Why the outrage over paying for your half of the meal?

[Kalis]

I don't get that. If I want to stress myself for giggles I'll work, at least there I get paid.

Why would I choose to stress myself in such a situation?

If I can't enjoy a stressless date with someone, how could I possibly have a stressless relationship with them?

I was talking about shagging.

[TheFuse]

Weird, I figured Tennis was on the side of expecting men to fully pay for and support the woman.

[Hisholyness]

A lot of people are saying "whoever asked should pay"...isn't that usually the guy, anyway? I mean, here in the states, it is (at least anecdotally in my sphere of experience) expected that the male ask the female out. Females wait for the man to ask, even if she's the one interested. It seems to be the societal expectation. It also 'vogue' for people to judge men as "cheap" or "broke" if they don't offer to pay (even in non-sketchy situations (unlike the OP story). I wonder...how do same-sex dates handle this? Is it different for M+M vs F+F dates?

Its the beautiful double standard create by women and betas, it only benefits women.

[Requimortem]

Shes 35 and isn't married which statistically means A) she can't keep a man and B) isn't attractive enough for a man to want her. I was agreeing with your chore remark.

I know, I was being sarcastic to mock the people who are defending her.

[socanyou]

Why don't you read my previous posts?

Are you confused?

You made the distinction about women multiple times, that's what I read. Seems like you backpedaled after that danger comment. I don't have any issue with you saying leaving your date behind is a "dick move," but she was clearly the one that wanted to go separate ways that night.

[Hisholyness]

Or maybe she doesn't want to settle for something less than she actually wants?

Shes the only factor in deciding a relationship?

[Radaney]

Dude was a jerk and did clearly have one agenda in mind, especially notable when he cut contact at the end but that's IMO as I don't indulge in this practice myself.

Girl still shouldn't expect people to pay for her meals.

Pretty much summarise's it.

[Krigaren]

Why didn't she just say no in the first place. First she used some key excuse and then when he called her buff, then she declined.

Because reasonable people who are interested in a person and want to keep the options open for more dates don't jump to conclusions and say, "No, I'm not having sex with you." over, say, having a polite excuse for why she couldn't go home with him. It also helps prevent a scene by not denying him to his face.

She could have been wrong, and he may have earnestly wanted to only show off his bourbon collection, and could have offended him and immediately burned a bridge with him if she'd done that. But his reaction makes it pretty obvious that she was right in her assumption.

You must not go out on dates, much.

[Hisholyness]

Dude was a jerk and did clearly have one agenda in mind, especially notable when he cut contact at the end

Girl still shouldn't expect people to pay for her meals.

Pretty much summarise's it.

Who allowed the rational thoughts into this thread?

[Karlz0rz]

I see a lot of people spouting the "The one who invites should pay" idea. The thing I dislike about this, is that it's still by large seen as a mans "job" to ask girls out.
So more often than not, men will be the ones to ask.
Should it still fall on men, just because society is set up in a way that men are the initiators?

[Krigaren]

Shes the only factor in deciding a relationship?

For herself? Uh...gonna go with yes.

[Shaderas]

You just seem really determined to find fault with the woman.

I don't feel that I am, but to each their own (perspective). I guess I'll just leave it at that.

[Radaney]

I see a lot of people spouting the "The one who invites should pay" idea. The thing I dislike about this, is that it's still by large seen as a mans "job" to ask girls out.
So more often than not, men will be the ones to ask.
Should it still fall on men, just because society is set up in a way that men are the initiators?

I disagree with it irregardless because 2 people make the experience not one.

The girl isn't doing the guy a favour by accepting his invitation to a date, that is ridiculous.

[Krigaren]

I see a lot of people spouting the "The one who invites should pay" idea. The thing I dislike about this, is that it's still by large seen as a mans "job" to ask girls out.
So more often than not, men will be the ones to ask.
Should it still fall on men, just because society is set up in a way that men are the initiators?

Easy solution would be for guys to not ask women out on dates. That should weed out all those shrill, money grubbing harpies who expect men to pay for everything while also complaining that they're not equal.

Am I wearing my fedora correctly?

[Requimortem]

Easy solution would be for guys to not ask women out on dates. That should weed out all those shrill, money grubbing harpies who expect men to pay for everything while also complaining that they're not equal.

Am I wearing my fedora correctly?

I would say it's on a little too tightly but I don't think there's anything up there to supply blood to anyway.

[socanyou]

No, I didn't. It's still a valid point but my argument works even without it. It wasn't as if she wanted to go separate ways immediately. She just didn't want to go back to his place. He was the one that wanted to end it as soon as he figured out he wasn't getting laid.

valid sexist point. your argument is as good as saying that it's rude to cough into your hands. sure, why not. you seemed emotional when you wrote how "it's a dick move to fucking leave a girl alone bla bla" so I thought you were coming from a position of sexism. Just pointing out that something was rude in that situation makes little sense. She criticized plenty about him despite having a "good time." That doesn't mean she is entitled to free drinks.

[Hisholyness]

guy gets mad girl gets mad everyone gets mad

[Krigaren]

I would say it's on a little too tightly but I don't think there's anything up there to supply blood to anyway.

You're not making the cute, cutting jibe that you think you are.

[Mehrunes]

Just the fact that when describing herself she said "I'm definitely unique" made me dislike her from the start. When someone talks about themselves like that, especially when they talk about how long they've been single and how hard finding someone is, it's easy to assume they think too highly of themselves. You shouldn't ever expect someone else to pay for you unless they actually say they are going to in the first place. Yeah he's an ass for only wanting to hook up but doesn't make her less of one in her own right.

Always expect to pay for your meals unless stated different. Even then always have enough money on you to cover the meal in case shit goes south with you and your date.

Both people are idiots.

Pretty much this. The entire introduction part was a bit wird. The cyber-stalking escapade with friends even more than "I'm so unique, tee hee". And while her main issue was with his behavior afterwards she was still "shocked he didn't at least offer to pay". And yes, like other people said, she could have expected just that and wanted to offer to split, but even that is not particularly awesome of her. And kinda unlikely. If she actually wanted to offer to split, what is the issue with the guy wanting splitting from the get go (especially before he ditched her)? Unless you only offer hoping that he insists on paying anyway and you just "happen" to be persuaded, there's no effective difference. Now combine that with the reasons she went on a date with this particular guy. Just like he's not entitled to sex with her because they went on two dates, she's not entitled to have her drinks or food paid for by another person, or to have that offered to her.

Clear male bias right there. All we have is her side of the story, but you need for the woman to be the villain to the point where you make negative assumptions entirely based on her gender rather than going by what she's written. Not much can be done about that I'm afraid.

A woman with expectations and social values is "unpleasant to be around", despite the fact that her story tells that she had a good time with the guy up until the end. 2017 folks!

And guys wearing the victim cardigan on the web wonder why feminazis are growing in numbers.

How is @Requimortem's assumption "based entirely on her gender" again? Also, why is it OK for you to assume things even if they run contrary to what her side of her story that we have? You assume his desire to get her home with him was no doubt of sexual nature. Which is an assumption. Maybe he really wanted to show her his bourbon collection. Maybe he wanted to kill her. Maybe it's not what she said but how he said it (i.e. the flimsy bullshit of an excuse)?

As for whether or not she's unpleasant to be around, your reasons as to why it can't be the case are illogical. She's not the one who spent time with her, he was. So her having a good time is inconsequential here. And her proclaiming that both of them had a good time is just an assumption of hers. Which I thought you were against. By her own admission he was detached and not-in-the-moment. On both dates. Doesn't sound like he was having as much of a good time as she did. Plus she sounds unpleasant from her intro.

Yeah, I laugh of this ridiculous hypocrisy as well. They even created a perfect pseudo-nonsexist explanation for that - that the person who invites to a date pays for meals.

What hypocrisy? The fact that men are expected to invite women out is just mere happenstance and is completely unrelated. Strong, independent women are only victims of circumstance and forced into a position where they'd like to pay, but just can't. Wait, 80% of women in US expect men to pay on first dates and see a proposition to split coming from a guy as a red flag, if not deal-breaker... Patriarchy and internalized misogyny, maybe?

How am I acting like that? My entire fucking point is that the way he handled it was immature and he acted like a jerk. I even said she could have responded to his offer to go back to his place in a more honest way. But at least she wasn't a bitch about it. People saying she should have paid her half are missing the fact that she didn't really have a chance to offer.

And unless she didn't actually want to pay her half, what does it change?

What? Do you not think it's more dangerous for a woman to be alone at night than a man? This is just a stupid fucking comment.

Given how stark majority of crime victims are men, why would it be more dangerous for a woman? Chances she's going to get jumped by a rapist are rather low.

Again, how the fuck can she even be wrong about splitting the bill if she didn't have a chance to offer to split the bill? She never said she expected him to pay. She said she expected him to offer. For all you know, she was going to offer to pay her half but she didn't have that chance.

Again, if that was the case, what does it change she wasn't offered to split?

Well, statistics says otherwise since you don't exactly hear about men getting raped out in public, like ever. They're also more often the target of muggings.

And rape by stranger, particularly when jumped on a street, is the rarest circumstance of rape.

Because reasonable people who are interested in a person and want to keep the options open for more dates don't jump to conclusions and say, "No, I'm not having sex with you." over, say, having a polite excuse for why she couldn't go home with him. It also helps prevent a scene by not denying him to his face.

Refusing a single hookup, particularly after first few dates, does not prevent the option from being open. Nor is refusing it "jumping to conclusions". I have no idea what kind of logic brought you to phrase it in such a way. And bullshitting someone in their face with implausible excuses isn't particularly polite.

It's "dating" apps. If i found someone on tinder and they would only want me for my cool looks i wouldn't be surprised. There's some context missing i.e. the app, if there was any expectation of anything other than sex, etc. but this wouldn't be shocking to me. Sure, the guy is a bit of a douche but that's about it.

Well, in her defense, she didn't seem experienced with online dating, so even if she used Tinder, she may have been unaware of such differences between various dating apps.

[Karlz0rz]

Easy solution would be for guys to not ask women out on dates. That should weed out all those shrill, money grubbing harpies who expect men to pay for everything while also complaining that they're not equal.

Am I wearing my fedora correctly?

I think the solution would be for people to not expect one party to pay for all, and that everyone should be able to ask everyone out without stigma!