Housing Affordability

[Celista]

The reason no one is talking about it, is because these are local issues, not national issues. I don't give a damn if a few popular cities costs of living are unbelievable. That's a product of their own success. Eventually the people they want to hire won't be able to afford to move there for work and the businesses can either a) inflate their wages/costs or b) move their offices/facilities where people work to less congested areas.

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Here's my cities indices compared to New York:

New York is 100%, this means rent is 31.36% of that of New York on average.

I'm in Des Moines, Iowa. It is far more expensive here than in the rest of the state. Rent costs are the one thing most of Americans won't complain about, when you compare it to the rest of the cost of living expenses.

Index Info
Cost of Living Index (Excl.Rent): 76.70
Rent Index: 31.36
Groceries Index: 87.26
Restaurants Index: 65.48
Cost of Living Plus Rent Index: 54.59
Local Purchasing Power: 94.64

I think you're misreading the statistics. 100 is the US average. Below 100 = below the US average. Your rent index is 31. Your overall cost of living index is 76.

Just because your immediate area is cheap doesn't mean the rest of the US is, "outside of a few cities" as you put it.

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its not about compasion its about facts

do i feel sorry for those people ? ofc i do but life is brutal - and a summ of choice one makes in it - if they choose path of least resistance didnt learn in in school and end up in shit job - its their own fault.

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see i find comments like this hillarius - every actor will tell you that you need to be quite inteleigent in order to succesfully act as if you were stupid

people who make milions of $$$ arent stupid - just becuase they act as it doesnt mean they are - they build whole empire around pretended stupidity - and guess what it worked more then well

so why woudl you condemnd them ?

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i wouldnt call person who convinced a country to elect him president dumb. just like Kardashins 99,9 % of it is pure act i bet.

You made like 50 typos, this was extremely hard to read lol. To address your point, you can tell just by listening to them in interviews that they're as bright as a box of rocks. Of course it could be a facade to appeal to stupid people, I suppose. But that would be some pretty dedicated acting.

[kaid]

If that was the case, people would be having trouble finding housing of any kind. But they're not.

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Where do you live?

Green bay Wisconsin.

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There is a reason a lot of companies like facebook are doing big datacenters in the midwest. Good access to work force and you can pay them a moderate amount but the cost of living in the areas is low enough that even a moderate salary works out to be a very nice income compared to what the cost outlays out on the coasts are. I may make half of what my friends in california do but my mortgage is 537 a month and that is with the insurance and tax stuff included.

[McFuu]

If that was the case, people would be having trouble finding housing of any kind. But they're not.

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Are you in the same thread I am? The one where people can't find affordable housing where they want to live?

What do you think is driving pricing? It's availability, all other factors take a back seat to availability. There aren't enough homes on the market in my town to handle half the apartments in my complex if they wanted to move into homes.

Simply put, too many people want to live in areas that don't have the housing for it. They can find homes in far away areas, but construction in major areas had not kept pace with population demands.

[TheTaurenOrc]

so maybe you buy it and instead paying 2k $ per month to some random idiot be done in 30-40 months. no honestly take loan and then take 2 students/roomates tell each of them to pay 500 $ a month you add 1000 and be dont in 3-4 years . but no most people rather pay rent - idiots in my eyes but hey if they like to be dumb its their choice.

its a bs that previous generations could easily afford buying houses - they were paying 20-30 years loans in order to do so - and why should millenials be different ?

Lol did you think I was suggesting they should be able to pay it off outright? haha its a struggle enough to get the $25k together for down-payment and closing costs. So best case they would still be paying a 30 year loan.

[Kujako]

Lol did you think I was suggesting they should be able to pay it off outright? haha its a struggle enough to get the $25k together for down-payment and closing costs. So best case they would still be paying a 30 year loan.

Borrowed money from my 401k for my down payment. Just about got that paid back, to myself.

[Celista]

Are you in the same thread I am? The one where people can't find affordable housing where they want to live?

What do you think is driving pricing? It's availability, all other factors take a back seat to availability. There aren't enough homes on the market in my town to handle half the apartments in my complex if they wanted to move into homes.

Simply put, too many people want to live in areas that don't have the housing for it. They can find homes in far away areas, but construction in major areas had not kept pace with population demands.

Sure but his argument was about birth rates in relation to construction being the central driver of the shortage. I don't think that's really relevant. People are leaving areas like the Midwest for coastal cities. The reasons for this are complex; some of them are looking for work and others are looking for a QOL change. There's a lot of moving around, with some cities seeing huge population losses and others seeing a huge influx of new residents. Some cities like Portland with urban growth boundaries are seeing skyrocketing housing prices because of those growth boundaries + sudden demand.

Supply and demand is always relevant but I don't think the "demand" side boils down to "birth rates".

[ThatsOurEric]

the are asking for the amount people are willing to pay

And that makes it okay?

Legit, there is so much utter ignorance in your response that its almost baffling.

just because you are to poor to pay it its your problem - clearly there is ton of people who are willing to pay it

That does not make it okay, considering that I am far from being the only person who cannot afford a **decent**
apartment by myself, due to the low paying jobs (and the ones that pay well, have absurdly high standards), thus
making it quite difficult for people to find a cheap place in general. And "cheap" places are usually not so cool areas
and ghettos.

if it werent those flats would be empty - if they arent it means its working ok

Actually, from what I've read, that is a serious problem in the state that is recognized. So just
because "its working ok", does not mean there isn't an actual problem.

Capitalism : God's way of determining who is smart and who is poor

And this right here, is the cusp of ignorance.

What you mean to say is, "Capitalism : MAN'S way of determining who can get rich
the fastest and make money off of the other man."

life is hard - people need to get used to it instead whining like kids.

The only thing worse than those people are the ones who apparently, have little to
no existent humanity or compassion. Sounds like someone grew up privileged!

And yet, we still don't have $15 minimum wage. But that's OK, cause I hear cardboard boxes make great homes.

I'd like to thank that fat, cancerous pustule known as Chris Christie for that.

As well as every (feels like) Republican who thinks that raises in min. wage is bad for the economy (fun fact, it isn't).

[Celista]

Green bay Wisconsin.

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There is a reason a lot of companies like facebook are doing big datacenters in the midwest. Good access to work force and you can pay them a moderate amount but the cost of living in the areas is low enough that even a moderate salary works out to be a very nice income compared to what the cost outlays out on the coasts are. I may make half of what my friends in california do but my mortgage is 537 a month and that is with the insurance and tax stuff included.

Yeah. I completed my undergrad in Chicago, debating whether I should move back to the Midwest. I could get a condo for $100k easily. Out here in Portland, prices are easily 2-3 times that.

Alternatively I'm considering moving further out (also considering moving north to Canada but that's a story for another day), but traffic here is becoming a nightmare. Overall I'd prefer to stay in the Pacific Northwest, I moved out here for mountains and hiking and while I liked living in Chicago, that is what I missed after growing up in Alaska.

[Rasulis]

Places like SF, LA, NY and SD are precursors. Those are considered desirable places with good job opportunities, so they are the first to run into the issue of affordable housing. Now major population areas in other states (WA, OR, TX, MA, etc.) are experiencing the same problem. In fact, housing markets in many of these places appreciate faster than CA. Last year the housing market in Houston appreciates 11.76%. Portland increased by 17% in 2016. Those numbers double and triple SF, LA and SD numbers which hover between 5.3% and 5.8%.

How do we solve the issue? I don’t know. Right now rents and occupancy are at record high. So developers are putting most of their money into building rental properties. Right now in San Diego, you see mostly two types of residential construction. Low income (rental) housing which is heavily subsidized, and high end rentals (in the $2,000 to $4,000 range). Pardee (one of the biggest housing developer in the nation) only has 10 projects in SD, and they are small projects. Nothing like the old days of large planned communities like Eastlake, Otay Ranch and Rancho del Rey.

My personal opinion is that until the rental market goes bust, the developers won’t be spending any serious financing toward new housing projects. Until that happens, supply will stay limited, and price will keep increasing.

[Kujako]

And that makes it okay?

According to economic theory, yes?

[Barnabas]

Places like SF, LA, NY and SD are precursors. Those are considered desirable places with good job opportunities, so they are the first to run into the issue of affordable housing. Now major population areas in other states (WA, OR, TX, MA, etc.) are experiencing the same problem. In fact, housing markets in many of these places appreciate faster than CA. Last year the housing market in Houston appreciates 11.76%. Portland increased by 17% in 2016. Those numbers double and triple SF, LA and SD numbers which hover between 5.3% and 5.8%.

How do we solve the issue? I don’t know. Right now rents and occupancy are at record high. So developers are putting most of their money into building rental properties. Right now in San Diego, you see mostly two types of residential construction. Low income (rental) housing which is heavily subsidized, and high end rentals (in the $2,000 to $4,000 range). Pardee (one of the biggest housing developer in the nation) only has 10 projects in SD, and they are small projects. Nothing like the old days of large planned communities like Eastlake, Otay Ranch and Rancho del Rey.

My personal opinion is that until the rental market goes bust, the developers won’t be spending any serious financing toward new housing projects. Until that happens, supply will stay limited, and price will keep increasing.

You solve it by removing the possibility of groups of investors from taking over the supply side of the housing market. Thereby releasing that added pressure on the market that is unnatural.

[McFuu]

Sure but his argument was about birth rates in relation to construction being the central driver of the shortage. I don't think that's really relevant. People are leaving areas like the Midwest for coastal cities. The reasons for this are complex; some of them are looking for work and others are looking for a QOL change. There's a lot of moving around, with some cities seeing huge population losses and others seeing a huge influx of new residents. Some cities like Portland with urban growth boundaries are seeing skyrocketing housing prices because of those growth boundaries + sudden demand.

Supply and demand is always relevant but I don't think the "demand" side boils down to "birth rates".

That's my argument, and simply speaking it's true. Yes people are moving, but areas like the Tri-state NYC/NJ/Penn suffer not only from people moving in, but the amount of people already here. People moving around is secondary to the amount of people period. It's a given the population is going to want to live in "popular" areas, for both jobs, recreation, QOL etc... These areas are finite in space, convincing someone to move to the edge (suburbs) of NYC isn't really feasible unless they want to be there. In general if we say 80% of the population lives within 20 miles of the coastline, when you go from 100 million people to 400 million people the problem isn't a couple of more people moving into the area, the area isn't big enough to hold the expanding population that already lives there. Hence housing shortages.

[Themanintobuildafire]

This is a classic, pathetic issue only for the snowflake generation.

"poor pitiful me, I aint getting everything handed to me, so it's unfair". WHYYYYY

I'm curious what your age is and where you live, as well as the cost of houses where you live. The area I grew up in as a kid was considered a "poor" neighborhood and yet the houses in that area are not less than 1 million dollars today. Who could afford to pay that for a house who makes an average income?

I don't see it as entitlement rather that local governments aren't thinking ahead to provide affordable housing for younger people, or those who just don't make 100k + a year in household income, which in Canada is the majority.

Perhaps if you said "boo hoo you can't get a 4000sq ft home" you could use the "handed to me" argument. But basic housing is no joke.

[kamuimac]

The only thing worse than those people are the ones who apparently, have little to
no existent humanity or compassion. Sounds like someone grew up privileged!
.

and here you missed completly - i was on border of being poor when growing up - my parents never had time because they were both working hard - and seeing that shaped me up and gave me f...ton of motivation to never be in that position - when i was a kid i was never hungry i had always clean cloths and good conditions to learn - but at the same time i was never able to go on vacation abroad , to have designers clothes , cool stuff etc etc - but this motivated me - i wasnt just bathing in "unfairness" of world - i worked my butt off in school then in Uni and guess what it payed of because since high school i had decent pocket change from scholarip for good grades - same in Uni i worked very hard and never missed scholarship - thats why i know that people who complain are just plain lazy and want everything on silver platter.

people in west are simply .... weak. both mentaly and physicaly - thats why immigrants win so easily over them - because most of them never encountered how hard real life is when growing up - and when bubble burst between 25-30 - oh gosh how unfair world seems to them - exept it was always unfair just its their parents fault for not teaching them that.

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I'm curious what your age is and where you live, as well as the cost of houses where you live. The area I grew up in as a kid was considered a "poor" neighborhood and yet the houses in that area are not less than 1 million dollars today. Who could afford to pay that for a house who makes an average income?

I don't see it as entitlement rather that local governments aren't thinking ahead to provide affordable housing for younger people, or those who just don't make 100k + a year in household income, which in Canada is the majority.

Perhaps if you said "boo hoo you can't get a 4000sq ft home" you could use the "handed to me" argument. But basic housing is no joke.

so you should live with your parents and save every $ untill you will be able to take loan

i see a lot of shaming for people who still live with parents when its simply wrong - beggars cant be choosers - instead paying someone else live with parents for couple of years untill you will buy your own place - or build their home bigger and live on 2nd floor while they are below - its not a shame - stupid people make it a shame.

[Macaquerie]

Sure but his argument was about birth rates in relation to construction being the central driver of the shortage. I don't think that's really relevant. People are leaving areas like the Midwest for coastal cities. The reasons for this are complex; some of them are looking for work and others are looking for a QOL change. There's a lot of moving around, with some cities seeing huge population losses and others seeing a huge influx of new residents. Some cities like Portland with urban growth boundaries are seeing skyrocketing housing prices because of those growth boundaries + sudden demand.

Supply and demand is always relevant but I don't think the "demand" side boils down to "birth rates".

A big reason why people aren't really sympathetic to complaints about housing prices is precisely because of the impression, rightly or wrongly, that it's mostly a product of young people flooding into cities more for the social life than for job opportunities, since the latter obviously aren't nearly as plentiful in big cities as everyone thinks or else cost of living wouldn't be an issue in the first place.

[Hiricine]

Housing has always been a balancing act. Jobs tend to migrate towards cities, but the cost of living is cheaper the farther away you get.

Millenials will do what every generation in the past has done--- move farther away, build new towns, and live there. Its not like these large cities were built overnight, many of the parents of Millenials originally lived in towns where there were block and blocks of empty houses when theirs was built. The idea that everyone should be living in a major metropolitan area is silly.

[Aggrophobic]

Finding somewhere to live in the larger cities here in Sweden is hard and expensive as heck.
Actually buying a house if you're ok with living a bit outside of town is not that hard though.

Lots of space over here, after all.

But let me get this straight: So you (or australians) are blaming immigrants that actually bring money for your own lack of success?
Odd. People usually blame the poor immigrants and actual refugees for their own problems. Well, as long as you can blame someone else and not change anything about yourself, eh?

[ProfessorTjc]

In Florida specifically it's ridiculous. Like 42% of people between the ages of 18-35 still live with their parents.

[kamuimac]

In Florida specifically it's ridiculous. Like 42% of people between the ages of 18-35 still live with their parents.

its nothing ridiculous - poor people lived like this for ages - in big homes where whole 3-4 generations of family lived

if anything last 100 years was expetion from rule - we are slowly returning to how it supposed to be - part of society always was a slave class - they are not called that naymore and have illusion of freedom but slaves are slaves.

[P for Pancetta]

that house looks like a deathtrap in stormy weather. also i don't see a laundry room or bathroom or anyplace private to do....more private activities. in 50+mph winds that "house" is NOT shelter it's a metal coffin. hell a f1 tornado would lift that right off the fucking ground and you would be dead. hurricane wise a category 2 would be enough to demolish that house. it also has no basement for bad weather. even the clouds in the picture look like they disapprove of the "house". at best it looks like temporary shelter for a hotel guest or something at a fancy hotel for the rich.

It's just an example, probably a vacation home. Generally these are bolted onto concrete foundations and if you want you could easily add a basement of the size you desire. You build the house you need depending on where you live, if you live in a tornado heavy environment you might not want a huge overhanging bedroom. There are many people living in tornado areas who build themselves containers houses because they barely take any damage at all. Personally I would have never used a single container for a floor, the rooms that way are just way to tight. I understand people who don't like the appeal, because it's not for everyone and building your own house requires a lot of skill and devotion something most people lack. But these things are in no way deathtraps or structurally unsound if constructed properly.

That'll only work in places where there are close to no building codes and regulations to follow. Here those are extremely well defined, and something like that would never be allowed. Those walls don't meet regulation thickness, insulations or anything really, and the windows are far more than 20% or whatever it was of window to wall ratio allowed.

You are allowed to build these kind of houses in the United States and most countries in Europe. You don't just put the containers in and decorate them. You reinforce the structure with steam beams, add insulation etc. The picture I provided is one of the simplest ways to go about it, and it looks like a vacation home to me. But you often see people adding panelings on the outside of the container to cover up the appearance and make it look like a conventional modern home. In most places it's not to hard to adhere to the strict building codes while using containers as a base for your house.

When talking about price you can get a 40ft shipping container for as low as 1500 dollars.