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  1. #121
    I wonder what the male to female ratio in this thread is.

  2. #122
    Basically there is a spectrum on the complexity of social interaction and copulation as seen below.


    l---A-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Z---l

    Everything to the left of A is rape, and everything to the right of Z is a signed and documented consent form of all the possible sexual acts with check boxes, fill in the blank safe words. This has to be notarized of course the day before the act is to take place.

    To any rational person this is normal, and everything between those two extremities on the spectrum is just the confusing world of sexual interaction.

    Tennisace and other feminists are trying to tell you that the below spectrum is the correct one. Where everything to the left of A is rape.

    l----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------A-Z---l

    They are obviously insane. Ignore them.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonpartyfan View Post
    What? So one person mentioning those things means the culture exists? That is completely asinine.
    I didn't say "one person", did I? If there's any thread of people supporting that view, the concept exists in that region. It doesn't matter if they're a minority; they still exist and still hold those views.


  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    It doesn't have to be expressed by literally everyone for it to exist.

    Fact is, people are making arguments that attempt to normalize certain types of assault. Even in this thread. I really don't see the point in pretending otherwise.

    Are you under the mistaken impression that cultures are nationally homogenous or something? Any thread within a population that expresses these kinds of views means there's a "rape culture" in that population. It may not be as extreme as that in another region, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
    "Rape culture is a sociological concept used to describe a setting in which rape is pervasive and normalized due to societal attitudes about gender and sexuality."

    Societal attitudes. Some individuals holding some opinions does not constitute societal attitudes. As a society we shun rape.

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Again, to repeat the point, "rape culture" isn't ever about saying "rape is awesome". It's about saying "no bruh, what I did wasn't rape, because *reasons*." It's about feeling you were allowed/entitled/justified in taking advantage of them in that way.
    This has nothing whatsoever to do with my counterargument.

    Whether people think it's awesome or acceptable has nothing to do with it. Fact is that there is no general consensus in the US, in any state or even small community, that rape is okay. To the extent that there is, they are extremely small, hidden pockets of criminals. The way to solve that, of course, is to enforce the law.

    The law is a reflection of our culture. The law states that rape is illegal. This is not being opposed at all because everyone agrees rape is bad. When virtually everyone shares an opinion, that's culture. Fact is, a HUGE majority of Americans think rape is one of the most horrible thing you can do. Ergo, it's not a rape culture.

  6. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Ishayu View Post
    Oh. OH! Lemme try that logic, too.

    I found a murder, someone else thought it was OK. Murder culture spotted. Let's generalize to 300 million people.

    Got it. US is a murder culture. In fact it's an everything culture.

    ... do you even know what culture means?
    Ehhh... That's how some people see the US. With your gun fetishes and all.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Njorun View Post
    "Rape culture is a sociological concept used to describe a setting in which rape is pervasive and normalized due to societal attitudes about gender and sexuality."

    Societal attitudes. Some individuals holding some opinions does not constitute societal attitudes. As a society we shun rape.
    "Some individuals holding some opinions" is "societal attitudes". If it's a bunch of frat guys who like to get girls drunk and assault them, that's a "rape culture", even if it's just the several dozen frat guys in that one frat house.

    And to repeat a point for the third time, everyone agrees that "rape is bad". The issue is a lot of people who look at actions that are defined as "rape", and saying "nah, that stuff's totes okay and I don't think it should be considered 'rape' at all." That's what "normalizing" looks like.


  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    "Some individuals holding some opinions" is "societal attitudes".
    No, it isn't.

  9. #129
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    The US is really chasing a ghost here. They are seeing a problem where these is none. Rape culture? Nobody had heard this term a year or two ago, and suddenly it's a gigantic problem to the country? Please.

    Shouldn't they be trying to address real problems?

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    You realize there's people in this very thread complaining that the definition of "rape" is "too broad" because they feel that certain types of what we define as rape are "normal" and shouldn't be so labelled, right?

    Rape culture isn't expressed by saying "rape is awesome!" It's expressed by arguing that it wasn't "rape" to begin with.
    I havent seen anyone saying this.

    The term rape is clearly defined in any dictionary. Many people on this thread have issues with those who are trying to rewrite the definition ie the regressive SJWs. Those people who think that kissing or even touching is rape, even conversing is rape to some of these people.

    The issue is the term "rape culture" because a culture explicity means that which is ACCEPTED by said culture. And nobody thinks rape is acceptable.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishayu View Post
    This has nothing whatsoever to do with my counterargument.

    Whether people think it's awesome or acceptable has nothing to do with it. Fact is that there is no general consensus in the US, in any state or even small community, that rape is okay. To the extent that there is, they are extremely small, hidden pockets of criminals. The way to solve that, of course, is to enforce the law.

    The law is a reflection of our culture. The law states that rape is illegal. This is not being opposed. Fact is, a HUGE majority of Americans think rape is one of the most horrible thing you can do. Ergo, it's not a rape culture.
    It's exactly why your counterargument is wrong.

    If we passed a law saying that assaults that occurred on Wednesdays and Saturdays could not be considered "rape", then a girl getting dragged into the bushes by a masked stranger and taken against her will, on a Wednesday, wasn't raped. Even if the same act, on a Tuesday, would have been called rape.

    Rape culture, as a concept, isn't about thinking rape is "okay". It's about dismissing claims and saying "that's not rape". Any argument based on their clothing inviting the assault counts as such. Blaming her for getting so drunk she could be taken advantage of fits the bill. Defending date rape where she doesn't fight back hard enough for you to be "convinced" she wasn't consenting. Etc. It's about looking at a situation that others call "rape", and saying "no, that's normal".


  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    The US is really chasing a ghost here. They are seeing a problem where these is none. Rape culture? Nobody had heard this term a year or two ago, and suddenly it's a gigantic problem to the country? Please.

    Shouldn't they be trying to address real problems?
    People want to be professional victims. It's shit like this that discredits real victims of rape. I feel sorry for ANYONE who has been raped and they see stupid stories like this.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Again, to repeat the point, "rape culture" isn't ever about saying "rape is awesome". It's about saying "no bruh, what I did wasn't rape, because *reasons*." It's about feeling you were allowed/entitled/justified in taking advantage of them in that way.
    As i already said *sigh* this is also bullshit.

    The fact is that drunken sex IS NOT RAPE.

    Never is and never will be.

    Therefore nobody raped anyone ffs.

    Therefore nobody is normalising rape.

    It really is that fukking simple.

  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by LMuhlen View Post
    Ehhh... That's how some people see the US. With your gun fetishes and all.
    At the risk of going a little offtopic, the "gun fetish" is basically conservatives saying that they're worried about tyrannical governments combined with the argument that it doesn't increase violent crime, which evidence indeed suggests it doesn't. Indeed, black communities in the US generally have less gun but commit more crime, and just look at Venezuela, which is full of violent crime but guns are outlawed.

    I'm not going to stand here and preach about what causes violent crime, because I honestly don't know, but there's a pretty bad correlation between violent crime and gun ownership.

  15. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endemonadia View Post
    As i already said *sigh* this is also bullshit.

    The fact is that drunken sex IS NOT RAPE.

    Never is and never will be.

    Therefore nobody raped anyone ffs.

    Therefore nobody is normalising rape.

    It really is that fukking simple.
    Intoxication, in many places, is firm grounds for establishing a lack of consent. Just by way of example; https://www.justia.com/criminal/docs...1000/1002.html

    You trying to redefine those facts and pretend that this kind of rape is "okay" is exactly what "rape culture" looks like.


  16. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ishayu View Post
    I'm not going to stand here and preach about what causes violent crime, because I honestly don't know, but there's a pretty bad correlation between violent crime and gun ownership.
    Poor impulse control and inability to manage anger, enjoying hurting others, bad upbringing, punishment for disobeying in the criminal world and so on.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Intoxication, in many places, is firm grounds for establishing a lack of consent. Just by way of example; https://www.justia.com/criminal/docs...1000/1002.html

    You trying to redefine those facts and pretend that this kind of rape is "okay" is exactly what "rape culture" looks like.
    No, you have to be pretty much incapable of caring for yourself in Sweden for it to be rape if you're intoxicated. Me having some drinks with someone doesn't make it rape if we have sex later. Just being intoxicated is not enough for it to be considered rape in our laws.

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Endemonadia View Post
    As i already said *sigh* this is also bullshit.

    The fact is that drunken sex IS NOT RAPE.

    Never is and never will be.

    Therefore nobody raped anyone ffs.

    Therefore nobody is normalising rape.

    It really is that fukking simple.
    Funny... You are the proof that rape culture exists for someone who considers drunken sex as rape (possibly, depending on the alignment of the stars and other uncontrollable parameters such as if the woman will regret it later).

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by TheWalkinDude View Post
    Tell that to the 14 year old outside Baltimore. But yes, rape culture isn't an issue in America by its legal citizens. Just from those who come from 3rd world peasant cultures.
    https://youtu.be/HnCW6Rsv-F4
    There is no rape culture in US/Canada.

  19. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Njorun View Post
    Rape culture doesn't exist in any western country. Rapists are so few and are socially shunned.

    "Rape culture is a sociological concept used to describe a setting in which rape is pervasive and normalized due to societal attitudes about gender and sexuality"
    I disagree.

    The first thing to understand is that rape has no singular, universally accepted definition. It comes in many forms, some of which are far more brutal and explicit than others. What they all share in common though is that some form of sexual penetration occurs, to which one of the parties does not consent.

    Secondly when people talk about "rape culture" it's not just about what you, Njorun, understand as rape. It's about the collective sum of acts which meet the criterion of being unwanted sexual acts performed by one person on another who does not consent to it. Rape culture can include things that don't actually meet the definition of rape, but share similar characteristics with rape (namely being sexual in nature and non-consensual): Eg groping a woman's breast, a man's testicles, or someone's ass without consent.

    The reason the term "rape culture" is used is that in western countries we like to ignore or justify or simply outright deny the existence of the "less severe" forms of sexual misconduct. Just because you don't have gangs of men accosting women and then physically forcing themselves on them doesn't mean that there aren't other, more subtle, forms of rape going on.

    And I can fully and whole heartedly agree that the kind of "rape culture" that exists in western countries is nothing like the kind of "rape culture" that exists within certain communities in a country like my own. But just because it's less severe, doesn't make it ok. And just because a bunch of MRA types form circle jerks on the internet denying its existence doesn't mean it isn't there. A big part of the problem with western culture and admitting the existence of their rape cultures is to look at the kind of war-crime type of rapes that happen in the third world countries, and assume that because you don't have the same stuff going on, that everything is fine.

    But yes, I do understand. It's a lot easier to deny the existence of the problem than to own up to the fact that it exists. It's easier to dismiss victims and their sympathisers as feminists, SJWs and stupid people who should have been more careful, than to deal with those who perpetrated the harm. The irony of course is that denial of rape culture is actually part of rape culture, and by acknowledging its existence, you are actually helping to make it go away.

  20. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMuhlen View Post
    Funny... You are the proof that rape culture exists for someone who considers drunken sex as rape (possibly, depending on the alignment of the stars and other uncontrollable parameters such as if the woman will regret it later).
    I said drunken sex IS NOT rape... so whats your point?

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