Brexit bites as EU workers start to say screw you UK we are outa here…

[kamuimac]

From my vantage point way on the other side of the globe, I only have a vague notion of what's going on.

The author is from Belfast, are they included in the Brexit? I thought not.

Basically it's about how high tech EU workers are leaving due to uncertainty about Brexit. Or they feel unwelcome now.




https://sluggerotoole.com/2017/04/11...are-outa-here/


If there is one advantage to having kids it is that it does increase your circle of friends. Humans need social contact, especially when going through the misery joy of having your first child. We compare notes with other parents, we sympathise when they tell you their baby is not sleeping even though inside we are delighted that at least our kid is not as bad as there’s. We force a smile when another parent tells us how their little darling slept all night from three weeks. Bringing up a child is a surprising competitive sport.

Anyway, one of our baby buddies is a nice German couple. Dispute our local cynicism the foreigners I come across love living in Belfast. Sure, the buses never turn up on time and there is dogsh*t everywhere but they like the friendliness of the people. This German couple were happy working away in a local IT company, enjoying life in Belfast and all was right in the world. Until, you guessed it, Brexit.

Although it has not even happened yet the uncertainty is enough for foreign workers to start packing their bags. In the case of the German couple, they have a second child on the way. Before Brexit, they planned to buy a house in Belfast now there is just too much uncertainty. Instead, they are busy applying for jobs in Germany and Switzerland. Also, there is a feeling of the UK just do not want us anymore so feck ya we are out of here.

Their company has quite a few foreign workers and they are not alone in looking at the exit. Already the company is so short staffed that they are offering staff 6 grand if they help them recruit someone into the more niche vacant roles – 6 grand! To stem the exit flood the company is offering to pay the costs of applying for your leave to remain status. But anyone who has ever dealt with Home Office Immigration will know that it is a Kafkaesque process so frustrating it will have you booking your Ryanair flight out of here faster than you can say Nigel Farage.

You see the thing Brexiters do not seem to realise is you can’t magic skilled workers out of thin air. From Health to IT practically every sector of our economy has a skills shortage. The NHS for example would simply not be able to function is all the foreign staff upped and left.

I hear at a local college for some courses EU applications are down 20% already. Recruitment is also taking a hit with EU staff not taking up job offers.

The thing about highly mobile skilled workers is that they are er… highly mobile. They are already living the life of an expat, it does not matter to them if it is Belfast, Dublin, Amsterdam or Berlin. If your host country does not want you there are 100 other countries who will be delighted to welcome you.

Even at the other extreme of the jobs market for unskilled work farms, hospitality industry and companies like Moypark just could not survive without foreign workers.

But Brexiters will say it’s not about kicking out the foreigners it is about taking back control. That as may be but talk to a few foreign workers and get their take on it. Discouraging the brightest and the best from coming to the UK is economic suicide. Making the workers that are here feel unwelcome is just plain daft.

shouldntbe a problem - they imported so many of "engeeners" and "doctors" from Syria that should suffice for their job demand

also people in UK claim that it were freigners who stolen their job - well now you wont have any excuse to live of social beenfits anymore im sure so many of people on social benefits are highly skilled IT workers or willing to work their butt of in shitty jobs like collecting aspharagus or being kitchen help , cleaning hotel rooms etc etc

[Vash The Stampede]

Yeah but banning foreign workers doesn't work. The corporation will just move to another country and you lose the tax revenue and even more jobs.
Trying to restrict globalization is just not going to work. It is too late. If you are not willing to work with the global market, other countries will.

I agree, but that doesn't mean that things should continue as is. The bit about tax revenue is kinda pointless when here in USA companies avoid paying taxers through loop holes. And if they move to another country, then you just tax their goods more so. Remember USA and EU are the two largest markets in the world, and if you pull out there's going to be heavy consequences, or at least there should be.

[Sliske]

shouldntbe a problem - they imported so many of "engeeners" and "doctors" from Syria that should suffice for their job demand

also people in UK claim that it were freigners who stolen their job - well now you wont have any excuse to live of social beenfits anymore im sure so many of people on social benefits are highly skilled IT workers or willing to work their butt of in shitty jobs like collecting aspharagus or being kitchen help , cleaning hotel rooms etc etc

Probably best not to patronise the working class as lazy and excuse makers when you aren't even educated enough to be able to spell. Shit - not even educated enough to right click > choose correct spelling.

[kamuimac]

Probably best not to patronise the working class as lazy and excuse makers when you aren't even educated enough to be able to spell. Shit - not even educated enough to right click > choose correct spelling.

im not patronizing anyone - im just stating facts - and fact are citizens of UK rather sit with social benefits then work hard works - its not patronizing its fact. there were ton of work spaces left - just not those of white collar / office workers only those where they woudl have to work very hard.

what do you expect to happen now ? that the work poisitons that will open will be in offices ? hell no open posiiton will be as construction worker / cleaners etc etc. you knwo the same jobs that natives dont want to do.

also grammar atacks - so cute yet proving you have no clue maybe one day you will work in position high enough that your grammar wont matter really wish you that its very nice feeling not having to give a s...t about not important stuff like that especialy on internet forums

[Gaidax]

In short and maybe medium term Brexit will certainly hurt UK, but in the long run, such country as Great Britain is better off out of EU.

I'd understand staying in EU if it was some shitty ex-commie country, but Britain can stand on it's own feet pretty well and as such I see little sense for them to receive shitty orders from abroad that do not serve their interests.

This whole EU bubble began to unravel when it could not protect its member countries from the immigrant infestation and what's worse even welcomed it despite the obvious fact that considerable amount of citizens of these countries do not look at it positively.

[haxartus]

We need doctors, so they get in, we do not need car washers, so they do not get in.

You can't expect the doctors to come after the brexit fiasco. You are currently putting the working life of millions of foreign workers in danger, and all of that without a clear idea about what is happening and how it is going to happen. To me this is a pretty clear "We don't want you" sign.
Why would a doctor choose UK instead of, let's say, Germany, for their future career ?

[Alexeht]

But Brexiters will say it’s not about kicking out the foreigners it is about taking back control. That as may be but talk to a few foreign workers and get their take on it. Discouraging the brightest and the best from coming to the UK is economic suicide. Making the workers that are here feel unwelcome is just plain daft.

OMG this is just absurdly stupid. All I can say about this is - People that feel unwelcome in UK because of 'brexit' are stupid, those people do not get that UK is still in EU and dealing with Home Office Immigration is not as bad as shown here - I know I had to do it, so I'm one of many people from Europe which still had to pay for Home Office 100 quid to get permission to work, and this is also why I always say "EU did not give me anything, no advantage or help". People that are so scared they want to go back to EU-nation are just brainwashed into believe that all EU should be governed by one institution are truly daft.

This random guy from North Ireland is just spreading misinformation and his delusional tries in prediction of future, which is unfair to whole UK as nation and country, because it is like he would not believe that UK can govern itself and that brits need an outsider to lead them.

Immigrants are leaving and by extension opening up jobs - for no other reason than "muh feels" and this is seen as a bad thing? If you're in such a fucking well-off position that you can leave a job over "muh feels" then you probably don't even need to be working at all - especially at a fucking low tier IT job.

So much this! If rumors will push stupid people from UK it will not be bad, but positive thing.

[Mehrunes]

I love how we're having a discussion about Brexit, yet you people don't even know that the Capital of Northern Ireland is in Northern Ireland, and therefore in the UK.

This is exactly what I expect when I read anti brexit nonsense.

And which "anti-Brexit nonsense" contained lack of such awareness in this thread, exactly?

Not exactly no. It depends at what end of the Brexit spectrum you are really, some people want foreigners out sure but other Brexiters are interested in issues like national sovereignty. I'm a remainer, I think Brexit was dumb but their are definitely viable arguments being a member of the EU doesn't benefit our working class enough for them to want it but to insinuate that it's just because they are xenophobes is a lazy argument.

I.e. not real issues. Not exactly a better picture of the pro-Brexit squad, even when compared to the xenophobes.

Multiculturalists and islamophiles try to sell Muslims to us as god-sent multitalents, innovators, IT wizards and overall answers to all possible expert worker shortages. Without forgetting to mention the positive impacts their rich culture dating back to the 7th century has on our own dull 21st century society. Surely they can fill the jobs left empty by a few Germans?

...right?

Not only was there no significant cultural exchange between England and Muslims prior to the colonial times (and then it was more of "we'll conquer you and not give a shit about you" rather than a cultural exchange in the traditional sense), but for the most part Muslims are irrelevant to the issue of Brexit.

[Mormolyce]

Are you saying that the fifth largest immigrant population in the world is not mass immigration? If not, then you are disagreeing with the claim I pointed out was rubbish.

You know what the leading country of origin for UK immigrants is? The Republic of Ireland.

[Alexeht]

Muslims are irrelevant to the issue of Brexit.

Lie repeated milion times becomes a truth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rother...tation_scandal (only thing that makes me laugh in this wiki article is how they call them british-pakistani where those are people that barely even speak english). And this is one story from many, where police was afraid to do anything since they would have been called racist ...

[Mehrunes]

If you're a corporation, having many workers to choose from means you can force them to receive lower pay and less hours. Good for them, bad for us. This is also why in the US many people want $15 minimum wage, which is nearly double that of the previous wage. It took nearly 30 years to get $3 increase in minimum wage, and we're about to double it within a fraction of that time.

So I can totally see why the UK voted for Brexit. I just don't think that it's such a great idea to get out, since this could be solved in many different ways by regulating the shit out of companies.

In general sense, that line of thought would be correct. Not so much in case of UK, EU and Brexit. While influx of EU migrants may give more power to the corporations on the grounds of mere supply and demand, EU as organization is involved in said regulating the shit out of companies. That's one of the problems UK government had with EU. Things like employee rights and consumer rights (but not just that, also things like human rights too, for example). Because UK would much rather bend over to the corporations.

So while the influx of potential employees is detrimental in terms of employee-employer power balance, EU rules go in the other direction, most likely with the end result being positive. Remove EU out of the equation through Brexit and sure, there will be less competition for jobs making the position of potential employees stronger. But at the same time, UK government will be free to copy whatever anarcho-capitalist idiocy that is currently trending in US and suck the cocks of their corporate overlords. Which doesn't actually solve the problem with the position of corporation that you presented at all.

You're right as to how this can explain the vote in favor of Brexit though. The voters that did so simply looked at one side of the issue because they were busy going full rabble rabble and "they terk er jerbs" and that part of the problem was enough to satiate them. Oh, well, yet another case of the working class being either misinformed or manipulated and voting against their interests because they focused on one side of multi-faceted problem that appeased their anger.

Lie repeated milion times becomes a truth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rother...tation_scandal (only thing that makes me laugh in this wiki article is how they call them british-pakistani where those are people that barely even speak english). And this is one story from many, where police was afraid to do anything since they would have been called racist ...

Five Pakistani men? Yeah, super relevant to Brexit. Their presence will of course be solved by UK leaving EU. Because they totally got into UK because of EU, not because of UK's own deals with a former colony of theirs. You sure spotted the lie mon. Congrats on your keen observations skillz.

[Alexeht]

Congrats on your keen observations skillz.

Congratulations to your special grammar skills.

[Pann]

Lie repeated milion times becomes a truth.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rother...tation_scandal (only thing that makes me laugh in this wiki article is how they call them british-pakistani where those are people that barely even speak english). And this is one story from many, where police was afraid to do anything since they would have been called racist ...

Have you been talking to this guy?

[haxartus]

It are actually the smart people moving away.
They don't need this shit and they can get a job anywhere.

Exactly. Educated and highly qualified people don't look only for a high salary, they look for long term security.

UK is obviously not stable. The status of millions of people there is currently unknown after brexit, and 51% of the population voted for it.

When you pull this kind of thing, you lose your status as a stable, reliable market, business partner, employer, etc. And you lose it long term. There is no recovery from this, ever.

This kind of thing does not happen in other countries. If you are a doctor in Germany, there is no chance that you may get kicked out of the country in 2 years, just because you're not German.

[Alexeht]

snip

Old links to irrelevant fake news. Could you at least link to something that most people respect? It would mean no 'independent'.

I see no difference in post brexit vote UK, so I really do not see why people are baby crying about it like it would be WW III. Smart people wait for result of test before aborting terminal ill fetus, instead just pushing mother from stairs "just in case". Well you live in Netherlands so that probably impact on your world view.

Have you been talking to this guy?

I really think he means them coming through Europe to Britain, hell they are still waiting to get in trough Calais, after they burned and build again own tent village.

This kind of thing does not happen in other countries. If you are a doctor in Germany, there is no chance that you may get kicked out of the country in 2 years, just because you're not German.

In Germany you may get kicked out from job for being German lol.

[Mehrunes]

In short and maybe medium term Brexit will certainly hurt UK, but in the long run, such country as Great Britain is better off out of EU.

I'd understand staying in EU if it was some shitty ex-commie country, but Britain can stand on it's own feet pretty well and as such I see little sense for them to receive shitty orders from abroad that do not serve their interests.

Yeah, losing any real influence on one of the largest market in the world and main trading partner of UK is bound to work wonders in the long term. Because such a country as Great Britain does not succumb to things like logical consequences of things. British exceptionalism all the way! Ze Empire will rise again!

This whole EU bubble began to unravel when it could not protect its member countries from the immigrant infestation and what's worse even welcomed it despite the obvious fact that considerable amount of citizens of these countries do not look at it positively.

Only during the migrant crisis? I thought it started to unravel after Maastricht Treaty. Or expansion of 2004. Or Lisbon Treaty. Or economic crisis of 2008. Just to point the big ones. In the minds of eurosceptics EU is in constant state of unraveling since its inception and so far, nothing. Also, Germany and some other member states took the migrants and then asked other countries to help with the issue on the ground of solidarity rule. It's not something initiated by EU itself. But who needs facts when we can have eurosceptic feels. Also, good luck stopping a migrant... I mean "infestation" wave of millions (that UK helped to initiate when they jumped on US' bandwagon of destabilizing the Middle East without a second thought).

Congratulations to your special grammar skills.

1. Fascinating post you got there. 2. Grammar Nazism is against the forum rules. 3. Grammar, orthography, what's the difference? 4. I was deliberately using Internet lingo to make my mockery of your post more apparent, but it looks like it wasn't apparent enough for you to get it (though in retrospect, given what the contents of that post represented, it's not entirely surprising). 5. How quaint you did not address the point of my reply. I'm even more surprised right now.

[Alexeht]

1. Fascinating post you got there. 2. Grammar Nazism is against the forum rules. 3. Grammar, orthography, what's the difference? 4. I was deliberately using Internet lingo to make my mockery of your post more apparent, but it looks like it wasn't apparent enough for you to get it (though given what the contents of that post represented, it's not entirely surprising). 5. How quaint you did not address the point of my reply. I'm even more surprised right now.

Hahahaha. Prank'ed! I was just joking, so it is all fine and jokes on you. Beside I congratulated you so I don't see reason why you are so triggered about it.

Oh and why I would address your reply since you nit pick what I said? There is no reason for me to treat you better that you treat me ...

[Mehrunes]

Old links to irrelevant fake news. Could you at least link to something that most people respect? It would mean no 'independent'.

Yeah, there totally were no hate crimes occurring after the Brexit vote. All fake news. Independent also faked Home Office numbers. Or were they faked by the Home Office itself? I forgot my tinfoil hat today. And Council of Europe has a clear anti-UK bias so everything they say about UK is not a mere lie, but outright propaganda. Link more Infowars @Kangodo. Also, the fact that these links were old doesn't mean squat. The topic of what Kangodo replied to was just as old. Which makes them relevant. Who would have guessed /s

I see no difference in post brexit vote UK, so I really do not see why people are baby crying about it like it would be WW III. Smart people wait for result of test before aborting terminal ill fetus, instead just pushing mother from stairs "just in case". Well you live in Netherlands so that probably impact on your world view.

Ah, yes, obviously your anecdotal experience is not fake news.

I really think he means them coming through Europe to Britain, hell they are still waiting to get in trough Calais, after they burned and build again own tent village.

And it still is not an issue of EU or something altered by Brexit because the Eurotunnel is subject to bilateral agreement between France and UK. And because of it and UK not being in Schengen Area, there are passport checks. With juxtaposed controls.

In Germany you may get kicked out from job for being German lol.

Kicked out of the country. Kicked out from a job. Do try to spot the difference.

[Kalis]

You can't expect the doctors to come after the brexit fiasco. You are currently putting the working life of millions of foreign workers in danger, and all of that without a clear idea about what is happening and how it is going to happen. To me this is a pretty clear "We don't want you" sign.
Why would a doctor choose UK instead of, let's say, Germany, for their future career ?

Perhaps there are not available places in German hospitals, perhaps they do not speak German. It could be any number of reasons.

You need to show that places without freedom of movement, such as Canada, cannot attract doctors.

You know what the leading country of origin for UK immigrants is? The Republic of Ireland.

Poland 831,000
India 795,000
Pakistan 503,000
Ireland 382,000

Would they be Polish-Irish, Indian-Irish or Pakistani-Irish?

[Mehrunes]

Hahahaha. Prank'ed! I was just joking, so it is all fine and jokes on you. Beside I congratulated you so I don't see reason why you are so triggered about it.

According to what you wrote you congratulated my skills themselves, not me. The magic of language. Also, "I was just joking hurr durr" is an extremely weak form of deflection.

Oh and why I would address your reply since you nit pick what I said? There is no reason for me to treat you better that you treat me ...

How is pointing out that what you linked only reaffirms my stance that Brexit doesn't have much to do with Muslims contrary to what you said (which was outright calling it a lie) "nitpicking"? Your example was irrelevant and didn't prove what you thought it proves, which simply makes you wrong. Own up to it.

Guess what, stark majority of Muslims in UK are there because of UK itself. UK didn't accept refugees during the migrant crisis and thanks to not being in Schengen and the Eurotunnel agreement placing the burden on France (which formed the Calais jungle) they didn't have too many prior to that as well. Which makes said stark majority of UK Muslims not affected by Brexit one way or another. And sure, there may have been people that voted for Brexit because of Muslims, like the guy @Pann linked. But that doesn't magically make Muslims relevant to Brexit, it makes these people misinformed and clueless.