Rip TV build?

[deadman1]

Lots of people crying that the sky is falling based on a change that is far from being live.

Do you remember when people said the same thing about the fire changes in 7.1.5?

[Alvito]

Yeah... ppl said the same thing when Blizzard decided to gut combution and nerf the shit out of fire bcs some idiots in trade chat said fire was op.

The changes to fire were a bit much seeing how it was only strong on 2 fights and they were both due to cheesing mechanics. We will see what happens, but if they lower the potential uptime of TV and bring up other things that is a net gain for most. For the top end players they will find other ways to still excel.

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Do you remember when people said the same thing about the fire changes in 7.1.5?

Do you remember the thousands of times people have flipped out over other changes that never went live or were poorly data minded? We can look at the flip side of the coin when arcane fans were over the moon because they thought arcane would be the top range spec in NH due to it's 4 set only to have it mid to lower end on pretty much everything. In short make noise if you are actually trying to change something, but test it first hand rather then taking random people spewing nonsense online at face value.

[Skylarking]

So as it stands it seems that GS build might come back. The reason for this is that flurry is getting a sizable damage increase along with frostbolt. Since these 2 spells make up the bread and butter of the GS build it is good things to come.

TBH I am glad to see TV gone, the other two spells in the row are pretty awesome, I just hope frost mage doesn't become the new fire mage.

GS is still right now a very good choice when there are 2 targets to cleave on. If at some point GS overtakes the others even in ST then you can bet it will get nerfed later just like everything else right now.

[Deleted]

People say that like blizzard is supposed to care. They still have other ways to make money.

Like what? Overwatch loot crates?

[Deleted]

So as it stands it seems that GS build might come back. The reason for this is that flurry is getting a sizable damage increase along with frostbolt. Since these 2 spells make up the bread and butter of the GS build it is good things to come.

TBH I am glad to see TV gone, the other two spells in the row are pretty awesome, I just hope frost mage doesn't become the new fire mage.

you do realize that those spells arent getting a buff, they are simply adding the spell aura buff to the spells and then remove the spell aura, so GS build isnt going to get a buff at all, it will do as well as it does now but i can imagine GS will become better simply bcoz TV will be worse than it is now.

[Sylvaeres]

People say that like blizzard is supposed to care. They still have other ways to make money.

This post is a clear indication of what it's like to have a point go over one's own head

[Dooflop]

Stay frost, jeez you act as if Frost is over now.

You will still maintain IV for 45 seconds, only people this truly nerfs are mages who can keep it up 80% uptime...

If anything this is a buff to medicore mages, it creates a higher average of IV uptime.

my bad, i was being sarcastic. Im still gonna be frost , maybe fire though cause i really like fire.

[FrostyButt]

You don't need high IV up time to be competitive. My average IV up time on boss fights in mythic is around 45% and I rank in the top 100 for parses on each boss. Out of 12,000 other people raiding as Frost.. I think that's pretty good.

[D3athsting]

No i won't play glacial spike, i tried in some m+ and when it doesn't crit hits for less than a shattered ice lance

[Dartz1979]

means more people will play fire cause i see shit tons of crit/versit gear alot over haste arcane is kinda meh seeing as you need shit tons of haste and is slow at casting.

[Braedan]

Frost will be fine, and it will scale well with increasing haste values in tos.

[Deleted]

yeah, i think ppl are greatly overestimating how big this nerf actually is, yes it is a nerf to ppl with frost gloves but it does open the window to buff frozen touch which is a talent that they have said is underperforming, so it might even out in the end or even end up as a slight buff bcoz they can now buff said talent quite significantly without having to worry about ending up giving IV 100% uptime.

one of the biggest things that help IV have such a big uptime in forzen orb and the 4pc t19 which will also be gone in ToS, so this is simply a way to increase the average uptime of IV as we will prolly end up with less overall ice lances in 7.2 but with 2pc t19 and 4pc t20 we will get a higher uptime on frozen orb and get most of the lost ice lances back through more frozen orb casts(about twice the current casts of frozen orb) along with a significantly higher uptime on the t20 2pc which is a 30% critdmg to ice lance, my napkin math(so take it with a grain of salt) would suggest that you could very possibly end up with an uptim of the 20 2pc of about 30-50% which is pretty huge since the t19 2pc and the t20 set bonuses synergize so well together that it might be worth it to use 2pc 19 and then replace the frost gloves to play t19 2pc and t20 4pc and then use the frost bracers which with these changes should overtake the gloves in terms of dps.

[D3athsting]

I can't reach 2nd frozen orb with 9.2k haste 895 whispers and 885 metronome and gloves even under TW, there are always 2-3-4 seconds missing

[Protean]

Ranged do mechanics and melee tunnel boss, smart design really!!

* Trilliax: who has to deal with cakes and robots? Ranged!
* Alueriel: who has to deal with mark of frost/fiery brand? Ranged
* Botanist: who has to deal with flowers? Ranged
* Tichondrius: who has to deal with yellow circles and adds? Ranged
* Elisande: who has to soak epocheric orbs? Ranged
* Gul'dan: who has to help break chains? Ranged

wp blizz, really!

Funny, the way I see it ranged gets to do all the fun jobs and melee are stuck playing "stare at the ass/dick" for 4 hours.

Maybe you should just switch to melee? At least ranged gets to have new, fun mechanics and also don't risk falling asleep because oh hey, another combat dummy design.

[kheath812]

Funny, the way I see it ranged gets to do all the fun jobs and melee are stuck playing "stare at the ass/dick" for 4 hours.

Maybe you should just switch to melee? At least ranged gets to have new, fun mechanics and also don't risk falling asleep because oh hey, another combat dummy design.

doing less damage for an arbitrary reason isnt fun.

[Protean]

doing less damage for an arbitrary reason isnt fun.

Guess we have no trouble agreeing that both ranged and melee gets shafted in raiding.

[Deleted]

you do realize that those spells arent getting a buff, they are simply adding the spell aura buff to the spells and then remove the spell aura, so GS build isnt going to get a buff at all, it will do as well as it does now but i can imagine GS will become better simply bcoz TV will be worse than it is now.

If frostbolt deals more dmg than GS deals also more dmg.

[Imaskar]

Frosted calculated the changes to be just -3% for LVG users and -1% for others. Also, DIL still works on PTR. IDK how can this be, but I'm a bit relieved (yet still sceptical).

[Bonkaz]

Its only a 40k dps nerf WITHOUT DIL according to latest PTR build. Frost will live on and be godly in ToS with the low cleave fights
Post-TV Nerf
Live 7.2

[Deleted]

You might not remember that period since it was a long while ago, but in the past, think Vanilla to WotLK, we the customers and players felt we had a special relation with Blizzard, WoW and the entire Warcraft franchise. It felt like Blizz was a special developer, with amazing customer support, incredible attention to detail, very skilled at story creation and lore, updating their game very often and constantly trying to balance it and so on. We felt it was worth our monthly $$$ and the expac price to be part of this world. We felt Blizzard appreciated raiders and elite PvPers and rewarded us accordingly for our time investment in their games.

While Blizzard was much different during vanilla and TBC where especially the communication felt better their are some caveats as well. Here's an overview of the differences i saw:
- Customer service was better (they had more freedom and power to help)
- Communication felt better
- Story was more world exploration than heavy story, it was much more limited and bland, but fun in a different way (MoP questzones had similiar feel for me)
- Content / balance took way longer to release except during the period of last raid to new expansion.
- Developer mindset was different, currently their is an element that player can experience as devisive like the paid services or factionwar story or like firemage this expansion.
- Their still a special company with how much and long support they give to a game. You really get your value out of games like Starcraft and Diablo and make awesome games. But they still suck at having their games make good use of powerfull hardware and an over reliance on cpu :P

For me the most unacceptable element in WoW are the majority of realms being dead for good raiding experience, it's jsut ridiculous.
I also see a lot of positives in Legion that I havn't seen in a long time.
Their initial class design goal was a succes, to make classes unique again. Their balance is awefull half the specs are good at everything and other half excell in one thing.

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Its only a 40k dps nerf WITHOUT DIL according to latest PTR build. Frost will live on and be godly in ToS with the low cleave fights
Post-TV Nerf
Live 7.2

thanks for the links havnt seen that yet,
I really hope they remove the double icelance thing as it makes me tunnel the target even more as i want to use shimmer charges for it.