Trump's tax plan

[alexw]

No we won't. We have been trying it since the 1980's and it has been failing spectacularly since the 1980's. How long does something need to fail before we accept it failed?

37 years? 41 years? 45 years? 50? 80? The Soviet Union stuck around for 74 years before people finally called it quits...are we going to have to drag this on for another 30 years before we can call say it's not working?

Its actually been tried since about the 1850's if I remember correctly. But it got so discredited that the 1% had to reinvent it and create a new basis for it that wasn't tarred with the same derision, though it seems that they are reaching a point where they will need to do that again.

FYI it used to be called horse and sparrow theory - feed the horse (1%) enough oats and at the end the horse shit will contain enough unconsumed oats left in it to feed the sparrows.

[prwraith]

President Trump has told the AP that he will be announcing his tax reform plan next week, my question is simple.

If you're a Trump supporter what do you expect his tax plan will be and who will benefit from his plan the most.

He's a republican. Rich people are gonna get tax breaks, middle class is gonna get screwed, and the poor are gonna get tax breaks.

[Aggrophobic]

Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

It's not that simple, unfortunately.

[ati87]

He's a republican. Rich people are gonna get tax breaks, middle class is gonna get screwed, and the poor are gonna get tax breaks.

MOre curious what trump voters expect, I mean they will defend the shit out of it whatever it comes out but what do they want is my question.

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I'm not a Trump supporter but I fully expect him to unveil a plan that benefits people who own businesses.

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It makes sense when you look at it from Donald's eyes. It benefits him and his family so why wouldn't he do it?

But is that what his voters voted for? A president that thinks about himself first, his buddies 2e and then if a piece of the pie is left the people?

[prwraith]

If they voted for Trump then that's exactly who they voted for. If they were stupid enough to think he was worried about them and their problems they were 100% incorrect.

I think that's the problem. As long as you're pro 2nd amendment it doesn't matter how far you shove your fist up the middle classes arse. They'll take it with a smile. Touch that second amendment, give them health insurance, reduce unemployment, fix the economy and you're still gonna have a riot on your hands because of that moronic amendment.

I swear if they're religious we could classify them as hypocrites for committing idolatry against god towards the 2nd amendment.

[Video Games]

Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

Yeah like how that one walmart shut down and laid off everybody while the walton family wipes their ass with million dollar bills with their faces on it. You can't believe in trickle down.

[jdbond592]

Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

Honestly, do you have any business experience? How do you live in a capitalist nation and don't know the 101 of Capitalism?

A simple course in economics will teach you much..

[Cthulhu 2020]

Its actually been tried since about the 1850's if I remember correctly. But it got so discredited that the 1% had to reinvent it and create a new basis for it that wasn't tarred with the same derision, though it seems that they are reaching a point where they will need to do that again.

FYI it used to be called horse and sparrow theory - feed the horse (1%) enough oats and at the end the horse shit will contain enough unconsumed oats left in it to feed the sparrows.

Sounds good. If we feed the rich enough money, we'll get to pick a few coins out of their shit.



I also like this one:

[Gestopft]

Going from making 37k to 38k would actually make you lose money because you're all the sudden paying more than TWICE the amount in taxes. Even the current bracket jump of 10% seems to be too much to me.

Thanks for posting the chart.

Minor correction here though: that's not how tax brackets work. If you make $38k under the Trump plan, the first $37.5k would be taxed at the 12% rate and the last $500 would be taxed at the 25% rate for the next bracket. You can't actually lose money by making more.


@Ghostpanther Corporate profits are at post-war if not record highs: if record-high profits isn't stimulating the economy, why in the world would pushing those numbers higher suddenly help?

[Kujako]

Honestly, do you have any business experience? How do you live in a capitalist nation and don't know the 101 of Capitalism?

A simple course in economics will teach you much..

To be fair, America is crony capitalist not capitalist.

[Thepersona]

Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

Trickle down doesnt work. Period. Because job creation is not a function of wealth, but of demand

[NED funded]

Trickle down doesnt work. Period. Because job creation is not a function of wealth, but of demand

It boosts foreign direct investment.

[The Stormbringer]

Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

It will never happen. It has never happened. Every time it has been tried, it has failed. Get your head out of the sand.

[Stormspellz]

His goal is that everyone will benefit from it. The rich, who generally are the ones who own companies and create jobs will benefit most from it. The poor who are not paying any taxes now and are on government assistance anyway, will not of course benefit more than they are now with the exception they may actually have better job opportunities.

corps have never created new jobs just because, giving them and their owners tax breaks just cause will not incentive them to do so now.

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Yeah. If you accept that as a realistic effect. Which I do. Cutting the corporate business tax rate will without question for myself, increase the profits for a company, allowing them better success at expanding and thus hiring more people.

large companies can already borrow for pennies on the dollar, and again this has never happaned

[Acidbaron]

I'm sure this time it will be different, because we all know if something doesn't work for decades, the plan is to put a new face behind it do the exact same thing with breaking down regulations and giving tax breaks and expect a totally different out come.

And the best part is enough people will actually buy it, hence the support for it. Well actually it does work in making sure the money remains the same, your wages don't rise, new jobs aren't created and more political power remains with those who benefit from it the most.

[Manabomb]

His goal is that everyone will benefit from it. The rich, who generally are the ones who own companies and create jobs will benefit most from it. The poor who are not paying any taxes now and are on government assistance anyway, will not of course benefit more than they are now with the exception they may actually have better job opportunities.

Rich. People. Do. Not. Create. Jobs.

Get it through your head. Jobs are created when there is a need in the economy. The "rich" are only that way through the hoarding of wealth which, if anything, reduces the possible jobs in an economy.

Think about it like this. There didn't need to be rich people for jobs to exist. The idea that they are a mutual factor is exactly why conservatives will be duped for the next fourty years.

[Sunseeker]

Trickle down doesnt work. Period. Because job creation is not a function of wealth, but of demand

Exactly. If there is demand for new work to be performed and therefore new jobs to be created, new jobs will be created. Any business owner who has ever said "I don't have the money to hire more workers." Is really saying "There isn't enough demand in my market to justify employing more people to get those jobs done." Because losses on new hires can A: be written off, and B: certain classes of unemployed can earn companies tax breaks.

In theory if there was demand, but jobs were tied to money, Bob, who can't get a job in Phil's company but otherwise has the skills necessary to do the job, could just go and do the job. Effectively starting his own business. For *reasons* it's not that simple of course but in many basic labor jobs it really can be that simple.

I remember an argument I had with some ultra-republicans about how they would never be able to get jobs and earn money if it wasn't for rich "job creators". I pointed out they had the tools, the skills, the connections and the resources to start their own business and essentially do the job they're doing now, but for themselves, and they looked at me like I was absolutely insane and fell back to "but how will we get jobs without rich job creators!?" And I subsequently stared at them, dumbfounded that they couldn't see they had everything they needed in themselves.

"Job creators" is a myth to make people dependent on the wealthy and just as in ages past, to keep the poor from realizing that they don't need the money-class to get along in life.

[Noxx79]

We shall see. I think it will work out for the best. But, time proves all things.

And time has proven that trickle down doesn't work. See Kansas.

[GreenJesus]

For all the lazy Trumpsters who think we're just making shit up. This is what he proposed during this campaign.



The only people getting tax breaks are those making under 37k which is a 3% cut or ~1k a year. Which is nothing.

Those making 91k-112k are getting a 3% cut as well, about 3k a year. People making 112k-190k are seeing a 5% increase in taxes. Those making above 413k are seeing a 2-7% cut.

It makes zero sense. The people getting the biggest tax breaks are the ones who do not need it. There's a small increase in disposable income but it is far outweighed by the loss of taxes that would be going to programs to suppose those people anyway.

It's also just too few brackets. It needs to be more dynamic. Going from making 37k to 38k would actually make you lose money because you're all the sudden paying more than TWICE the amount in taxes. Even the current bracket jump of 10% seems to be too much to me.

The brackets are : 12% on first 37,500 then you get taxed 25% on the income earned from 37,500 to 112,500... you don't get taxed 25% on the total.

That is how marginal tax rates work.

[Manabomb]

I'm sure this time it will be different, because we all know if something doesn't work for decades, the plan is to put a new face behind it do the exact same thing with breaking down regulations and giving tax breaks and expect a totally different out come.

And the best part is enough people will actually buy it, hence the support for it. Well actually it does work in making sure the money remains the same, your wages don't rise, new jobs aren't created and more political power remains with those who benefit from it the most.

Well, the logic of "rich people create jobs" is about as fanciful as "jesus is our lord and savior" so what can you expect from the giant red dildo that is middle America that keep electing idiots that don't represent their values. (Or only do so when re-election is a factor.)