The universe is expanding into...?

[frogger237]

The universe is procedurally generated, there is no edge. It "expands" into itself.

[Deleted]

Well, i think purpose is just an human concept. The universe does not need to have it.

For example, whats the purpose of that photon the sun emitted right now, that probably will travel forever trough the universe and never hit anything ? Why does it even have to exist ?

Its all a big waste of energy. But it exists not because it has a purpose. It just exists because that's how stuff works.

It's not about purpose, but actual origin. I'm not asking what purpose existence serves, but why it is there at all.

Perhaps there are different realities that are not connected to each other at all. Maybe there's one reality with its infinite universes, another with its own, maybe one where there's Paradise or one with Hell. One where there's just a person sitting and laughing and not doing anything else. We cannot rule anything out, really.

[Shortsy]

If I were to throw a guess, it'd be expanding into further empty void, or perhaps the events of the Big Bang are still happening and it's creating brand new galaxies/stars/planetary bodies etc and we may find them sometime in the next few millennia. It's one of those fun little philosophical questions we can only ponder until we pull the trigger and explore it.

[Deleted]

Well, i think purpose is just an human concept. The universe does not need to have it.

For example, whats the purpose of that photon the sun emitted right now, that probably will travel forever trough the universe and never hit anything ? Why does it even have to exist ?

Its all a big waste of energy. But it exists not because it has a purpose. It just exists because that's how stuff works.

well, techinically that photon exist bcoz of the fusion processes in the sun and then take a long time to reach the surface and be emitted but you're right, its like nature, it works the way it is bcoz thats how the rules are set, it doesnt consider any of us, if a star close to us suddenly "decide" to send out a gamma ray burst in our direction, it isnt going to miss us bcoz we want it to, it will hit us and wipe us out in an instant bcoz thats how the rules are.

[Deleted]

It's not about purpose, but actual origin. I'm not asking what purpose existence serves, but why it is there at all.

Perhaps there are different realities that are not connected to each other at all. Maybe there's one reality with its infinite universes, another with its own, maybe one where there's Paradise or one with Hell. One where there's just a person sitting and laughing and not doing anything else. We cannot rule anything out, really.

well, that would be a multiverse which a lot of scientists believe exists. basically there is a universe for every conceivable option you can think of.

[ArmoredDragoon]

If you reach the edge of the universe and keep going you just end up on the other end going back towards the middle.

The universe doesn't have a middle. That would be akin to saying that the surface of the earth has a middle, but the reality is that it just doesn't.

It expands in the sense all objects are moving outward from a supposed center, drifting away from a central point. Not expanding into some other form. The drifting is proposed as one of the justifications for the big bang theory.

No, think of it more like you drew a bunch of dots on a balloon, and then you inflated it, but what's inside of the balloon doesn't exist, rather just the surface of the balloon exists; hence there's no center of it, nor is there any kind of focal point of expansion. The "dots" (stars, planets, galaxies, etc) on the balloon would just move further and further apart from one another leaving more empty space in between them. But in this case the balloon has no known limit of expansion. Will it ever stop expanding? Nobody really knows. Nonetheless, its expansion continues, and the more it expands, the faster these objects move apart from one another (relatively speaking; some galaxies are moving towards one another faster than the universe expands locally to themselves; for example Andromeda is on a collision course with our galaxy.)

At least, a balloon is the best analogy that can be drawn until you can wrap your head around the concept of four dimensional objects.

[Deleted]

Uhh it's nothing like that. The truth is no one can say for certain. We've got a lot of good theories and that is the crux of the problem.

its worse than that bcoz something like m-theory or super string theory is more of a philosophy than an actual theory bcoz its one of the "theories" that might never be proven or can never be proven bcoz the observations that needs to be done in order to prove said theory might never happen bcoz it happens in other dimensions or is happening on such a small scale that we can never perceive it or quantum mechanics get in the way.

[Deleted]

well, that would be a multiverse which a lot of scientists believe exists. basically there is a universe for every conceivable option you can think of.

What I'm saying is that there might be alternative realities. Multiverse-theory speaks of the same reality in which many universes exist.

I'm saying there could be realities where perhaps a tauren exists, sitting in his chair, and nothing more. Or there is a little field of grass on which rain pours. That's what I mean by different realities; just fully disconnected existences that come in things we can only fantasise about.

[Garnier Fructis]

Welcome to the concept of "infinite". Either there's an edge, and it isn't infinite, or literally everything that could ever happen has already happened more than 430 billion trillion times (number chosen because it's really big, when the real answer is literally so many it could ever be counted because it's infinite).

There's more possibilities. You can have a finite universe with no edge or boundary. This isn't in any sense more natural or unnatural than the other possibilities, either, as we have no a priori reason to expect that the universe is open instead of closed.

[Deleted]

If you reach the edge of the universe and keep going you just end up on the other end going back towards the middle.

well, you'll never reach the edge of the universe bcoz by the time you reach it, it would already have increased several hundred times in size due to the increasing expansion of the universe.

[igualitarist]

It's not about purpose, but actual origin. I'm not asking what purpose existence serves, but why it is there at all.

Perhaps there are different realities that are not connected to each other at all. Maybe there's one reality with its infinite universes, another with its own, maybe one where there's Paradise or one with Hell. One where there's just a person sitting and laughing and not doing anything else. We cannot rule anything out, really.

I see your point. We can't do anything other than speculate, unfortunately.

Sometimes i think the universe just does not "want" to be understood. Sometimes i think the universe created intelligent life to understand itself. Maybe this is the only way the universe can protect itself from dying ? Entropy will most likely consume everything, and life is about organization and efficiency, the opposite from entropy.

I hope my last thought is right, this means we may have a chance to uncover all the secrets the universe hides from us.

[Deleted]

I see your point. We can't do anything other than speculate, unfortunately.

Sometimes i think the universe just does not "want" to be understood. Sometimes i think the universe created intelligent life to understand itself.

I hope my last thought is right, this means we may have a chance to uncover all the secrets the universe hides from us.

I also hope God exists, and that He is good. Everything is better with that in mind. The idea that you lose loved ones some day, and that is it, forever, is incredibly sad. And that one day, you too shall disappear, never to again see the world, enjoy the sun, the cozy raindrops, or feel happy or sad again... incredibly tragic to think about. With God, we can hope he has a bigger purpose for us, and will bring us to a better existence.

[Endus]

There's more possibilities. You can have a finite universe with no edge or boundary. This isn't in any sense more natural or unnatural than the other possibilities, either, as we have no a priori reason to expect that the universe is open instead of closed.

Well, then it's not finite. Hence the issue.

If you presume that there's a void without end, and the universe exists because of a "big bang" in that void that led to all this, then you need to explain why that "bang" couldn't happen at other points in that void. Because if it could, and that void is without end, then it's happened infinite times already.

That's sort of how "infinite" works.

[Azadina]

2> We know space isn't set. The observable universe is some 93 billion light years across, and is only 14 billion years old. The stuff at the fringes didn't get there by traveling faster than light, it got there because space isn't the same size/shape it was in the beginning. It's stretching and expanding. Space itself. We know that the idea that space is an even infinite constant is just . . . wrong.

Doesn't that practically mean, that we're like stuck in a bubble, where we can only see in every direction as far as the light has had time to travel, which is that 14 billion years. Thus us never being able to see all the rest of it?

[Garnier Fructis]

I would guess if the universe has an "edge" it'd just be the point where you stop seeing stars and galaxies. Beyond which would be, I'd assume, infinite space.

But who knows, really.

I guess that's possible, but it would be bizarre. It would mean that the universe is not homogeneous or isotropic.

[Vankrys]

Does the universe has to have an end game, something to expand into?

I mean, the universe expands, the astral bodies moving away from each other because forces acting upon them giving them momentum. There does not have to be a higher meaning or define end game. Astral bodies are just moving around because because of physics, period.

[Deleted]

What I'm saying is that there might be alternative realities. Multiverse-theory speaks of the same reality in which many universes exist.

I'm saying there could be realities where perhaps a tauren exists, sitting in his chair, and nothing more. Or there is a little field of grass on which rain pours. That's what I mean by different realities; just fully disconnected existences that come in things we can only fantasise about.

that is one and the same tho, and fyi, multiverse theories doesnt necesarily speak about the same reality in which many universes exist, it also speaks of alternative realities and your example can theoretically happen in "the multiverse" but i get your point, generally speaking when most ppl think of a multiverse they think of an alternate earth but with a lot of other things happening like instead of humans, there would intelligent jelly-fish and not really a universe with a whole different set of stars/planet/species but technically, that to is part of the "multiverse"

[Endus]

Doesn't that practically mean, that we're like stuck in a bubble, where we can only see in every direction as far as the light has had time to travel, which is that 14 billion years. Thus us never being able to see all the rest of it?

Yes and no.

Because we also know that spacetime is part of the bubble that's expanding, not just the other stuff inside.

Also, there's galaxies that we can currently see, but will eventually NOT be able to see, because they're accelerating away from us faster than the speed of light, and eventually, their light won't be able to reach us any more.

Or we could boil all this down into "physics is fucking WEIRD when you get really big or really small".

[Garnier Fructis]

Well, then it's not finite. Hence the issue.

If you presume that there's a void without end, and the universe exists because of a "big bang" in that void that led to all this, then you need to explain why that "bang" couldn't happen at other points in that void. Because if it could, and that void is without end, then it's happened infinite times already.

That's sort of how "infinite" works.

Finite in the context of cosmology refers to some notion of distance, in which case a bounded universe that wraps in on itself would very much be finite but have no edge. This is sort of analogous to a Klein bottle.

And I'm not assuming there's a void without end. I would challenge that even if we lived in a Klein bottle-esque universe, that such a concept as the void would not make sense. So I'm not really sure what your paragraph is talking about.

To be clear, everything I've described are possibilities that cosmologists actually consider, since this is all basically a question of geometry anyway. In fact, if the curvature of the universe turns out to be positive, this is exactly what the universe will be like. As far as we can tell it's probably flat, but I'm just reiterating that I'm not presenting something logically nonsensical.

[Deleted]

Does the universe has to have an end game, something to expand into?

I mean, the universe expands, the astral bodies moving away from each other because forces acting upon them giving them momentum. There does not have to be a higher meaning or define end game. Astral bodies are just moving around because because of physics, period.

it isnt as much forces that act upon them as it is the space between the astral bodies that is expanding altho i guess you can argue that dark energy is a "force"