately, which is also apparent with their business model moving to more adventurers while dropping adventurers, and the increase in EU prices. Not sure how well HotS is doing but Blizzard has never been able to brag about its succes, so I guess its just doing average while most people rather go to LoL or DotA 2 instead. Diablo 3 also got its succes solely because of Diablo 2's legacy, yet it failed to deliver and is now barely doing well after all the updates. Atleast the game got better now. SC2 is the same case but its much less popular than Warcraft and Diablo, its only good for its e-sport scene which is dying out except for in South Korea. Never finished the campaign (found it rather dull) but I heard nothing but bad things about it.

And then ofcourse WoW, whether the game is better or worse today its easy to tell that most people still playing have been playing for quite a while and don't like the thought of abandoning all of their progress. The game fails in bringing in new players, and the subs continue to drop despite all the fast patches they bring in these days.

Personally I think their 3 major IP's could use a break so that they can focus on bringing us new Overwatches (just new IP's) that blows new genres out of the water. They did so before and they might be able to do so again.

**rda** · 2017-03-27, 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by Herpie

Legion has been the most content-filled expansion, ever. People are complaining about how fast new patches and new raids are coming out. Stating they've been reducing effort put into wow is simply wrong.

Legion has nearly no new gameplay, all its big features are just difficulty modes and grinds put on top of traditional content. That is, small numerical increases spread over time. Things like that are damn easy to do for the devs. Lots of traditional content is also reused (Dalaran, Karazhan, half of the world quests reusing regular quests, etc, etc, etc). Lots of things are gated. It took more than 6 months to fully open the first raid tier, etc.

They are absolutely reducing effort.

**Dormie** · 2017-03-27, 05:09 PM

WoW is still coasting off its past success. Not to say today's WoW isn't decent, but if WoW started at Cata it'd go the way of ther failed MMOs.

Originally Posted by Kathranis

Not even two posts in and you already take an indefensible stance.

You're seriously going to deny Blizzard's accomplishment in making a game that garnered universal acclaim, won multiple GOTY awards, and established huge playerbase of dedicated fans with over 20 million units sold, all right out of the gate despite being a completely new IP?

Please. Hearthstone and OW are simplistic trash that only got popular due to hype and being made by Blizzard. They were both aimed at 10 year olds and 10 year olds are fucking stupid. An Indy company puts out those same games and no one cares.