Should Argus have flying straight away or not?

[Deleted]

Not only should it have flying from the start, it should be designed around flying, like Icecrown and Storm Peaks. Making it unflyable would be a slap in the face for everyone who has unlocked flying.

I don't care about flying really but I have to agree with this. Loads of people like flying and it's not hard to create a zone that has flying considered.

[Kynario]

It'll probably just be a relatively small zone... Don't understand why people are expecting something huge. I'm cool with no-flying though. Flying ruins the immersion for me.

[Extremity]

It's hard for me to imagine them adding a new zone with flying enabled. The entire purpose of disabling flying in the first place is to make sure that people 1) See the content as intended, 2) Cannot skip relevant content, and 3) Cannot entirely avoid combat, whether it's PVE or PVP.

They quite clearly do not want us porting to Argus and flying to our objectives 500 feet up in the air. Honestly, I'm more worried about whether the Glider/Emerald Winds combo will work. I can deal with not having flying flying, because most of the times I really need to travel a long distance I can climb a mountain or bounce upwards with my Gnomish Gravity Well, and then glide+winds. Will Argus be considered a part of the "Broken Isles", though? Many Legion toys, travel-related or not, are restricted to the Broken Isles. From a technical perspective, Argus clearly is not part of the Isles, but from a gameplay perspective those requirements generally mean "part of the related expansion" moreso than "physically on this precise landmass".

Flying is pretty much guaranteed to be disabled there, at least for a while - whether or not they eventually enable it, I don't know. Considering Argus is most likely our last piece of new content/land for the expansion, it's possible they'll just never allow flying a-la Timeless Isle. Or, if they do, it'll be done once we don't really care about exploring there anymore anyways.

As I said before, my main concern isn't flying, it's whether or not the Broken Isles requirement on items like the Emerald Winds will be met while on Argus.

[Laerrus]

Yes. And make it absolutely necessary to do content in the zone. Have questing areas up on floating islands/mountains, you have to use it to reach an objective in a deep chasm, etc.

For those players returning to game and have not unlocked Legion flying, have a rent-a-mount available for them.

[Tojara]

It doesn't actually matter how it's designed at this point. They've given players access to flight again and have to deal with the ramifications of that. If they try to take flying away again after making players jump through so many hoops to get it, they're going to run into problems similar to 6.2 where they had to scramble to re-enable flight on short notice.

I really don't think the community will stand for it.

It matters plenty. If they feel like the zone is small or contained enough that flying doesn't feel right, they simply aren't going to allow flying. As illustrated above they do this with plenty of new areas they add after launch content anyway. They simply could just go the route they've done in 90% of the patches they created in the past and simply add no outdoor content and just add a raid. That functionally means the patch is a no fly patch because you can't fly in instances or raids anyway lol.

A Tanaan Jungle sized zone, designed something along those lines lends itself to flying. If they go with something like Isle of Thunder or Molten Front, flying won't 'feel' (opinion) right.

It's not really taking away flying so much as it's not allowing it in a new area. Flying feels great in Broken Shore, most people probably won't care if the brand new areas isn't flying accessible at all, they might care if it's allowed but you have to earn it again. The only thing I'm really inclined to agree with is it should really either be flying from the get go, or have no flying at all. Having an achievement just to fly in a new area would be silly.

Honestly considering Argus is a broken world, having flying to the point where you can choose to fly to floating island land masses would be unique design, and something they really haven't taken advantage of in any expansion. I'm of the opinion flying really doesn't enhance the game all that much, but if they actually designed an entire area fully around it, well it could be cool (Storm Peaks really doesn't count).

[Deleted]

tbc had flying - good expansion
wrath had flying - good expansion
cata had flying - good expansion
mop had flying - good expansion
wod had no flying - awful expansion
legion had no flying - awful expansion

[Coffeexbean]

hopefully no. with flying the world lacks any danger.



are you dumb? players have the so called efficiency-fun dilemma. they want to have fun, but they also want to be efficient. flying makes things way too efficient to leave out, so you are pretty much forced to use it.

this is exactly how I feel about the WQGF add on. Its a sad in WoW when you cant find ANYBODY in trade/general to join your group to go out and do all the broken shore dailies. Everybody rather group hop because its more efficient but it sure as hell isnt more fun than hanging and making conversation with players as an mmo is intended

[Lord Pebbleton]

All of those zones up until the abomination of WoD had flight available to players at launch, with no-fly zones coming later on.

Legion has reversed that order by withholding flight until later in the expansion, with no-fly across the board early in the expansion.

There is no reason to expect that Argus will be a no-fly zone based on previous expansions. In fact, if Blizzard drops a no-fly area so soon after releasing flight back to players, chances are good there will be some backlash as Blizzard basically pulls a bait and switch. Although to be brutally honest, anyone who's stuck around with Legion's bullshit handling of flight this far probably wouldn't bat an eye.

Having said that, however, I think there's a fair to decent chance that Argus has some method of obtaining flight in its zones fairly early.

What do you mean? All the isles I've mentioned don't have flying as of today.
Also Blizzard's policy about flying has clearly steered towards the "you want it, you work for it". I can't see Argus having flight right away. Maybe a Pathfinder: Part Three.

[Deleted]

Please don't make it a Pathfinder 3, ESPECIALLY not a nonsensical one like part 2. Part 2 used to be somewhat of an achievement when the invasions were part of it, but a simple, stupid and totally uninspired rep grind is just crying "Sorry, we couldn't find anything cool, so we made it a rep grind".

Pathfinder DID make sense in WoD where you had to get a certain number of treasures and rares, some of them difficult to reach. That way, you had to prove that you can navigate difficult terrain even without flying. Admittedly, jump'n'run features in WoW are a bit like cut-scenes in a chess game: Just not the right platform / environment for it, but at least it could be construed as making sense.

And - more importantly - I hope they DO NOT design Argus with flying in mind. Broken Shore was just the pinnacle of an example just WHY people want to fly in the first place: Unnecessary casms, inescapable pools of fel that kill you, and the most insane case of "How can we make you run 5x around the target location just because of terrain". Design it in a way that doesn't punish not having flight and I'm OK with it not having it.

[SirCowdog]

It's not really taking away flying so much as it's not allowing it in a new area.

Do you really believe that line of bullshit? "I'm not really taking away your fun. I'm just not allowing you to have fun in the first place".

Seriously....GTFO with that 'logic'.

What do you mean? All the isles I've mentioned don't have flying as of today.
Also Blizzard's policy about flying has clearly steered towards the "you want it, you work for it". I can't see Argus having flight right away. Maybe a Pathfinder: Part Three.

What part of my post wasn't clear? I was talking about the context that those no-flying islands were implemented in. It's one thing to drop a no-flying island into the scope of a larger expansion which has had flight available to players since the launch patch. It's another thing entirely to withhold flight for most of the expansion, make players jump through a bunch of nonsensical hoops in order to get it back, then turn around and deny players flying again in a relatively short period of time.

It ends up feeling like this:

[Valnoressa]

Technically the Broken Isles pathfinder achievements shouldn't apply to Argus.

Argus isn't the Broken Isles, it's a whole other planet far off in the twisting nether. I think it's a safe assumption that Blizzard will see it this way too.

[Krokofant]

I feel they miss out to utilise flying.
Getting flying could be more content like in BC. (Ogrila etc.)
Places you can't get to until you get flying, locking up new content after flying. This content can even be specialised around the flying.
That way it would feel extra good to get the pathfinder achieve. And also something special to work for.

[Lord Pebbleton]

What part of my post wasn't clear? I was talking about the context that those no-flying islands were implemented in. It's one thing to drop a no-flying island into the scope of a larger expansion which has had flight available to players since the launch patch. It's another thing entirely to withhold flight for most of the expansion, make players jump through a bunch of nonsensical hoops in order to get it back, then turn around and deny players flying again in a relatively short period of time.

I didn't get the part about the context. Now I do.
I too would rather just fly straight away, I was just pointing out the trend that seems to be the norm nowadays. Basing on what we've had fo ar, I could see them implementing flying bit by bit, expansion after expansion, tying it with achievements, wether I like it or not.

[ItachiZaku]

Absolutely not. If they do, I hope there is some sort of death ray that blows you out of the air if you get too high (slightly higher than jump height) and as such, you don't get flight speeds either.

It's a foreign world, I'd think they should force us to wear oxygen masks and we can't fly cuz the masks freak the mounts out... so we can't even use ground mounts :smirk:

- - - Updated - - -

It's not really taking away flying so much as it's not allowing it in a new area.

Exactly. Argus is a completely different planet, makes no sense to be able to fly there.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, Argus is suppose to be their homeworld... so it should be massive. It won't be, cuz blizz is a fairly small and poor company and you add in the massively toxic player base and they simply would not be able to make this place as it should.

[Granyala]

Argus should be built with flying in mind, as it is a shattered planet.

[JamesMartigo]

Personal order of preference:

1. Zone designed specifically for Flight gameplay, with flight unlocked immediately.

2. Zone designed for ground gameplay, with flight delayed.

3. Zone designed for ground gameplay, with flight unlocked immediately.

4. Zone designed for ground gameplay, with no flight ever.

Same here, although I really hate #4

[Deleted]

snip
It's a foreign world, I'd think they should force us to wear oxygen masks and we can't fly cuz the masks freak the mounts out... so we can't even use ground mounts :smirk:

Also, Argus is suppose to be their homeworld... so it should be massive. It won't be, cuz blizz is a fairly small and poor company and you add in the massively toxic player base and they simply would not be able to make this place as it should.

No Ground mounts and only walking speed (because you would not get enough oxygen otherwise) and you will have to hearth back to get a new oxygen mask every 3 minutes would solve this problem as they would only have to design a really small landmass and still it would take ages to get around it.

Perfect solution.

In case you didn't notice: This was sarcasm, driving the "no-fly" defenders ideas to the extreme...

[Chrno]

I fully expect Argus to be build arround flying with floating islands / quest hebs.
It should be a real alien planet'ish kinda thing right ? ! ?

PS: this is actually comming from a anti-flight guy, and im serious. i would actually like a true 3D quest zone build arround flight.

[Extremity]

...It won't be, cuz blizz is a fairly small and poor company and you add in the massively toxic player base and they simply would not be able to make this place as it should.

Small? POOR? Whaaaaat? "Poor" is one of the last adjectives I would use to describe Blizzard, with or without Activision.

[WowIsDead64]

If Argus will be TI-like no flying zone - that will mean no content for me in 7.3, i.e. same crap, as back in MOP, when both 5.2 and 5.3 had no content for me, so I was unsubbed within almost whole life span of this xpack. And as I'm very close to completing my WOD stuff - this may mean, I will quit Wow at least till next xpack very soon.