Trump Signs Order Undoing Policies Obama's Clean Energy Plan

[Lokryn]

I accept the climate change science but I would rather see solutions come about through the free market instead of subsidizing the industry (goes for all including oil and coal). If Green energy is the way to go, it should be able to stand on its own two feet instead of tax payer's dime. I hope that we go that route, I really do but the US is almost 20 trillion dollars in debt and I think we have more immediate threats (improving the economy, infrastructure, terrorism, NKorea, cyber attacks, etc.).

[Wildtree]

I only have Avaaz or other petition-mongers because I live in Europe. :I

I still would prefer a ...permanent end to Trump's lunacy though. Of course, getting him impeached would be the least harmfully intended way, but I don't have hopes of that happening atm...

A Trump impeachment, at this point, won't go over pretty easy with his hardcore supporters.
Some of them might react pretty violent.

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I accept the climate change science but I would rather see solutions come about through the free market instead of subsidizing the industry (goes for all including oil and coal). If Green energy is the way to go, it should be able to stand on its own two feet instead of tax payer's dime. I hope that we go that route, I really do but the US is almost 20 trillion dollars in debt and I think we have more immediate threats (improving the economy, infrastructure, terrorism, NKorea, cyber attacks, etc.).

The climate change is effecting the infrastructure though.
Alternative energy solutions need to be implemented and integrated into the existing structure. That in return creates more jobs.
Every indication points towards clean energy being the way to go.
Ecologically and economically.
Leaving the market unregulated has and always will lead to disaster for people.
Why would I not build that coal plant next to your neighborhood? If there's no regulation preventing me from doing it, I rather care for the profit I can make.

Back to coal for a second..
The funny part and fine print is.. The end of coal is and never was the new climate change regulations.
Natural gas is the reason for coal's demise.

[Lokryn]

A Trump impeachment, at this point, won't go over pretty easy with his hardcore supporters.
Some of them might react pretty violent.

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The climate change is effecting the infrastructure though.
Alternative energy solutions need to be implemented and integrated into the existing structure. That in return creates more jobs.
Every indication points towards clean energy being the way to go.
Ecologically and economically.
Leaving the market unregulated has and always will lead to disaster for people.
Why would I not build that coal plant next to your neighborhood? If there's no regulation preventing me from doing it, I rather care for the profit I can make.

Back to coal for a second..
The funny part and fine print is.. The end of coal is and never was the new climate change regulations.
Natural gas is the reason for coal's demise.

I should have clarified. I didn't mean remove regulations, just don't subsidize it. Trump is obviously making a mistake by totally doing away with Obama's clean energy program. I'm no expert but extreme Left and Right ideologies are a terrible way to govern and I think the solution is usually somewhere in the middle.

[Acidbaron]

Green energy is a technology that needed investment to grow as it would never become profitable due to the initial high R&D costs surrounding this.

Beyond that subsidies are needed to keep them competitive not within their own nation but on global scale when those companies have to compete with other nations where they are heavily subsidized. Therefor its a novel idea to say that each industry should rise on its own merits but it's falls flat on its face when you remove it from the vacuum it is placed in by those who say that and dropped in reality.

Once it does lift off, it will pay off for the government on more than one way. Also all energy markets are supported by government if it goes from coal to nuclear, so simply in that context saying a completely new one should rise on its own is killing it off before it even sets one step forward.

[Orlong]

Trump can't bring back coal jobs; Coal CEO Warns

Trump EO Won't Save Coal Mining Jobs

Robert Murray, founder and chief executive of Murray Energy—the nation's largest privately held coal mining company—told the Guardian that many mining jobs were lost to technology and competition, rather than regulation.

Trump can't really change that, Murray said.
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So the problems are technology...(oh my...robots? Close enough. Automation)
Competition; cheaper natural gas, and the boom in solar and wind generation.

Even if the coal jobs dont come back because of automation, as long as they can keep mining coal with robots, coal will continue to be the cheapest source of energy for most people. Sorry but Ill gladly heat my home with coal for 10% of the cost of heating it with some cockamamie green power source like solar.

Most people care about their wallets, not environmental activism

[Lokryn]

Green energy is a technology that needed investment to grow as it would never become profitable due to the initial high R&D costs surrounding this.

Beyond that subsidies are needed to keep them competitive not within their own nation but on global scale when those companies have to compete with other nations where they are heavily subsidized. Therefor its a novel idea to say that each industry should rise on its own merits but it's falls flat on its face when you remove it from the vacuum it is placed in by those who say that and dropped in reality.

Once it does lift off, it will pay off for the government on more than one way. Also all energy markets are supported by government if it goes from coal to nuclear, so simply in that context saying a completely new one should rise on its own is killing it off before it even sets one step forward.

Never is a strong word. There are always going to be innovations in technology that companies will invest in that don't require government subsidies. The company I work for is spending millions of dollars on R&D making our equipment run more efficient and use green technologies to do so. It's a necessity for us to remain profitable.

Now, I will agree that infrastructure is one area where the government should integrate green energy into the structure because that is public domain.

[JohnBrown1917]

Trump can go fuck himself.

~Sincerly, the rest of the world.

Good, just because he doesn't believe in leftist propaganda that hasn't even been proven doesn't mean hes anti-science. And even assuming it's all 100% true, I don't think that our taxpayers should pay more for so called "green energy" while the rest of the world keeps polluting. It's a waste of money and doesn't even do anything positive.

Climate change has nothing to do with the left/right divide.

[Ghostpanther]

*thumbs up. You go Trump! Jobs is also one thing people need now and cheaper energy. This action helps with those.

[Deleted]

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/03/28/c...te-change.html

The Clean Power Plan is the Obama regulation that caps emissions for coal power plants, it is the primary policy to reach the Paris Accord target. This is what happens when you vote for an anti-intellectual, anti-science hack that believes climate change is a Chinese hoax: he tries to destroy the planet.

And no, coal jobs are not coming back. Cheaper clean energy (thanks Obama) and automation has killed coal mining jobs.

But I'm sure the Trumpsters here can't wait to work in the great coal mines as promised by their God-emperor!

I like how Trump just thinks signing orders will do or undo everything in an instant. He's so amusingly simpleminded.

[Medusa Cascade]

The world should embargo the US

[Ghostpanther]

I like how Trump just thinks signing orders will do or undo everything in an instant. He's so amusingly simpleminded.

Then every US President has been simple minded. :P

[Deleted]

Even if the coal jobs dont come back because of automation, as long as they can keep mining coal with robots, coal will continue to be the cheapest source of energy for most people. Sorry but Ill gladly heat my home with coal for 10% of the cost of heating it with some cockamamie green power source like solar.

Most people care about their wallets, not environmental activism

Yeah why'd we wanna preserve the one and only place in existance where life has evolved when we can save a few bucks?

Humans sure are great.

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Then every US President has been simple minded. :P

More or less.

[Ghostpanther]

The world should embargo the US

The US can survive fine on it's own.

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More or less.

Ahh...so your response was in reality a nation bashing one.

[Adam Jensen]

Good thing there are other planets for us to move to after the industries and the governments destroy this one.

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The US can survive fine on it's own.

Yeah, if you want to pay triple the price for that new smartphone.

[JohnBrown1917]

Ahh...so your response was in reality a nation bashing one.

With the US pulling shit like this, its well deserved.

[Adam Jensen]

Let me know when he and his party accomplish anything that isn't a rollback or impediment to our society.

Uh . . . he signed a bill encouraging the use of the American flag on the National Vietnam War Veteran's day. I guess you can't really say anything bad about that.

[Daelak]

Good, just because he doesn't believe in leftist propaganda that hasn't even been proven doesn't mean hes anti-science. And even assuming it's all 100% true, I don't think that our taxpayers should pay more for so called "green energy" while the rest of the world keeps polluting. It's a waste of money and doesn't even do anything positive.

It's almost like Trump supporters want the US to become a 2nd tier nation whose domestic investment will crater along with brain drain to the new economic and global leaders.

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i don't do Twitter. I was going off of your " let's just kill ourselves since life is futile".

You do realize i said I agree with climate science. My disagreement is with the arrogant idea that changing the environment in ways we don't like equates to destroying the planet.

if we go full ham and abandoned all green tech ( we won't, btw) whatever the planet eventually settled at would be quite different than what it's been since we came along. Earth would settle into a new equilibrium, and keep right on rolling through space.

My 500 million - 1 billion year point is that the expansion of the Sun is a hard limit to the time that Earth can support complex life. We'd better have our asses out of here by then.

It would be inhabitable for future generations of human beings, as the environmental impact of humans outside of climate change is causing the world's 6th extinction event.

[Ghostpanther]

G

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Yeah, if you want to pay triple the price for that new smartphone.

Pfft. That is only because we have let that happen.

[Kujako]

I like how Trump just thinks signing orders will do or undo everything in an instant. He's so amusingly simpleminded.

Yeah... I bet he'll claim this will bring back coal jobs.

[Ghostpanther]

With the US pulling shit like this, its well deserved.

Well other countries have did some shitty stuff which they deserved the outcome too. So what? You still do not see me bashing a individual country.