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  1. #81
    We already have a lot of idiots playing this game and going f2p would attract even more. This has to be the worst idea I've seen in past 3 years.

  2. #82
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    yes because going F2P has been all so super successful for every other MMO right?
    Idk about "successful" but LOTRO had some benefits by implementing F2P accounts besides their subscription accounts which became VIP. They also had a good solution to the shop currency (VIPs getting a decent amount each paid month), so if you had a subscription, you could indulge in the shop on a regular base, while F2P accounts had to buy everything in the shop (either with currency earned by playing the game =grind, or with currency bought with cash). Was a good incentive to have a subscription if you are not much into grinding shop currency. I only stopped playing when they butchered the talent system and my favorite class (not even logging in nowadays), but their payment model (F2P + subscription account + something inbetween) was very good. I had a subscription for some years, and bought some extra vanity stuff. Also, the community on my server (a big German RP server) was good, so F2P does not have to lead to a bad community.

    Edit: Beside that, if WoW would go completely to F2P with shop and without a subscription alternative, then it would be a very strange move. So I don't think that subs will vanish except in the case where WoW is truly dying. I also prefer the subscription because it's a fixed cost per month, and its usually much cheaper than the alternative. Neverwinter was quite excessive in this regard, and after they have put their F2P system on steroids, I quit the game.
    Last edited by mmoceb1073a651; 2017-04-04 at 12:37 PM.

  3. #83
    There could be nothing worse for the health of the game. F2P is cancer. Where MMOs go to die. From there it's the inevitable slide down to P2W, MTX for everything, and everyone abandoning the game.

    The whole genre is in the long plateau stage, and the MMOs hanging on aren't the ones that went F2P to make a final cash grab.

    Playerbases inevitably shrink, but the die-hard subsets can be retained indefinitely by not giving in to the temptation to give the game away to transients, hoping they'll be suckered into a few $ of MTX before getting bored and leaving.

    There are some really old, obscure subscription MMOs out there that are still kicking.
    F2P: If you don't think it's worth my money, I don't think it's worth my time.

  4. #84
    Sure, and meanwhile it's obvious to everyone else why you're not hired by Blizzard's financial team.

    They made 800 million dollars on a bad year. Sub cost is still incredibly low for the hours you get.

  5. #85
    Deleted
    Just dont. im willing to play 50 cents a day for several hours of gametime.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Dryla View Post
    TESO, i do not know.
    GW2 is buy to play, and i do not think anyone can tell it is doing well, when the population and the devs themselves are at war because of raiding.
    SWTOR, a good game that is DEAD, it is not f2p at all, and good luck joining the queues for dungeons and BGS, a pity because the game had the potential to be as good as WOW.
    Okay let me correct you:

    TES is currently developing its first proper expansion for the game, its had several releases, the most recent that benefitted the player base heavily was the release of one tamriel which removed the concept of leveling in essense from the core world game. Alot of people are playing it to this day and more so than ever now they can finally play with friends from any faction.

    GW2 isnt buy to play anymore, it went F2P a couple of years back in prepairation for HoT launch, though HoT is not free to play so your "half" right, also, the raiding isnt really a big deal, Season 3 made content more accessable than ever with catchup mechanics allowing most people to reach raiding in no time.

    SWTOR isnt dead, far from it, its horrible as fuck as an F2P game ill give you that but dead? No. Its still reletivley doing well, well enough to have launched 4 expansions over the course of the last few years and still be in the process of likely launching at least one more before going completley downhill.

    You want Dead?

    Wildstar, RIFT, thats "dead".

    Wildstar, which started as a sub game, and RIFT that has become almost empty over night.

    Both being decent games that sadly lost everything by trying to go up against an impossible giant that is WoW. Prooving once and for all that copying the origional doesnt make you better than it.

    GW2 is still the strongest F2P game to date with ESO being second up and SWTOR closely following. Games like WoW and FF14 benefit from subs only because of certain technicalities, the biggest being in FF14's case the vastness of its subscribers, as opposed to the quality. WoW also suffers from alot of things people neglect to consider, like multiboxing, botting, and other account creation designed around gold farming/selling which has been an issue to the game even after methods meant to tackle it were introduced.

    Alot of WoW's population outside of America and Asia is on a heavy decline, the European servers are standing strong but only in high population servers, there are some that are literally a ghost-town.

  7. #87
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainV View Post
    Okay let me correct you:
    SWTOR isnt dead, far from it, its horrible as fuck as an F2P game ill give you that but dead? No. Its still reletivley doing well, well enough to have launched 4 expansions over the course of the last few years and still be in the process of likely launching at least one more before going completley downhill.
    Ok fair enough, let me elaborate, despite it´s financial success or the lack of it, for me as a player, a game that if i queue for doing a leveling dungeon, even as tank, i have to wait far more than an hour, it is dead, specially a suposedly MMORPG.
    About those expansions you mention, i might be wrong, but i recall people talking about them being mostly solo play, and if that is the case, it is hardly a MMORPG, it would be more a single player that requires conection to a server for playing it.

  8. #88
    Absolutely not. This game does perfectly fine on its subscriber system, one of the few MMOs that work fine on a subscriber base these days. I have no desire to see more motivation for Blizzard to add more gameplay impacting items to the shop.

  9. #89
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainV View Post
    and RIFT that has become almost empty over night.
    For a good reason.
    Tried 2-3 years ago and it was okish, tried again like 5 months ago, and in less than an hour i got fed up of all the packages drop nonsense.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainV View Post
    the European servers are standing strong but only in high population servers, there are some that are literally a ghost-town.
    This i do agree with, but it is not just Europen servers, i would dare say american ones are in the same situation.
    It is because the game is old, sometimes i even think they might be considering joining horde/alliance population for some aspects of the game, like raiding.

  10. #90
    The day WoW goes F2P will be the day I stop playing...

    I fucking loathe the F2P model.

  11. #91
    There's a lot more to it than that OP. Implying the game lost 7m players after WotLK because it wasn't casual friendly is just wrong considering both vanilla and BC were much harder for casual players if they wanted to experience end game content. Every expansion since has massively catered to casuals more so than the last.

  12. #92
    If WoW went F2P, we'd end up like TOR.

    That is, a remenant of hardcore players and a whole bunch of kids who play the game because they can't afford subs.
    [CENTER]
    ~ Just an aussie trawling the wastes of Dath'Remar since '07 ~

  13. #93
    The Patient Kardagh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jyggalag View Post
    There's a lot more to it than that OP. Implying the game lost 7m players after WotLK because it wasn't casual friendly is just wrong considering both vanilla and BC were much harder for casual players if they wanted to experience end game content. Every expansion since has massively catered to casuals more so than the last.
    Consider the splitting of raid tiers into now 4 modes of content as opposed to 1 tier split across two group sizes. People get disillusioned with raiding when you have 4 tiers of the same raid. You have the mythic raiders on top bleating that casuals are ruining the game and you have the bottom feeders in LFR crying that everything is too hard for them while the increasingly squeezed middle (normal + heroic) are being bled dry by apathy - why bother pushing to go higher when

    1) mythic needs a flat 20 people, which smaller heroic guilds can't physically manage and

    2) the prospect of titanforge/warforge rng from lower tiers makes many of the less committed to be like "eh why bother doing normal if some drone is getting titanforged 910 in LFR?"

    Don't peddle the "oh but the raiding experience, the content!" majority of people want progression i.e seeing their character's power level increase over time.

    What has Legion done so far? Strangulated that with ridiculous mob scaling, and AP grinds. You want progression? Here you go, at a snails pace. Gating, staggering and locking things behind arbitrary barriers puts people off. Let people decide the pace they want to consume content. Your hardcore will ALWAYS burn content out before the next lot comes. Thankfully they are a financially small population (but gosh do they have loud voices). The people leaving the game are not the "old players" by in large from what I have seen (I have over 200 battle.net friends as a sample) but the players who joined on the pinnacle, the late TBC i.e Sunwell patch and WoTLK players who are diving off in droves.

    Why? Cataclysm was the first big shock to the system. People weren't used to having -hard- content at max level (even myself as a vanilla player) that was on par with how heroics were in TBC at first. Second in Cataclysm, the starting of raid fragmentation which only intensified after LFR came out, i'm not going to complain about LFR (it's got its place).

    Next big hit was Pandaria, with the beginning of stricter gating mechanisms even on -daily- quests. While I personally find MoP's story to be the best hands down, there was a viable portion of the player who were not happy with Pandaren being brought in. Blizzard could have toned the goofy nature on them down a bit to appease the moodier parts but no, they hammed up and played up the silly quirky nature to 11. And lastly on MoP Siege of Orgrimmar lasted way too long. It went on so long that I, a casual raider by MoP actually progressed into the harder difficulty settings briefly.

    I would have to dedicate a whole separate post for why WoD was a colossal let down, but in brief: Too much hype, too many promises being broken, confused direction, no content, too many gaps with the few bits of content and just this general sense of "please let this be done". WoD was a bout of painful surgery you want to be over with.

    Going into Legion, the feeling its NOT WoD is what still carries me on a reasonably good high with it, and probably a lot of other people. But the actual quality of the expansion suffers from the ghost of WoD (restrictions on Flying, Garrisons-lite, a slow chug up with content) The Broken Shore is sadly not even half of what the Timeless Isle was and half the size of Tanaan Jungle. Also the Legionfall reputation has went onto this bizarre hybrid mix of WoD rep-grinding and a sort of faux-looking "do as much as you like" Vanilla style rep grind (Legionfall supplies) despite the actual practical limit to how many of the resources you can get.

    But to say F2P would stop the tide of tired, bored and let down players? No. Blizzard will very unlikely reach the highs of WoTLK and Cata again. If they want to keep a steady number? Probably give the players what they want more.

  14. #94
    The Undying Lochton's Avatar
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    yeah,,, no...


    I could go with F2P to level 60, as it is the basic but from the health of many other F2P's, not sure I agree.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tome View Post
    I'm sorry, but even some free-to-play game, or even buy-to-play games have better communities than World of Warcraft has. Subscription or not doesn't change that, it's what the game provides that makes the community.
    But even at so, many P2P, F2P or B2P also have worse community than WoW. There's at current, no golden game with a splendid community. And it has come many times that F2P's has a bad portion because you easily can come and go.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappyzilla View Post
    Whenever I'm bored with wow I check out the F2P mmos out there, some can be fun but for the most part it really sucks if you do not have the money to throw at the games. Imagine how bad the ingame store would get if wow went F2P. Buy this adventurers pack and get flying now! or Want the strongest gems and enchants in the game? Look no further then the wow store
    Sadly, the F2P tag also means limitations... A lot of them.. Just look at SWTOR and ArcheAge.
    FOMO: "Fear Of Missing Out", also commonly known as people with a mental issue of managing time and activities, many expecting others to fit into their schedule so they don't miss out on things to come. If FOMO becomes a problem for you, do seek help, it can be a very unhealthy lifestyle..

  15. #95
    Stood in the Fire Lazerbrain's Avatar
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    vary bad idea, sub games are superior.

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lazerbrain View Post
    vary bad idea, sub games are superior.
    Especially to players who can afford the small monthly fee, because pure F2P games usually cost more per month.

  17. #97
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    Paying for wow 10 years with few brakes. Once its F2P im quitting for good . Fucking hate to play with FREE players. Every game i played that went F2P iw quit playing due to spending more money to have shit unlocked that i had in sub before and playing with Free idiots.
    Geme smtn 2 kielllllll.

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Peppered View Post
    Thoughts?
    my thought is that wow success was an once in a lifetime experience and to begin with mmos have always be well under the million threshold, now wow is simply realigning with the market: just ot give you an idea everquest's last reported subscription numbers were given as more than 430,000 players on 14 January 2004 and Daoc peak was 250000 subs.
    I bet that other games playerbases are shrinking rest to be seen if in the future big SH like blizzard, EA, etc will invest in mmo or we go back to indie
    -
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    Obviously this issue doesn't affect me however unlike some raiders I don't see the point in taking satisfaction in this injustice, it's wrong, just because it doesn't hurt me doesn't stop it being wrong, the player base should stand together when Blizzard do stupid shit like this not laugh at the ones being victimised.

  19. #99
    Deleted
    I'll never understand why people cry for WoW to go F2P.
    1) It does not need to. Especially with this CRZ technology, WoW can easily survive on a couple hundred thousand players
    2) F2P won't get player numbers up sustainably. It will be a huge influx once, lots of friction with existing playerbase that will end in much less players after a couple of months
    3) The game time coin is as F2P as the game will ever get.

    And let's face it: If 13EUR a month is too much for you, you have bigger problems than WoW.

    I'm curious if they couldn't go the other way around: Increase sub amount and use the money to provide more patch content. Probably a very hard sell psychologically, but I for one would have no problem paying 20 or 25 EUR if that guaranteed more content (3-month cycles maybe?)

  20. #100
    It won't happen. Blizz already makes way too much money with the sub-model, so why should they switch to a risky F2P model? Also if WoW would go F2P, player numbers wouldn't sky rocket or anything, they would just increae slightly.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Socronoss View Post
    I'm curious if they couldn't go the other way around: Increase sub amount and use the money to provide more patch content. Probably a very hard sell psychologically, but I for one would have no problem paying 20 or 25 EUR if that guaranteed more content (3-month cycles maybe?)
    That would be even worse and actually make people leave. Money is not a problem for Blizzard and more money doesn't translate to more and faster content.

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