Spellblade Aluriel Nerf

[Grimnakh]

There's your problem. It should be for the masses. The masses pay the bills. It's high time to stop catering to small and insignificant parts of the playerbase.

People who are more skilled and have more time put in are completly irrelevant in comparison to the masses, so don't give me that.

The masses want something to aspire to. I havent killed any mythic NH bosses, but Indont want them nerfed until my crz raid could do it if we all transferred to the same server. There should be a difficulty curve within the raid thats a bit smoother than it seems to be. These nerfs combined with player's continued progression seem like a good change toward that. Personally I hope they never nerf elisande or guldan outside new content giving us more trait levels and easier gear.

[Aphrel]

Only the fight didn't become easier the boss HP was lowered while its damage was increase. The overall boss damage output increased a shitom, after the changes you are unable to do it with 2 healers cause you' d just not have enought HPS (which is waht Blizzard wanted), so the DPS check got lowered while the heal check increased, its a remodeling of the figth not a nerf. Some ppl will find it easier, some harder, it depends on what players you have/quality of your healers etc.

We found it easier, considerably easier. The new dps check is a joke and the healing is easier with 3 healers now than it was with 2 healers be4 the nerf.

[Marrilaife]

My guild went for alurielle as 4th boss because we didnt have enough players (dps players) to go for krosus. The fact the boss is smack there in the middle, one might think it is one of the next group of bosses to tackle. This group is krosus / alurielle / tich / botanist. I and many others I guess expected a difficulty to go crescendo.

3 easy bosses
4 medium to hard bosses
rest hard to real hard bosses.


in the pool of 4 I feel, and I might be wrong, that blizzard made them harder than necessary. They should have lowered the difficulty there. the side issue is that this skewed difficulty progression has cost them many players. I dont know if anyone noticed by many guilds folded and many players quit, yet again.

lack of progress is not a good thing for anyone.

My guild went Botanist first and after finally killing Aluriel this week post nerf putting us at 6 mythic I must admit it wasn't that the boss was inherently so challenging (we had few good tries pre nerf as well, if it wasn't our 3rd from the "big 4" we could've killed it pre-nerf), the biggest challenges we faced were:

- roster boss, we had 5 people quit from burnout / lost interest within less than 2 weeks span, that completely ruined our progress, but we're on the way to recover, grabbed a few people from broken 3/10m - 4/10m guilds (it isn't easy on them either)

- hey guys do we have 5 healers online for this raid? that part sucked the most, we're a casual guild where people don't nolife AP farm, so we have very few people who actually have well-fleshed offspec artifacts, healers were already grumbling 2 out of 5 are bench warming for krosus because even if they could play an offspec, they aren't as efficient in it as benching them for a mainspec dps, so their motivation to actually log for every raid dwindled, it's kinda the same level of design rubbish as some fights in this expansion requiring 3 tanks (elerethe, cenarius, few more bosses having 3-tank strats but these not being predominant) and some 1 (at least they nerfed Guarm, I wonder if the Augur 1-tank strat survives).

This would be semi-acceptable in an expansion where playing offspecs was well supported, which Legion definitely isn't.

It was even more of a roster puzzle when some bosses were "optimal" to be 2-healed, but that got nerfed luckily.

What kind of roster puzzle is it anyway to make offspecs semi-unviable and then make bosses require between 3(2)-5 healers, 1-3 tanks and also at least specific amount of range dps while melee being much stronger on others to the point you might want to stack them?

Is every mythic guild supposed to be a split-running one with tons of alts for every occasion? Or one with 40 players in a roster where each time you bench half? For most players, except the most hardcore of the hardcore, this absolutely saps the fun out of the game. Mythic is supposed to be tuned for "the few rather than the many" but is that "few" around the level of 50-100 world top guilds that can field perfect or near-perfect setup for every fight?

Reminds me of Krosus discussion few weeks ago where people said "well we killed Krosus mythic no problem, we just benched all our fire mages for demon hunters", thing is many middle of the pack mythic guilds do not have wide bench or players with multiple maxed artifacts who can easily spec-swap on a whim (and even then, they probably won't have good supporting legendaries for that offspecs).

The upper echelon of "semi-hardcore" mythic guilds (the no-split-run no-nolife type) didn't face these problems, because they had enough skill to overcome shortcomings of their setup, but the rest faces not only the problem of even a slight skill shortage, but also lack of big gear upgrades to help, and lack of ways to get out of "bad raid comp" box.

If people are severely underskilled (like constantly dying to beam on Krosus after 100 pulls and whatnot), then yeah, they will be stuck at 3/10 mythic for a long time, until new traits or even TOS raid gear allows them to brute force it, but I mean in the situation where you lack just a bit, there's very little help from Blizzard towards these guilds. Maybe the 7.2 traits will help, we'll see.

The biggest issue with mythic raiding I see atm is the extreme gutting of offspecs / alts combined with crazy variance in "preferred comp" for each boss and combined with lack of big gear upgrades from farming early mythic to help you overcome lack of preferred comp or alts / offspecs to plug the gaps in the comp.

That always leaves me to wonder, does Blizzard even play their own game? Do they test the raids or process feedback from the conducted raid tests? I've seen some blatant disconnect between the class design team and encounter design team in the past, but Legion takes the cake in the department.

[kamuimac]

You don't get it, you're looking at it as purely a business. Fact is, people at Blizzard have said, they design their game how they want it to be, if people stopped subbing, it would suck but they wouldn't go against their beliefs.

Who gives a shit if the masses pay the bills, if the game you make is no longer good? All content being easy.. that's what you want, and that's the joke here.

The game is an MMO, and already caters to the masses plenty, it just has an extra difficulty added on for the better players. You're heavily catered to already. Mythic is just the bonus for players who aren't shit.

investors and CEOs - devs are just drones who have nothing to say only follow orders from above and bring as much profit to investors as they can - you clearly have no idea how corporation works

this pr bs about "going against their beliefs" is nothing but marketing - they have nothing to say as long as they want to keep their jobs.

[Deleted]

Hi,
We are hopefully killing Krosus on Wed. We had a few nights of progress on botanist already, which on the surface seems like the obvious choice – but the nerfs to spellblade intrests me. I am wondering, if it’s a easy kill to snatch after krosus. We should have the option to 5 heal it which should reduce the difficulty even more.
Is there anyone who can provide logs of post nerf progress, so I can try to verify if going spellblade after krosus would be the right choice for us?
From my understanding, if your tanks understand the fel soul, you can manage marks in p1 (10-11 stacks (4 on first set of replicates)), and able to clump the arcane adds up – the boss should be a easy kill. Obviously the frost marks were nasty, but I was wondering with 5 healers and the reduced dmg would make it easily doable.

[Isadora]

Hi,
We are hopefully killing Krosus on Wed. We had a few nights of progress on botanist already, which on the surface seems like the obvious choice – but the nerfs to spellblade intrests me. I am wondering, if it’s a easy kill to snatch after krosus. We should have the option to 5 heal it which should reduce the difficulty even more.
Is there anyone who can provide logs of post nerf progress, so I can try to verify if going spellblade after krosus would be the right choice for us?
From my understanding, if your tanks understand the fel soul, you can manage marks in p1 (10-11 stacks (4 on first set of replicates)), and able to clump the arcane adds up – the boss should be a easy kill. Obviously the frost marks were nasty, but I was wondering with 5 healers and the reduced dmg would make it easily doable.

Can't provide a log unfortunately, but with 5 healers the boss is really quite easy by now. The frost damage was nerfed considerably and imo it was the biggest part of what made the fight hard (except for the tanking). With the reduced damage you'll be fine if you bring 5 healers.

Don't worry about the arcane adds btw., if you do the arcane phase correctly they will die in no time. They are by far the easiest adds to kill.

[Deleted]

Can't provide a log unfortunately, but with 5 healers the boss is really quite easy by now. The frost damage was nerfed considerably and imo it was the biggest part of what made the fight hard (except for the tanking). With the reduced damage you'll be fine if you bring 5 healers.

Don't worry about the arcane adds btw., if you do the arcane phase correctly they will die in no time. They are by far the easiest adds to kill.

Super I meant the clumping of the adds needed to be done properly. I also suppose it is important to do healing cds. @ detonate frost, as well as the transition from frost->fire. I still would love some logs if anyone is able to provide them!

[Isadora]

Super I meant the clumping of the adds needed to be done properly. I also suppose it is important to do healing cds. @ detonate frost, as well as the transition from frost->fire. I still would love some logs if anyone is able to provide them!

I actually found our (pretty terrible) second kill: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...5&type=summary (I hope I can post the link).

We usually use some cds for the fire adds iirc, because if they don't get interrupted correctly they are really dangerous. And yeah, we use externals on the Fel Soul tank for one of the lashes during the phase and 2-3 cooldowns for the insane aoe damage during that phase.

[Halobob87]

Are people still complaining about alluriel nerf? It was a bit overtuned, but the main problem is that the first 3 bosses are a joke, exp Trillax.

[Deleted]

There's your problem. It should be for the masses. The masses pay the bills. It's high time to stop catering to small and insignificant parts of the playerbase.

People who are more skilled and have more time put in are completly irrelevant in comparison to the masses, so don't give me that.

The masses already get LFR, nhc and HC. There is more then enough room for a wide variety of players.

But mythic is one aspect of the game that is not for the masses, yet still somewhat important even for them. It gives those people from the HC crowd who want to push it something to aspire to. And its actually quite important that there is something you haven't done and can progress to for everyone. For people who only do LFR, its a step up to join an organized group to do nhc. For those who do nhc, its a step up to get their shit together and do HC. And for those in HC there is always this final push to get 20 people to start mythic. and for those who do mythic there is the push to get to the end boss and then finalyl kill it.

There is something for everyone, and there is something for everyone to aspire to - even for the few who do WF progress.


If you removed mythic, you would gut an important aspect of the game wihout getting much in return. The masses don't get anything out of it, but ou take away the supreme challenge for those who want to try that.


Mythic (or former heroic) raiding is important for bnding. I am not curently doing mythic raids (but will in the forseeable future), so I am currently in the crowd of the masses who only do nhc/hc. But I wouldn't be if it wasn't for the connections forged during HC raiding back in the days.

[Dracodraco]

We found it easier, considerably easier. The new dps check is a joke and the healing is easier with 3 healers now than it was with 2 healers be4 the nerf.

Augur I can somewhat agree to. Only having to do 2x conjunctions in fel phase made progressing that significantly easier, and obviously P3 wasn't a mad dash to the finish line before you got blown up by adds - initial frost progress suffered a lot of random deaths tho.

That being said, I don't think Elisande can qualify as a "nerf", considering her DPS check was never really that hard to begin with unless you wanted to skip specific rings - and right now the go-to strat is to push P1 in ~1:55 seconds before third set of rings go out, so she doesn't cast them in subesequent phases. This is a difficult check to meet using 4x healers - but P2/3's checks are a joke in comparison when you've got a wave of rings less to deal with. IDK if P2/3 checks would be significantly harder with the extra ring set, but it's possible I guess.

[Carmion]

So for a 3/10m guild looking for a 4th boss, Aluriel would now be the logical choice, right?

What would you say how many healers for a non-farm group, having to learn the boss from scratch?

TY

[Nitros14]

So for a 3/10m guild looking for a 4th boss, Aluriel would now be the logical choice, right?

What would you say how many healers for a non-farm group, having to learn the boss from scratch?

TY

We just got Aluriel down recently and we're 5/10M now (Krosus dead, worked on Botanist before the Aluriel nerf, went and killed her after the nerf)

Aluriel is easier than she was but I think she was harder than Botanist or Krosus before the nerf so she's more similar to them now.

Aluriel is still very hard compared to the first three. If you're anything like us Mark of Frost will take a lot of learning to perfect and the encounter is pretty unforgiving of mistakes. Fire and arcane phases will take some learning too, not as much as frost though.

Krosus is much simpler to learn, assign soakers to parts of the platform and get adds soaked properly and you've learned Krosus. Just a matter of sorting healer cooldowns and getting the dps you need from there.

It also depends on your healers, Krosus is a 3-heal fight and Aluriel is (for us anyway) a 5-healer fight.

Krosus is, I think, the easier fight if you have the dps to kill him. And dps is easier to come by now post-patch.