Impressed With Legion

[Deleted]

Possible the best expansion ever. I started playing during beta pre vanilla release btw.
Only downside imo is that there are way to much RNG. Some is needed but there are just to many RNG layers - warforge titanforge and Legendary.
When i was playing (alpha) Legion we got our legendary from a vendor. The flavour text on them made me believe that it was a hint of where to get them, and it seemed cool. To bad it didn't work that way :-(
Everything else is really awesome. The rest of the bad parts was fixed or changed during alpha.

[Hugstable]

I've really been enjoying it alot so far. Stopped playing before Firelands came out in Cata and rejoined in January for Legion, but I'm catching up right now (just hit 110 about 2 weeks ago) and already at 41 weapon traits and at 867 ilvl. Hoping to be ready for ToS by the time it comes out.

[Apology]

Legion has been fantastic so far and blew away any expectations that I had.

7.2 is a bit of a clusterfuck though.

[Daedius]

Legion had a good start until you discovered the RNG in literally every orifice of the expansion...

Not a fan of this "Carrot-on-a-stick" bullshit to keep people playing the lottery for loot (i.e. - Base ilvl can proc up to cap, when it should have been +5/+10 at most), but I lost all sense of respect for Blizzard when they took it a step further making the fucking REPUTATION MOUNTS, that should have been buyable off the quartermasters after hitting Exalted, a grind of 10k rep for a SMALL CHANCE of it...

Their methods to keep people playing is nothing short of disgusting at this point. Feels like it's heading towards F2P grind territory.

[Requimortem]

I'm impressed too. Impressed at how badly they've managed to screw up so much and so often. Impressed at how delusional some people are by calling the expansion "great". So why am I still playing? Because I'm hoping that before my subscription ends I can make enough gold to buy Starcraft II and the Necromancer class for Diablo III whenever that gets released. After that, I'll never bother with this game again--not unless the current team of idiots is removed and they stop trying to gate everything behind raiding/Mythic and beyond.

[Dracullus]

I'm impressed - mostly with class only stuff. I love playing alts (and I don't think that they should have same power as my main) - so all this unique questlines for campaign, artifacts and professions are amazing.

And this may be most content rich expansion - I assume 7.2.5 and 7.3.5 bring some small content, of course I expect from 7.3 huge new zone, raid and dungeons (lets return to 3 dungeons for last major patch idea!) + small 7.4 with questline leading to 8.0 could be a nice bonus (but I'm not expecting 7.4). + this time they actually spread out content correctly (they fuck up this big time in Mist of Pandaria) - this should be designed for people that stay in this world, not for ones that hop in, breeze through
content, whine about 'nothing to do' and hop out.

Of course it has problems - like all expansions. But I personally care only about:

- content quality,
- content quantity,
- lore.

so you can see that Legion have no major cons for me.

Only downside imo is that there are way to much RNG. Some is needed but there are just to many RNG layers - warforge titanforge and Legendary. When i was playing (alpha) Legion we got our legendary from a vendor. The flavour text on them made me believe that it was a hint of where to get them, and it seemed cool. To bad it didn't work that way :-(

We have RNG, because we have maaany sources for gear now, before it was only raid - and it drop only few pieces. So I believe idea is that casual player or alt char can gear up very quickly, but at the same time it still take some time for veteran to min-max their stats.

Legendary exist to spice up game - without it doing usual stuff, like emissary, mythic+ and farm raids would be very predictable.

Of course both things might be problems - mostly for mythic raiders that want to 'finish' their char and get 'best item' in every slot. We need to find solutions for their problems without hurting casual playerbase. My suggestions:

- RNG loot: Titanforge goes up only to -10 (or -5) current mythic loot, that have static item level and stats, but drop only 1 piece for boss
- Legendary: hardest solution would be balance legendaries, so each one is useful in different fights, easiest solution: we drop only legendary tokens, we can just buy legendary that we need
- Paragon AP: every Paragon level is very high, but static - when you ding you can choose your reward: heroic raid box, 1000 gold or something else - this way AP items will be always useful, but paragon will have no pernament effect on your character.

[Twilight Cultist]

Unimpressed. Putting twenty difficulty modes on top of small amount of new content (the amount is comparable to WoD and is significantly less than in MoP / WotLK and Cata if we count the revamp of the old world) is not fixing anything. All the major features of Legion are these multi-stage grinds. Tons of reuse all around, from Dalaran to Karazhan. Tons upon tons of gating. That's embarrassing.

They are saving resources they are putting into the game and are doing what's easy (new rounds of artifact power = tune a couple of numbers) instead of what's interesting (new gameplay). It shows. Legion is going to lose quite a number of people, just like WoD did.

We are in the first major patch of Legion. So lets compare Legion to those expansions you mentioned up to their first major patch.

Short Version: Even if you don't include Tomb of Sargeras, Legion has as much, if not more content, than the expansions you mentioned. You may have enjoyed the content in previous expansions more (and that is fine), but please don't try to make it look like Blizzard has produced less content in Legion than previous expansions (especially WoD...come on).

Long Version: (I tried to be as objective and fair about this as possible.)

Wrath of the Lich King

Dungeons: 12 (I include Stratholme in this because it was a complete remake.)

Raids: Technically: 4, Practically: 3 (Naxxramas, with the exception of a few changes, was exactly the same as it's level 60 counterpart. It can barely be called a new raid, but it still is content.)

Total Raid bosses: Technically: 31, Practically: 16

Other content: Dailies, Vault of Archavon (equivalent to today's world bosses), PvP

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.


Cataclysm

Dungeons: Technically: 11, Practically: 10 (Excluded Zul'aman because it had very very minor changes to it and was pretty much the exact same to it's level 70 counterpart. I do include Zul'gurub, Deadmines and Shadowfang Keep as new dungeons as they were completely remade.)

Raids: 4

Total Raid Bosses: 20

Other content: Firelands World Content/Dailies, Baradin Hold (equivalent to today's world bosses), PvP

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.

Mists of Pandaria

Dungeons: 9 (I include Scholomance and Scarlet Monastery because they were complete remakes.)

Raids: 4

Total Raid Bosses: 29

Other Content: Brawler's Guild, World Bosses, Isle of Thunder World Content/Dailies, Scenarios, Pet Battles (you may or may not participate in this content, but it doesn't change the fact that it is content), PvP. Edit: Dominance Offence area.

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.

Warlord of Draenor

Dungeons: 8 (I include Upper Blackrock Spire because it was a complete remake.)

Raids: 3

Total Raid Bosses: 30

Other Content: Tanaan Jungle Content, Garrison (....yeah, I know), World Bosses, Apexis Dailies, Pet Battles, PvP

Legion

Dungeons: 13 (Separated Karazhan into Upper and Lower as they are just as much two dungeons as The Nexus/Oculus, Utgarde Keep/Utgarde Pennacle, etc. Also, included Violet Hold and Lower Karazhan because they are complete remakes.)

Raids: Technically: 4, Practically: 3 (Even though Tomb of Sargeras is suppose to be a part of 7.2, it isn't out yet, so you can't fully count it.)

Total Raid Bosses: Technically: 29, Practically: 20

Other content: Entire Suramar Quest Line (included this as it is max level content and provides objectively beneficial rewards), Broken Shore World Content/World Quests, World Bosses, Legion Assaults, Class Campaigns, Solo Challenges, Pet Battles, PvP

Note: On top of having the most dungeons out of the ones you mentioned, Legion dungeons have stayed relevant with the Mythic+ system.

[Grimnakh]

We are in the first major patch of Legion. So lets compare Legion to those expansions you mentioned up to their first major patch.

Short Version: Even if you don't include Tomb of Sargeras, Legion has as much, if not more content, than the expansions you mentioned. You may have enjoyed the content in previous expansions more (and that is fine), but please don't try to make it look like Blizzard has produced less content in Legion than previous expansions (especially WoD...come on).

Long Version: (I tried to be as objective and fair about this as possible.)

Wrath of the Lich King

Dungeons: 12 (I include Stratholme in this because it was a complete remake.)

Raids: Technically: 4, Practically: 3 (Naxxramas, with the exception of a few changes, was exactly the same as it's level 60 counterpart. It can barely be called a new raid, but it still is content.)

Total Raid bosses: Technically: 31, Practically: 16

Other content: Dailies, Vault of Archavon (equivalent to today's world bosses), PvP

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.


Cataclysm

Dungeons: Technically: 11, Practically: 10 (Excluded Zul'aman because it had very very minor changes to it and was pretty much the exact same to it's level 70 counterpart. I do include Zul'gurub, Deadmines and Shadowfang Keep as new dungeons as they were completely remade.)

Raids: 4

Total Raid Bosses: 20

Other content: Firelands World Content/Dailies, Baradin Hold (equivalent to today's world bosses), PvP

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.

Mists of Pandaria

Dungeons: 9 (I include Scholomance and Scarlet Monastery because they were complete remakes.)

Raids: 4

Total Raid Bosses: 29

Other Content: Brawler's Guild, World Bosses, Isle of Thunder World Content/Dailies, Scenarios, Pet Battles (you may or may not participate in this content, but it doesn't change the fact that it is content), PvP.

Please tell me if i'm missing anything, but I believe that was it.

Warlord of Draenor

Dungeons: 8 (I include Upper Blackrock Spire because it was a complete remake.)

Raids: 2

Total Raid Bosses: 17

Other Content: Garrison (....yeah, I know), World Bosses, Apexis Dailies, Pet Battles, PvP

Legion

Dungeons: 13 (Separated Karazhan into Upper and Lower as they are just as much two dungeons as The Nexus/Oculus, Utgarde Keep/Utgarde Pennacle, etc. Also, included Violet Hold and Lower Karazhan because they are complete remakes.)

Raids: Technically: 4, Practically: 3 (Even though Tomb of Sargeras is suppose to be a part of 7.2, it isn't out yet, so you can't fully count it.)

Total Raid Bosses: Technically: 29, Practically: 20

Other content: Entire Suramar Quest Line (included this as it is max level content and provides objectively beneficial rewards), Broken Shore World Content/World Quests, World Bosses, Legion Assaults, Class Campaigns, Solo Challenges, Pet Battles, PvP

Note: On top of having the most dungeons out of the ones you mentioned, Legion dungeons have stayed relevant with the Mythic+ system.

Were likely getting a raid for Argus if not another dungeon or 2.

[Twilight Cultist]

Were likely getting a raid for Argus if not another dungeon or 2.

I was just comparing the first major patches.

[Seefer]

Some things I like and some I don't I hate the AP grind and I mean HATE it, I feel like if I miss a day or 2 I am already behind and another thing I dislike stems from way back and goes on to this day........I really hate so many raid difficulties, if I down a raid I really get bored going into higher difficulties because it's the same thing I have seen over and over and over it burns me out, I also really dislike how alt unfriendly this expac is.

I will say I do enjoy the legion invasions, the environment and Illidan

[TheFirstOnes]

Never mind what I Said....

[melodramocracy]

The content itself is decent, certainly better than the past few expansions. That's offset by anemic overall class design, and followers / mission tables continue to be sub-par leftovers from WoD.

One of WoW's fundamental problems continues to be that the best parts of the game are the most expedient, and you're left with an end game that is generally low risk and extremely repetitive. Even with more varied stuff to do, that's still pretty evident. Log in, do any number of x/y/z tasks, be guaranteed success at the vast majority of them simply by going through the motions, then log off. That's ok in a single player game, but less desirable in an MMO.

I'd have left (again) already if not for the group I play with, frankly.

[Aggrophobic]

It's by far the worst expantion Blizzard ever made, in my opinion.
Way too much RNG and nothing you do ingame feels rewarding to me.

WoW was at it's peak from Wrath to MoP, I'd say.

[anveena]

I'm not impressed with maw of souls simulator.

>too much rng with loot
>worst legendary system ever
>artifacts/legendaries locking you into a spec
>alt unfriendly
>too much grinding
>garrison 2.0
>mobs scaling with item level
>time gating galore

[MoanaLisa]

Voted undecided. I usually do in polls like this. The proper time to assess an expansion is after it's done including the inevitable dead time between last content patch and next expansion.

I will say that Blizzard has fixed the problem of "nothing to do" for casual players. Those like me, who play a few times a week and sometimes regularly skip a week or two when involved with something else, should be pretty happy with the amount of stuff there is to do. Solo, groups, friends: something there for just about everyone.

[Marrilaife]

The amount of content is good. The way this content is served leaves many questions (why every patch is so horribly bug-ridden as if we were still in the dark ages of vanilla?). Gating / pacing sometimes makes sense (7.2 campaign or insurrection campaign being a weekly episode series) sometimes it doesn't (how slow the buildings progress in 7.2, how long it took originally to "attune" to arcway and that it mostly required withered army grinding).

Alt-unfriendliness was horrible at launch, it's a bit better now after several changes to AK and class campaigns.

AP grind is still real, hardcores can be easily 5-7 traits ahead of casuals (which was promised to be fixed with the new 7.2 AK scaling). Artifacts started really well but got tainted by artificial stretching and premise AP grind needs to last the whole expansion instead of reaching the finish line somewhere.

Class design is a hit and miss, with a lot of miss, let's see how 7.2.5 tackles it.

Reps are tedious, unfun, and unrewarding, the only one I like is wardens, I like hunting these specific named mobs, and I liked kirin tor before they started tampering with it. Grinding reps like Nightfallen or Legionfall for 75 rep per quest feels awful. The fact you can't really buy anything cool at exalted anymore is sad as well, all you can get from reps is rng mounts from the new caches (with low droprate) and ofc the mandatory part required for flying. Oh yeah, and class shoulders if you want to collect the set... I still miss wotlk / cata tabard system for obtaining rep through dungeons. Also, all the rep rewards cost shitton of gold for some weird reason. 1k-3k gold per pattern, 4k gold per some low ilvl gear piece you can't even use for transmog on alts because transmogs are rep-restricted.

Broken shore stinks because it should have had way more quests and have some form of daily / emissary system (complete 4 WQ in Broken Shore for a cache of Legionfall Supplies etc.), so you can pick and choose quests and not have to scour the whole map to get 4-5 quests per day total.

Titanforge and legendary system stinks, period. It's Blizzard's way to hand out candy to people who are still gonna cry Blizzard only caters to top 1% of playerbase anyway (case on point: the QQ about mage tower challenge requiring high ilvl). In the process they managed to screw over the encounter tuning because of vast gear disparities so stuff ends either undertuned or overtuned, there's no middle ground. They also managed to strip the legendaries of the awesomeness they should have been, there's too many of them and every joe has one, and more than half of them leave people disappointed. They should've stuck to the "epic questline" formula like MOP / WOD and prune down the number of legendaries to absolute minimum (preferably 1 per spec you obtain from an epic questline). Then they could ensure each of them is cool, unique and powerful.

I mean, Legion would be an amazing expansion if:
- patches weren't released so hastily with so many bugs, the game was more polished (I don't mean huge gaps, but like extra 2 weeks of testing would have helped)
- reputations were more rewarding when you reach exalted, and had more alternative ways to be obtained (no, the mission table tokens are a pittance in the whole picture, plus they're passive, I mean active ways like dungeon tabards or hand-ins of items)
- professions were less rng-ridden (random rank 3 alchemy, random stats on crafted gear, random rank 2-3 on gathering, etc.)
- legendaries followed the old paradigm of being special instead of us being flooded with them
- titanforging had a cap of +10 ilvls
- class design team did their job during beta so we wouldn't need big redesigns mid expansion like 7.1.5 and incoming 7.2.5
- broken shore specifically had more quests, faster buildings progression, oh, and invasions could be rotating 50% faster / more often too

[Toybox]

Impressed, but there's loads of little niggles that seem to be bothering me moreso than in other expansions. Without those, it'd probably be my favourite expansion of all time, even beating out TBC & MoP.

[Luckx]

Gameplaywise its not bad, but Legion/WOD storyline is pretty weak in comprasion to epicness of WOTLK.

I disliked Stormheim storyline, when it comes to Nothern theme Icecrown was alot better. Graplling hooks idea was not bad tho.

[Coffeexbean]

I think the expansion would be better without the fast paced feeling of modern WoW. It has everything to be like TBC or early expansion but add ons like the WQGF make being out in the world a hollow experience as its just a "single player hack" to blow through the WQ instead of people talking to each other out in the open and asking for help. Not like you need the help anyways as its single player content but add ons like those monopolize the choice for other players to get in parties as everyone is cheesing them. I'm also not a fan of having so many flight paths in each zone as they are relatively small. Val sharah has like 4-5 and they are all right down the road from each other. I miss the real time travel that the game had as it was part of the journey to cross over zones and explore. It makes the world feel really big but now people will be like " no my quest is gonna take too long" and thats fine your entitled to your opinion.

Quests feel like chores and boring to some people because they make it that instead of spending their time doing something they enjoy. I remember in TBC for a Wanted: knuckerlot and Luzrun quest in the ghostlands how much fun it was and how challenging it felt to run around the zones and find them, you had to split up and communicate with your party and they werent soloable. It took a lot longer than the easy ass wanted elite warden quests we do nowadays but it was more fun and meaningful.

[Twilight Cultist]

There's no middle ground with legion. It's got the best instanced content and worst world content of any expansion I've played. Hard to say how that averages out because at this point the world content has driven me to unsub.

- - - Updated - - -



ICC had 12 bosses Ulduar 14... how did Wrath only have 16 bosses total?

This was me comparing all those expansions up to their first major patch, so ICC and ToC wouldn't be counted in that. Also, I was saying that was technically 31 if you include Naxx, but 16 if you excluded it. I excluded it because I was responding to someone who was arguing that Blizzard made less content in Legion than in any other expansion. Naxx had very minor tweaks to it, so it wasn't content that Blizzard needed to make for the launch.