Mass burnout.

[Deja Thoris]

Now you're gonna pretend it wasn't you who created these threads?
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...abject-failure
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...f-the-game-atm

I adapted, your point? Don't have to agree with all changes but complaining about class changes is like complaining the weather is different today then it was yesterday.

[Grimnakh]

If I still played the game I wouldn't need to be carried.

And that's pretty rich coming from someone who doesn't even set foot in Mythic raids.

I used to do end game raiding, quit my mythic guild after WoD because I just didnt find them fun to play with/all they wanted to do was raid night and nothing else. Now I cross realm with people that are easy going, I'm the top healer in the raid group, have pugged 15s and herioc NH clears for 2 months and Im fine with that. Having a good time playing the game and not whining about why my failures are the games fault. And there you go, you dont even play the game because you cant get carried anymore. What a joke.

- - - Updated - - -

So basically you don't want better players who are doing harder content to have better loot. Get over your jealousy issues and learn your place... you are a mediocre player and should get mediocre loot. You clearly have psychological issues get some help man.

I do want them to get better loot, and they do. If you knew the math you'd understand that. Mythic raiders get it faster, much faster, as long as they keep playing theyll be far ahead of people not doing mythic raiding. What I dont want is an impenetrable wall that hard stops all progression once you have all the loot you need from a given difficulty. WF/TF elegantly solves that issue while retaining the elite rewards for the highest content completion crowd.

[DeusX]

My guild (3/10M) finally dropped the ball. The RL + 3 highly geared members went off. I dropped out the main team 2.5 months ago, now it seems the mythic adventure is over for the entire crew. All that grind in the past plus the upcoming, even bigger, grind just had to have an impact on people's morale. Recruting so many people and hoping they are stable looks hard for the guys left in charge. /rip

[Deleted]

You just dont like the idea because it requires all 5 to be good players. You prefer 20 man content where everyone else can carry your mediocrity through it.

You can carry less than good players through M+, too. There is a reason that even +15's (and higher) are boostable even with hard affixes. Of course, M+ can scale up to a point where it becomes technically more challenging than a mythic boss. But that's okay, because it is much easier to find 5 players on the same high level than 20. And even if players are "equally" skilled, 20 people will always make more mistakes than 5. Imagine Star Augur mythic mechanics on a 5-player boss, it would be a joke. This has to be accounted for.

I mean, of course the best 5 players of my raid are a much better 5-man group than the worst 5. That's just simple logic.

As for your attempted personal slight towards me: I couldn't care less about your opinion on that matter. Somehow I am the only player on our roster to have been present for every single progression pull

[Nehezbegar]

Ye, i stopped raiding too. Too much of a fuss to keep up with traits grind etc.

Instead of quitting i just play fresh alliance toon and enjoy the game once more, since i have never played an alliance character for all this years . I think i will just hang raiding for good, maybe stay at normal pug level.

[navai]

It's probably a good thing that people dont just live on the game anymore.

I used to raid hardcore and have chose not to, I dont play WoW as much as most people and I dont live by a schedule, but because of this i'm still able to enjoy the game I played almost endlessly expansions ago, without the same level of effort.

Granted i'll always be lower than other people in terms of progress both raidwise and just general character wise.

Maybe i'm opening myself up to attack by people who play the game a significant amount and id definetely not bash on that approach, people put in what they want, but I like the fact that i'm able to access things now I wouldnt have been able to in the past without having to put in the amount of effort that some people do choose.

[Deleted]

Gear lottery is only bearable if you don't run organised endgame content at all. If you do, then the unpredictable nature of upgrades is quite detrimental to any kind of planned progress.

[sykke]

I still play but a lot less than before. My problem has mainly been gear, I don't like titanforging at all. It makes progress feel boring. My guild is clearing heroic NH atm and it's really annoying when gear drops that is a downgrade for me because of titanforged gear from lower difficulties.

[ihyln]

thats the problem blizzard cant find a way to satisfy everyone WoD allmost nothing to do Legion opposite case ...idk i think its fine how it is atm you are not forced to do all but peopel force themself ...control yourself.
Only top 10 guilds are a littel bit fucked with this system but casuals not in the end its our own fault ^.-

massive AP grinds and the same boring set of repeatable daily quests turn people off because it's not content? who knew!

the great thing about wow over the last few expansions was being able to play other classes and progress. here, you are locked down so hard playing alts because of AP and legendary RNG is basically a non starter.

maybe next expansion they'll fix it

[sifting]

while everyone else is burning out my casual guild finally cleared nh on heroic
play this game in moderation and have fun with your friends
if you treat this game like a job you will hate it

[Deleted]

while everyone else is burning out my casual guild finally cleared nh on heroic
play this game in moderation and have fun with your friends
if you treat this game like a job you will hate it

But I am honest... where is the fun when you have take your preformance seriously and someone in the casual guild says.. fuck it.. its causal..
A game should not feel like a job... that where you are 100% right.. but when you want to raid mythic on a more or less competitive level it gets like a job.
As an example: I love mythic raiding but my job "forces" me to work 70h+ a week (and its fun for me)... therefore I don`t have the time to grind AP like nothing else... this takes away the fun for me.... however I still want to raid mythic.. so what do I do? Farm AP next as much as I can...
Is this the purpose of a game? not really

[xpose]

but people enjoy that vanilla experience remember

[potis]

Yeah i got burnt out around 2 months ago, thats why i stopped grinding, i have barely done 3-5 M+ since early December, stopped grinding AP since i got my Fury to 54.

I cant bring myself to log in and farm AP for the new traits, i really cant be bothered.

I am in a casual guild barely raiding etc etc and most have stopped logging on pretty much after they realized that they have to grind AP to perform even in NH HC (30-40 year olds with kids and barely 35 points in weapon, raid loggers literally).

Its not surprising that people quit, raiding is fun, grinding AP to raid is not fun.

[Dekkers]

but people enjoy that vanilla experience remember

Yes. You could complete your character in Vanilla. There was an end to the grind. It was far superior to what we have now.

[Kagitsume]

First of all forgive me for my english. I am a guild master of one semihardcore guild. I am following MMO everyday but i decided to sign up for this post.

We started to Legion 25 man. It was fine at start 20+5 man for mythic raiding and we recruited 8-9 people since legion start for raiding. Nobody left our guild nobody kicked they are all our friends but we are not able to mythic raid anymore because we can make it to 20. I have to push people to make it 18-17 so we can find some pugs from our server. People are just quitting the game because they don't like it they don't wanna play it anymore. I have my reasons for that.

1) Grind system for AP farm ( even worse now with nethershards)
2) Unjust Legendary system.
3) Unlogical changes for specs and classes.

I wanna talk about them some. This whole system is making this game RNG base. Years ago even in Pandaria we always we heard this questions. '' What is the best class'' , ''What is the best spec'' and we were answering these questions like '' There is no best class or spec there are best players always''. I can say honestly we can't answer these questions like before. We must say to these people '' Pray for bis legendary, grind your ap and pray to blizzard for like your spec''

I just wanna give an example for unjust legendary system. I have 3 balance druid in my guild. One of them really good and hardcore. One of them is really between social and raider ranks. One of them is social. After legion start our social balance dropped his legendary ring. He was the first person who got legendary at our guild. Our midcore balance druid just dropped his ring yesterday. Our hardcore balance player has 7 legendary he is farming like a hell. He is doing everything he can but still don't have it. Ofc he will drop it oneday but someonca can tell me where the hell is the justice for these months he spend?

At the end. There are a lot of people tired of this nonrewarding and unjust system. They just don't wanna see idiotic drops from LFR which they can't drop from mythic. Bis legendary drops to casuals which hardcores not got it and accept it sometimes really good but %90 idiotic class+spec changes...

Actually fault is ours because we are still playing... We should quit like them if we are not happy...

[Deleted]

while everyone else is burning out my casual guild finally cleared nh on heroic
play this game in moderation and have fun with your friends
if you treat this game like a job you will hate it

Well said to not treat game as a job. People that have too much free time are burning out.

[Deleted]

Yeah i got burnt out around 2 months ago, thats why i stopped grinding, i have barely done 3-5 M+ since early December, stopped grinding AP since i got my Fury to 54.

I cant bring myself to log in and farm AP for the new traits, i really cant be bothered.

I am in a casual guild barely raiding etc etc and most have stopped logging on pretty much after they realized that they have to grind AP to perform even in NH HC (30-40 year olds with kids and barely 35 points in weapon, raid loggers literally).

Its not surprising that people quit, raiding is fun, grinding AP to raid is not fun.

You are playing in a Casual guild that is "barely raiding" and you are worrying about the AP grind?
Really? Like really?

This is an issue with the player, not with the game.
The only people that could get burn out are the top 5/10/20 guilds that need every single little bit of AP as fast s possible to get world first.
Everyone else just needs to put on their big boy/girl pants and learn to play how they want.

I am in a mythic guild my self and I farmed the 54 because I wanted to and enjoyed it, there are people that didn't.
Nothing changed.

[kamuimac]

But I am honest... where is the fun when you have take your preformance seriously and someone in the casual guild says.. fuck it.. its causal..
A game should not feel like a job... that where you are 100% right.. but when you want to raid mythic on a more or less competitive level it gets like a job.
As an example: I love mythic raiding but my job "forces" me to work 70h+ a week (and its fun for me)... therefore I don`t have the time to grind AP like nothing else... this takes away the fun for me.... however I still want to raid mythic.. so what do I do? Farm AP next as much as I can...
Is this the purpose of a game? not really

and why is it blizzard problem that you have so much real life obligations ? time to grow up and realise what is importnat in life - hint mythic raiding isnt.

[Ammanas]

while everyone else is burning out my casual guild finally cleared nh on heroic
play this game in moderation and have fun with your friends
if you treat this game like a job you will hate it

People don't understand that for a lot of players we play the game to compete. I have played since Vanilla and I do not and never have cared even remotely about the lore, achievements, pets, or anything else. Blizzard puts them in the game because people like them so great but I will never do any of this content.

The ONLY thing that keeps me playing is high end PvE and PvP competition. And yes, it is still a competition when you aren't in Method and have 0% chance of world first. I do have a job and can not play 7 days, but I am still in the highest level of guild I can be with the time commitment I want to make which is Top 25 world. At this level of play the AP grind is mandatory, it simply has to be or you will not be competitive with other guilds at this level.

Regardless of any of that, even if for some reason I was raiding in a casual guild I would still feel obligated to do the AP grind. Trying to play as well as I possibly can and get every .01% performance out of my character in raid is what makes this game enjoyable. Doing this for multiple classes is what keeps highend raiding fun for me.

So yeah, this whole argument doesn't work for some of us. To play the game the way that we enjoy it we have to go crazy grinding with the way Legion has been implemented. If you can raid in a casual guild and have fun just seeing the content, being social, doing pet battles or whatever else then great but for me its either push and compete as much as I can or quit the game.

Just thought I'd try to shed some light, there actually are people that enjoy competitive PvE outside of the top 5 world guilds. And guilds at my raiding level have been dying at an absurd rate this expansion. I'm someone that doesn't guild hop and raided in 2 guilds total for like 9 years before Legion, I've been in three different guilds in the past 5 months because higher end raiders are quitting the game at a very high rate.

To give Blizzard some credit the legendary issue which was even worse than AP for the past two tiers is at least mostly fixed now. Most of us have played enough to have 8+ for primary spec and the balance is reasonable now, and the spec specific change was very good. It should have been like this from launch though, and pure classes still get completely fucked on AP for no reason. There is literally 0 reason that AP couldn't be shared between specs.

[NoShelter]

This patch turned mythic raiding into a full time job. I'm playing 6+ hours a day and feel like im falling behind.