Zoldyc vs mantle

[cypherx]

Have both assasination legendaries and mantle (shoulders) too. Wondering what is 2 best legendaries now and on what encounter ? Thanks.

[Deleted]

Generally shoulders+boots are best. Boots+bracers and shoulders+bracers are quite good as well. Overall mantle is probably the best legendary right now. Especially on shorter fights the fat opener makes them very strong, but they obviously are also good in long fights. Though on long fights you also would be fine without them. Boots+bracers are strong on long fights especially when you can squeeze 2-3 vendettas into the 30% phase.

With T20 set boni this all might change. Envenom will do less damage without T19 4-piece and it seems like Blizzard will get rid off Agonizing Poison. This should decrease the burst with shoulders. With T20 boni focussing on garrote damage and deadly poison coming back the bracers probably will be significantly better than they are now.

[Crookids]

Bracers are becoming simply too situational. Execute phase must be decent, RNG is even more prevelant hoping for good procs sub 30%, anything such as quickly dying mobs/farm bosses it becomes underwhelming -- the list goes on.

I remember when I first got them I was revealing in top Rogue deeps but now the shoulders just overpower them massively in almost every way. There's very few fights I'll beat the rogue that has shoulders in my raid and on new bosses (bracers are just a stat stick when learning encounters) and farm it's discouraging as hell.

Of course I've been trying to get the shoulders for way too long now spending every shard on relinquished splaulders and running/playing way more than I would like. It's down to two sin legs left I can get. Including multi spec. Bet I don't get it before I get the second.

It's doubly frustrating because they're excellent for all other specs. Would love to switch to sub for M+s but pretty beat with my sin legs.

[Eazy]

I heard that Boots+Bracers for longer fight and boots+shoulders for shorter.

Not sure if that's true, but I always thought that boots+bracers are better than boots+shoulders.

[Ryuken]

Curious about this as well ^.^ been out of the loop just getting back in

[Dieselol]

Boots shoulder - no contest

[Halobob87]

Shoulder are BiS, no reason to use bracers over shoulders.

[ScrubRouge]

Bracers are becoming simply too situational. Execute phase must be decent, RNG is even more prevelant hoping for good procs sub 30%, anything such as quickly dying mobs/farm bosses it becomes underwhelming -- the list goes on.

I remember when I first got them I was revealing in top Rogue deeps but now the shoulders just overpower them massively in almost every way. There's very few fights I'll beat the rogue that has shoulders in my raid and on new bosses (bracers are just a stat stick when learning encounters) and farm it's discouraging as hell.

Of course I've been trying to get the shoulders for way too long now spending every shard on relinquished splaulders and running/playing way more than I would like. It's down to two sin legs left I can get. Including multi spec. Bet I don't get it before I get the second.

It's doubly frustrating because they're excellent for all other specs. Would love to switch to sub for M+s but pretty beat with my sin legs.

I feel you. Sometimes I hate H NH clear nights. I too dont have the shoulders. 8/10 legos... I can't get high parses since 7.2 because RNG is all the skill you need (thanks bag of tricks proc chance change).

But yes, right now the shoulders + boots is king (assuming you have a high ilvl draught of souls). It is also super effective during burst phases such as Skorp Exposed phase and Chorno post interrupt.

Fights with multiple execute phases bumps the value of Bracers which is worth keeping in mind. M Guldan, Elissand, M botanist. But if your kill times are super short, ride that 3.5mil opener burst to victory.

7.2.5 also has a chance to flip the priority back to Bracer + boots due to potential removal of AP. However, bleed spec might make a return due to this, which means exsang + Shoulder is a lot of dmg. it's all speculation though.
But as it stands assuming ideal gear on ST over a 4 - 5 min fight....
#1 Shoulders + Boots
#2 Bracer + Boots
#3 Shoulders + Bracer

At least ill have the shoulders for Tomb...... yyaayyy..... -.-'

[iky43210]

shoulder will lose alot of value once we lose t19 4pc. Also Bleeds benefits far more from bracer than shoulders

[sirethas]

In next patch wrists will get much higher value, since as stated they want to replace agonizing poison with some kind of AoE poison and t20 will be designed around garrote(hopefuly further buffed than what is now), which leaves two option for single target:
Alacrity and Exsang
If Alacrity will pull ahead then boots + wrists will be definetly better, if Exsang will be better for single target(I believe this is their intend, and having alacrity for 2-3 target cleave) a believe that shoulders will still be very strong with Exsanguinate in it, this might make Shoulders + Wrists best combo.

As for now I guess the outcome will be:
Heavy AoE fights and dungs -> new talent replacing agonizing (shouders + boots)
2-3 targets -> Alacrity (boots + wrists)
Single Target -> Exsanguinate (shoulders + wrists)

From this you can already say that legendary usage will be situational.
But I might be completly wrong as well, this was just wild guess ^_^

[Adalwolf]

which leaves two option for single target:
Alacrity and Exsang

Alacrity will be removed for Assassination, the same way it was removed for Subtlety. It just doesn't have the same synergy for us as it has with Outlaw. They can ramp up 10 stacks in a few seconds, while for us it is a lot more punishing. My guess is that there will be Exsang, a talent that buffs our poison damage and the AoE-on-demand talent.

[Elyzibeth]

So I sat down the other day on AMR (askmrrobot.com) and simmed this because Saturday I got my boots (9th legendary). I already had my bracers and shoulders. I ran the 300 second long Krosus fight sim. They came out as follows for dps priority.

Shoulder + boots
Shoulders + bracers
Boots + bracers

Also one thing to note: For shoulders + boots high item level trinkets tend to come out ahead of DOS. if a fight is 2.5 minutes or less, DOS pulls ahead, but on longer fights the high agility scales very well with DOS and pulls well into the lead. my 895 DOS is getting shelved for a 905 socketed Tirathon's trinket, my 910 foci is just slightly less dps than that, followed by my DOS.

Now, all the talk about t19 making the shoulders worse than the bracers blah blah blah. I also took those set ups and swapped around my gear. Legendary rankings stayed the same as listed above. Then to even test further, the naysayers of "shoulders are going away because you can wear t19 two piece, and t20 four piece bonuses. When I re arranged the gear to get the best tier pieces for each set with the best stat priority, I am heroic or mythic equipped currently, so I selected heroic versions of the tier 20 and left my tier 19 at 890 item level. The difference in the item level plus taking off the shoulders made it a DPS LOSS to wear tier 19 two piece and tier 20 four piece.

Now to throw in a disclaimer, This was all run with the current MP/AP spec. This obviously is going to change, but if anything stays similar to what it is now, you will still want the shoulders paired with either boots or bracers.

My character:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...yzibeth/simple

One thing you will notice with shoulders/boots is that with the boots you get to do more envenoms which leads to more chances at BOT procs. When I was running shoulder/bracers, and our other guild rogue was running shoulders/boots, he generally pulled more poison bomb damage than me.

[Unforgivenn]

i'll ask there to noy open another topic:

just got mantle today, and i'll want to switch to it..

mantle + boots or mantle + ring ? which one is better?

and, in talents, still to with nightstalker or change to subtefurge ?

[Crookids]

i'll ask there to noy open another topic:

just got mantle today, and i'll want to switch to it..

mantle + boots or mantle + ring ? which one is better?

and, in talents, still to with nightstalker or change to subtefurge ?

Read above.

Subterfuge but some Rogues stay Nightstalker.

[Deleted]

Read above.

Subterfuge but some Rogues stay Nightstalker.

Shouldn't we be back to Nightstalker now subterfuge no longer extends the mantle buff?

[Cunky]

Shouldn't we be back to Nightstalker now subterfuge no longer extends the mantle buff?

Subterfuge sims slightly higher than NS even with that change. I still use NS though because it's a small dps loss and I like having my stealth bars set up for pvp. Also, if you have shoulders you'll be seeing 4.5M envs (with NS) depending on your trinkets which is enjoyable enough to give up the small amount of dps.

[Crookids]

Subterfuge sims slightly higher than NS even with that change. I still use NS though because it's a small dps loss and I like having my stealth bars set up for pvp. Also, if you have shoulders you'll be seeing 4.5M envs (with NS) depending on your trinkets which is enjoyable enough to give up the small amount of dps.

This. /10char

[Deleted]

Just finished Gul'dan mythic progress, and for our raid team with 2 rogues, we found that bracers were better than shoulders, paired with boots. The extra damage from shoulders generally comes at times when you don't really need it; and the additional damage from bracers, while marginal from low hp adds, is pretty worthwhile to on guldan to phase him before a storm and another eye, and illidan in phase 3 for overall pushing of the boss. We shouldn't have to help with Soul adds next week, so we can use our dps cooldowns on illidan / save for the nuke, which the bracers will do even more damage than the shoulders would, once again.

I can also see bracers being better than shoulders on Krosus / Star Augur / Tichondrius especially when saving cds for dmg phase to name a few.

[Deleted]

Just finished Gul'dan mythic progress, and for our raid team with 2 rogues, we found that bracers were better than shoulders, paired with boots. The extra damage from shoulders generally comes at times when you don't really need it; and the additional damage from bracers, while marginal from low hp adds, is pretty worthwhile to on guldan to phase him before a storm and another eye, and illidan in phase 3 for overall pushing of the boss. We shouldn't have to help with Soul adds next week, so we can use our dps cooldowns on illidan / save for the nuke, which the bracers will do even more damage than the shoulders would, once again.

I can also see bracers being better than shoulders on Krosus / Star Augur / Tichondrius especially when saving cds for dmg phase to name a few.

The bracers give you virtually nothing unless you are lucky with poison bomb procs...

[Deleted]

Right, but you can use shoulders and get extra damage to kill hand of guldan adds faster than they need to be killed, since you're generally saving your dps cooldowns in phase 1 and 2 (specifically vanish) for these adds, or use bracers and do more overall damage at times when you actually need the extra damage, including higher rupture damage through nightstalker.

I dunno, you're entitled to your opinion on how bracers give you virtually nothing but I killed Gul'dan mythic last night so I must be able to talk some sense.