How do you feel about Disc

[MendUS]

Or you removed the absorbs from the Cake and the Legendary neckless and only counted heals from the Disc toolkit, they did stomp him.

Those healers have access to the same items. Not sure why you want to discount items that make your throughput go up... which every item does through additional stats?

[Melusine]

How do I feel about disc? In WoD, I rolled my first Disc priest at approximately BRF. I fucking loved it. In time, I became, by just doing pug raids, a more potent healer than my mained resto shaman. I loved the play style, and kicked myself in the ass for not doing it sooner. I was poised to make that my new main leading into Legion.....

...Then the lead in patch happened. Disc was so fundamentally changed, and went, in terms of power, from a strong first to a dead last. I gave it an honest try, and it fell so short, I went holy, and quested as shadow. Out of protest, I did not place any artifact power into the disc weapon. I have it just for the skins, and will probably delete it if I can once legion is over with.

Whatever antigenius thought this abortion of a spec up should have turned this into a 4th spec, say, a shadowmender, that way discipline could have remained undefiled, or should be outright fired.

[MendUS]

How do I feel about disc? In WoD, I rolled my first Disc priest at approximately BRF. I fucking loved it. In time, I became, by just doing pug raids, a more potent healer than my mained resto shaman. I loved the play style, and kicked myself in the ass for not doing it sooner. I was poised to make that my new main leading into Legion.....

...Then the lead in patch happened. Disc was so fundamentally changed, and went, in terms of power, from a strong first to a dead last. I gave it an honest try, and it fell so short, I went holy, and quested as shadow. Out of protest, I did not place any artifact power into the disc weapon. I have it just for the skins, and will probably delete it if I can once legion is over with.

Whatever antigenius thought this abortion of a spec up should have turned this into a 4th spec, say, a shadowmender, that way discipline could have remained undefiled, or should be outright fired.

So you enjoyed spamming PW:S and topping the meters at the expense of other healers. In other words, you like to play an OP spec.

Explains a lot of this thread actually.

[Deleted]

a shadowmender

I sense something went wrong here.

[Melusine]

So you enjoyed spamming PW:S and topping the meters at the expense of other healers. In other words, you like to play an OP spec.

Explains a lot of this thread actually.

I'm not the one who opened Pandora's box. But really, redesigning something to go from top to dead last seems counterintuitive.

[Memento1]

I'm not the one who opened Pandora's box. But really, redesigning something to go from top to dead last seems counterintuitive.

There's a reason it was nerfed: the other healers hated our living guts. The problem wasn't Disc could do great healing, it was that Disc could do great healing with no skill (did you not notice everyone and their dog started playing their Disc alt?).

Here's the problem: a healer's output should scale with their skill. A bad healer should do bad numbers, a decent healer should do decent numbers, and a great healer should do great numbers. In WoD, a bad Disc could do great numbers. That's wrong, so they changed it. They probably went too far in the other direction now: a bad Disc does bad numbers, a decent Disc does bad numbers, and only a great Disc does great numbers. So it needs some tinkering, but that doesn't mean the previous version wasn't just as flawed.

[Deleted]

There's a reason it was nerfed: the other healers hated our living guts. The problem wasn't Disc could do great healing, it was that Disc could do great healing with no skill (did you not notice everyone and their dog started playing their Disc alt?).

Here's the problem: a healer's output should scale with their skill. A bad healer should do bad numbers, a decent healer should do decent numbers, and a great healer should do great numbers. In WoD, a bad Disc could do great numbers. That's wrong, so they changed it. They probably went too far in the other direction now: a bad Disc does bad numbers, a decent Disc does bad numbers, and only a great Disc does great numbers. So it needs some tinkering, but that doesn't mean the previous version wasn't just as flawed.

Actually, even in WoD, a bad disc priest could do bad numbers ). I had somebody's alt in the guild, person managed to be under the tanks sometimes (in healing). After the Legion patch, I heard the said disc on discord saying "wtf, I'm oom". Turned out she had been spamming radiance to actually heal - in a 5 man (not using atonement).
Don't underestimate the power of bad.
I know what you mean, just for lulz.

[Melusine]

There's a reason it was nerfed: the other healers hated our living guts. The problem wasn't Disc could do great healing, it was that Disc could do great healing with no skill (did you not notice everyone and their dog started playing their Disc alt?).

Here's the problem: a healer's output should scale with their skill. A bad healer should do bad numbers, a decent healer should do decent numbers, and a great healer should do great numbers. In WoD, a bad Disc could do great numbers. That's wrong, so they changed it. They probably went too far in the other direction now: a bad Disc does bad numbers, a decent Disc does bad numbers, and only a great Disc does great numbers. So it needs some tinkering, but that doesn't mean the previous version wasn't just as flawed.

To call what happened with disc priest a "nerf" doesn't even scratch the surface. Disc priests weren't nerfed, they were crippled.

There are other ways to go about retuning classes that doesn't involve a comprehensive overhaul of the class that can turn it from great to no longer a viable healing class. So, in truth, a bad disc does abysmal numbers, a decent disc is still not considered, and a great one still can't figure out what they could do differently to make themselves useful in a real raid environment. If the Disc priest was left how it was, and, say, make the shields have cast times on them, and do the full damage divided by 2, 1/2 to go to healing, the other half being a shield, or something of that nature, rather than a mediocre healer that also does mediocre damage against an equally skilled healer of any type, you see clearly why disc is shit, and it isn't viable for raiding.

- - - Updated - - -

I sense something went wrong here.

go on.....

[Deleted]

i could easily overheal (as holy) bad disc priests in wod. dics had even problems (strong part was also weakness) - people didn't take them because raids usually wanted only 1 disc. I think it's safe to say that disc is nearly not playable atm - meaning they did the opposite with it - instead of making it not niche healer they made it even more situational healer, what has good usability on certain situations but overall it is considerably weaker than other healing specs - meaning playability has suffered immensely.

[Deleted]

And I am even happier it is not MoP and also not WoD disc for that matter.

I was just thinking I didn't recall MoP being so bad... then I remembered I was playing shadow for MoP. >_<

I'm not a fan of Legion disc, atonement feels too clunky and like too much of a chore to manage, it just sucks the fun out of it for me. But I'm not much of a raider, so it is a bit different.

[MendUS]

To call what happened with disc priest a "nerf" doesn't even scratch the surface. Disc priests weren't nerfed, they were crippled.

There are other ways to go about retuning classes that doesn't involve a comprehensive overhaul of the class that can turn it from great to no longer a viable healing class. So, in truth, a bad disc does abysmal numbers, a decent disc is still not considered, and a great one still can't figure out what they could do differently to make themselves useful in a real raid environment. If the Disc priest was left how it was, and, say, make the shields have cast times on them, and do the full damage divided by 2, 1/2 to go to healing, the other half being a shield, or something of that nature, rather than a mediocre healer that also does mediocre damage against an equally skilled healer of any type, you see clearly why disc is shit, and it isn't viable for raiding.

- - - Updated - - -



go on.....

You rant about how bad the spec is and that the spec isn't viable. When certain people (a small percentage mind you) can make it work in their favor, how is the spec bad? Clearly some people figured out how to make it work, meaning it's not that the spec is bad, it's that it requires a lot of practice, skill, and effort to master. It's an unforgiving spec and if you're prone to making mistakes your numbers are going to be terrible.

TLDR: Disc isn't shit, you're probably just shit at playing it.

---

EDIT: I didn't really address the elephant in the room here: Disc needs to have some kind of rehash in 7.2.5 that allows for a less steep learning curve. The spec is awkward and takes a lot of time to adjust to, even with resources available to tell you what to do. Making it work in your favor is possible, but sitting here trashing it when you clearly haven't played it much at all this expansion is a tad rich.

[Supliftz]

Or you removed the absorbs from the Cake and the Legendary neckless and only counted heals from the Disc toolkit, they did stomp him.

??????????????????????????????????????

If you remove part of someone's healing of course they are going to get stomped??????????????

how about I randomly ignore the healing of efflo, and see how well that druid performs ?

[Memento1]

To call what happened with disc priest a "nerf" doesn't even scratch the surface. Disc priests weren't nerfed, they were crippled.

There are other ways to go about retuning classes that doesn't involve a comprehensive overhaul of the class that can turn it from great to no longer a viable healing class. So, in truth, a bad disc does abysmal numbers, a decent disc is still not considered, and a great one still can't figure out what they could do differently to make themselves useful in a real raid environment. If the Disc priest was left how it was, and, say, make the shields have cast times on them, and do the full damage divided by 2, 1/2 to go to healing, the other half being a shield, or something of that nature, rather than a mediocre healer that also does mediocre damage against an equally skilled healer of any type, you see clearly why disc is shit, and it isn't viable for raiding.

You don't seem to understand why Disc was overhauled. It's not because the shields were too strong, or too fast to apply. Shields prevented other healers from getting to heal. Of course YOU liked it - it was like entering a foot race with a car. It made the experience for everyone else miserable. So they resolved to remove almost all shields (not just from Disc, from pallies too), and that required a complete overhaul of the spec. The other things that defined the Disc playstyle besides shields were proactive healing and healing-through-damage. Thus they attempted to make a completely new Disc out of those ideas. The current iteration is what they came up with. Is it perfect? Certainly not - I have been completely up-front about that. But it could NOT have stayed what it was, not even a little.

And it's getting really frustrating when you say things like Disc isn't viable for raiding, when plenty of us have shown it is, and we don't feel useless. Maybe YOU do, but you are not the spec.

[Mintra]

I feel pretty good myself as a disc. I've changed a few guilds lately, and did quite a bit of pugging along the way (heroic and mythic NH), and there was not one group where I did not feel desired. It was always "yay, disc priest. nice hps".
But when I get whispers asking for advice about disc, I always tell that it would probably be a bad experience having a disc as an alt, as it requires good gear, lots of practice, addons, macros etc, in order to be decent

[Zka]

I really liked disc in dungeons. For raids I had to adapt a lot before I would start to enjoy it. Generally, the base idea is great, but the atonement application process is quite clunky and makes the spec totally unable to react quickly to unplanned events.

[Leenaleena]

Legion Disc broke my heart.

I first tried Disc in late MoP. I basically fell in love with it after seeing a Disc solo heal 10-man Garrosh Heroic (Mythic). I loved the damage focus of it and the swinging between modes; there was the damage dealing part to stack up Evangelism and then hitting Archangel shortly before incoming damage to throw out one group shield and then healing while it was up until switching back to smiting. I absolutely loved it.
I do understand that anti-smart-heal path Blizzard took. There is no thinking involved in just pressing a button and letting the game pick the best target available.

Then WoD happened and I was a bit dismayed by the switch in focus away from damage and towards shield-blanketing. I refused to give in all the way and did fantastic damage parses compared to (only) great healing parses but it certainly felt a little meh, especially with the forced 20-man group.

So when I first heard about Legion making us go back to being a heal-through-damage healer, I was overjoyed. But the bitter reality was that it was clunky, incredibly susceptible to even the smallest mistakes (fat-fingering plea at 6+ stacks, yay) and it lacked the one thing I loved: Saving people's asses aka strong spot-healing. MoP was all about being this super versatile power-house while WoD was (for me) about softening raidwide damage and saving that guy who dropped to 5%, would die from any tick and would be safe in my shield until a 'proper' healer healed him up again. Playing Archimonde(M) as Disc meant soaking that fire so often that I could do it while slurping a drink and watching stuff on another screen without ever needing to worry about myself, but as soon as prepatch hit I required self-CDs or externals.

(I also hate all but one weapon appearance.)

I would have liked a talent tier taken out of HPally's book (my rerolled main) that enables us to choose which niche we want. For example Talent A restricting us to 2-3 Atonements but buffing their effectiveness (and uptime, to the point of them being Disc-Beacons) to let us become good tank-healers (thus making something like Shadow Covenant viable as our groupheal), Talent B giving fixed 5 Atonements with medium-sized uptime and shenanigans for dungeon content and Talent C increasing the ability to keep up large numbers of Atonements for raiding.
I would have liked an option to do damage without spending mana like every other healer has. I hate being forced to do nothing to be able to heal later on. A 'holy' smite with medium damage, heal and mana cost and a 'shadow' smite with medium damage, no atonement transferred, the tiny absorb mechanic and no mana cost; that would have been something I'd like.

Edit: Fixed some typos.

[lifebinderx]

Disc community turned into very sensitive snowflakes who does not wanna see how broken the game mechanic for the class is but instead aquising others as shit or being bad player. EVERYONE can play disc, it is not rocket science. Follow ur raid frames showing attonement, turn on DBM and weak auras to indicate big damage incoming, ask for a free mana CD from a collegue to spread attonement moar and bam! U got this. What a paladin does? Prepot, open ur wings and hit like a mindless zombie. Put beacon on tanks and spam heal.Bam! U doubled both hps and dps of that super skilled disc. U as a pally also bring a RAIDWIDE damage reduction not limited to an area. Immunities help you to skip mechanics, you have better movement and mobility tools etc... But wait disc player puts more effort to do the half of it , disc player is more skilled. Community replies : "WHO gives a F.CK"

[MendUS]

Disc community turned into very sensitive snowflakes who does not wanna see how broken the game mechanic for the class is but instead aquising others as shit or being bad player. EVERYONE can play disc, it is not rocket science. Follow ur raid frames showing attonement, turn on DBM and weak auras to indicate big damage incoming, ask for a free mana CD from a collegue to spread attonement moar and bam! U got this. What a paladin does? Prepot, open ur wings and hit like a mindless zombie. Put beacon on tanks and spam heal.Bam! U doubled both hps and dps of that super skilled disc. U as a pally also bring a RAIDWIDE damage reduction not limited to an area. Immunities help you to skip mechanics, you have better movement and mobility tools etc... But wait disc player puts more effort to do the half of it , disc player is more skilled. Community replies : "WHO gives a F.CK"

I like how you call people snowflakes when you're the one who got offended... interesting argument, sir.

[Heathy]

i'm enjoying it now that i have 2 legendaries that work for both specs, i play holy extremely well but disc is very fun to play, I think my stat balance for both specs is at a place i'm happy with. so it doesn't matter which spec i am now holy or disc, the only real difference is that as holy maintaining 400-600k hps isn't that difficult where as disc can do more than that but only during burst its not easy to maintain 300k+ hps. you spike over that but that is just it, its spike every so often.

as holy i use prydaz and the res cloak and as disc its prydaz and velen's because the spec overheals something crazy. for me its holy = ezmode and disc = challenging but more fun to play.

one thing i think ppl fail to realise is that atonement breaks the 40 yard healing range rule, which is an interesting niche, if someone moves out of range for a targeted heal, if they have atonement they will get heals from damage still. that is something other healers don't really get.

[smitey]

Disc community turned into very sensitive snowflakes who does not wanna see how broken the game mechanic for the class is but instead aquising others as shit or being bad player. EVERYONE can play disc, it is not rocket science. Follow ur raid frames showing attonement, turn on DBM and weak auras to indicate big damage incoming, ask for a free mana CD from a collegue to spread attonement moar and bam! U got this. What a paladin does? Prepot, open ur wings and hit like a mindless zombie. Put beacon on tanks and spam heal.Bam! U doubled both hps and dps of that super skilled disc. U as a pally also bring a RAIDWIDE damage reduction not limited to an area. Immunities help you to skip mechanics, you have better movement and mobility tools etc... But wait disc player puts more effort to do the half of it , disc player is more skilled. Community replies : "WHO gives a F.CK"

But what if I have to move during the 10 sec atonement spreading? What if I miscalculated and mistimed the healing required at that exact damage period and there was not much to heal but I already had my atonement out? What if other healers are top tier and top everyone up before I get my damage in? What if I have my atonements out but have to run away from the boss/raid? Guess I lose 300 HPS in any of those scenarios, but hey DISC is EASY. Its also easy to simplify ANY class.

The Atonement mechanic has a major downside due to having to invest the ridiculous amount of Mana/Time in it way ahead of the damage which many things can interrupt this cycle.