Is frost op?

[Deleted]

Yep, "Blizzard love mages" - that's why 2/3 of their specs are pure shit since the beginning of legion and the single ones that are able to compete get promptly nerfed into the ground.

aye, with 2/3 of mage specs being craptastic, it would stand to reason that the one left would be pretty good but its hardly getting nerfed into the ground, from what ive been told/read its a 1% nerf for ppl without the gloves and a 3% nerf for those with the gloves.

[Woobels]

Ach, Frost has been too good for years. I'm not sure why it's looked at any differently this time.

Blizzard love mages. It's their favourite class, by distances, and there's plenty of evidence proving it; some highlights include the infamous "we buffed mages because they weren't where we wanted them" during the Throne of Thunder (mages were top three on most every fight at that point), or the expansion-level spec rework that Frost got during Mists while rogues and warriors were absolutely dreadful.

There's no such thing as mages being overpowered. It's working as intended.

Stop vomiting words out and actually look up some facts and think before you press 'Post Quick Reply'

Not going to insult you because I don't want an infraction but I was close.

[Deleted]

You clearly have no clue about Havoc. As a Havoc demon hunter you can have those 5-10 sec windows doing absolutely nothing because your 60% proc chance resource generator either missed (cus it's based on auto-attacks) or didnt proc. The only boss we do extremely well on is Krosus, and that's because you can't miss and he won't parry your attacks. And the only dmg dealing spell we have atm (with Chaos Cleave being the best talent) is Chaos Strike, and this is by design. Frost have many spells, Ice Lance just happens to deal more dmg than anything else. IF they were to tune down Chaos Strike dmg we would be doing worst damage out of all dps specs, because of how they made Havoc DHs work. So the spell itself isn't overtuned, it's just bad design.

So please educate yourself before talking about a spec you clearly never played or simply didn't understand. Havoc is only below arms warrior and outlaw rogues in terms of RNG elements.

Lol, its really clear you do not play frost mage, so i guess you should take up your own advise.

OT, no the nerf is uncalled for, what should be nerfed is the legendary gloves that makes the IV uptime possible.

[Orwell7]

Ach, Frost has been too good for years. I'm not sure why it's looked at any differently this time.

Blizzard love mages. It's their favourite class, by distances, and there's plenty of evidence proving it; some highlights include the infamous "we buffed mages because they weren't where we wanted them" during the Throne of Thunder (mages were top three on most every fight at that point), or the expansion-level spec rework that Frost got during Mists while rogues and warriors were absolutely dreadful.

There's no such thing as mages being overpowered. It's working as intended.

Also Mage is the only class that is part of the word: daMage.

[stevenho]

aye, with 2/3 of mage specs being craptastic, it would stand to reason that the one left would be pretty good but its hardly getting nerfed into the ground, from what ive been told/read its a 1% nerf for ppl without the gloves and a 3% nerf for those with the gloves.

Yeah the current one is not terrible, but I'm pretty sure double IL will be fixed as well and then it is going to be GG like it was for half a year already.

[Pua]

Not going to insult you because I don't want an infraction but I was close.

Scary.

Also Mage is the only class that is part of the word: daMage.

That's a good shout, actually.

Working as intended.

[Krille]

well, ill do it for havoc if you do it for frost, bcoz literally every assumption you make about frost is wrong, its funny how you say that down tuning chaos strike would make havoc the worst spec in the game, when the exact same thing is true for icelance bcoz ice lance's and chaos strike's overall dmg contribution is comparable, so every argument you come up with for not down tuning chaos strike is an argument for not changing ice lance.

Is Ice Lance 65% of Frost mages total dmg? No it's not. And Havoc only has 1 spender and that's Chaos Strike, without it being strong we'd do nothing and i guess that's why Blizz have stated that they want to change Havoc gameplay. Because atm it's literally spamming 1 button. You guys complain you have to frostbolt between Ice Lances, we can autohit and pray to God for a resource proc. I hear Frost Mages cry about RNG and it's triggering cus you've got no clue about real RNG, waaa having to cast Frostbolt, get outta here.

- - - Updated - - -

Lol, its really clear you do not play frost mage, so i guess you should take up your own advise.

OT, no the nerf is uncalled for, what should be nerfed is the legendary gloves that makes the IV uptime possible.

You have decent fillers. Havoc don't. We have Throw Glaive that hits like a noodle and is on a CD. If we have bad luck we can't do anything for seconds. Frost is OP cus together with Affliction locks its way ahead of every other ranged dps and even melee dps in a tier that isnt ranged friendly. That's OP to me.

[kheath812]

Is Ice Lance 65% of Frost mages total dmg? No it's not. And Havoc only has 1 spender and that's Chaos Strike, without it being strong we'd do nothing and i guess that's why Blizz have stated that they want to change Havoc gameplay. Because atm it's literally spamming 1 button. You guys complain you have to frostbolt between Ice Lances, we can autohit and pray to God for a resource proc. I hear Frost Mages cry about RNG and it's triggering cus you've got no clue about real RNG, waaa having to cast Frostbolt, get outta here.

- - - Updated - - -



You have decent fillers. Havoc don't. We have Throw Glaive that hits like a noodle and is on a CD. If we have bad luck we can't do anything for seconds. Frost is OP cus together with Affliction locks its way ahead of every other ranged dps and even melee dps in a tier that isnt ranged friendly. That's OP to me.

cool, we dont give a shit about demon hunters. this is the mage forum. go whine on the dh forums.

[Krille]

cool, we dont give a shit about demon hunters. this is the mage forum. go whine on the dh forums.

Well, someone mentioned Havoc being OP and not Frost so i replied to that. So apparently some people give a shit.

[Gnomorepuns]

No it's not. skilled frost players can compete with the best of them when played right. As it should be.

[patrins]

the mage of our guild pulls shit ton of dps with it right now , wtf? it was like 900k dps on trilliax.

I mean doesn't every spec pull at least 900k on a fight like trilliax?

[Deleted]

Is Ice Lance 65% of Frost mages total dmg? No it's not. And Havoc only has 1 spender and that's Chaos Strike, without it being strong we'd do nothing and i guess that's why Blizz have stated that they want to change Havoc gameplay. Because atm it's literally spamming 1 button. You guys complain you have to frostbolt between Ice Lances, we can autohit and pray to God for a resource proc. I hear Frost Mages cry about RNG and it's triggering cus you've got no clue about real RNG, waaa having to cast Frostbolt, get outta here.

- - - Updated - - -



You have decent fillers. Havoc don't. We have Throw Glaive that hits like a noodle and is on a CD. If we have bad luck we can't do anything for seconds. Frost is OP cus together with Affliction locks its way ahead of every other ranged dps and even melee dps in a tier that isnt ranged friendly. That's OP to me.

Stop talking nonsense, you clearly do not play frost mage. If you want to bitch about another class then i suggest you go to their forum.

- - - Updated - - -

Well, someone mentioned Havoc being OP and not Frost so i replied to that. So apparently some people give a shit.

And since you are absolutely clueless about frost mages you should really refrain from commenting on it.

[Deleted]

Stop talking nonsense, you clearly do not play frost mage. If you want to bitch about another class then i suggest you go to their forum.

- - - Updated - - -



And since you are absolutely clueless about frost mages you should really refrain from commenting on it.

funny thing is, i never said havoc was OP, i merely said that if ice lance was overtuned then chaos strike is as well as they both contribute a comparable amount of dmg but apparently that means im saying havoc is OP what the guy fail to realize due to lack of knowledge i would imagine, is that frost is the only viable spec mages have atm and shouldnt be nerf in any way until both arcane and fire gets buffs so they can be viable, its only logical that if a class has 3 dps specs and 2 of them are utter shit that the 3rd one should be powerful.

[Ipsissimus]

Ach, Frost has been too good for years. I'm not sure why it's looked at any differently this time.

Blizzard love mages. It's their favourite class, by distances, and there's plenty of evidence proving it; some highlights include the infamous "we buffed mages because they weren't where we wanted them" during the Throne of Thunder (mages were top three on most every fight at that point), or the expansion-level spec rework that Frost got during Mists while rogues and warriors were absolutely dreadful.

There's no such thing as mages being overpowered. It's working as intended.

What are you on about? When was the last time that was Frost was the premier Mage spec for a significant duration?
Citing 'incidents' from two expansion ago is inane, particularly given that there were other classes which were far better during MoP than Mage, let alone Frost as a spec.

To this day I am perplexed which is the audience that manages finding this supposed Mage favoritism. It isn't the most hardcore PvErs 'cause they (hopefully) know which classes were actually prominent in end encounters for a long time now. It isn't the best PvPers 'cause class representation tells the true story for every given season. It isn't the most casual players because Mages need gear and don't function all too great in solo content.

I guess it's the average MMO-Champion forum poster who PvEs, but doesn't quite spend 40 hours a week during progression bashing his head against bosses (not that I'd condone them doing so), doesn't quite compete for Gladiator, doesn't quite try to push solo kills of older content and doesn't grind away to hit the highest possible M+ number each and every week. Because if you're doing normal or heroic with no regards to mechanics while overgearing them, bashing your head in RBG/Arena at 1500 or whatever and the highest M+ you do each week is 7, then yes, Mages sure as hell would look like gods walking Azeroth to you.

edit:
And no accusing me of being elitist, I don't raid crazy hours, don't currently play at a high rating in PvP nor do I push the maximum out of my mythic keys or try and solo difficult old encounters. I specified several settings where the class isn't "the chosen one" that people so often make it out to be.

We went into this expansion with one viable spec, Fire. Arcane did numbers in a perfect storm 'cause of 'clever' unintended gameplay. Frost played fine but did no damage whatsoever. Some golden children we are.

On topic:
Frost is currently slightly too strong compared to other casters due to the double IL mechanic. Couple that with the super strong legendaries Mage specs have been 'blessed' with and how well the spec interacts with the primary caster trinket in NH, and it's no surprise that the Mage in your guild is pumping out high numbers. I personally hope that they'll fix the double IL bug (first IL hit consumes the debuff, etc) and tune the base numbers slightly up to compensate.

[Deleted]

Ach, Frost has been too good for years. I'm not sure why it's looked at any differently this time.

Blizzard love mages. It's their favourite class, by distances, and there's plenty of evidence proving it; some highlights include the infamous "we buffed mages because they weren't where we wanted them" during the Throne of Thunder (mages were top three on most every fight at that point), or the expansion-level spec rework that Frost got during Mists while rogues and warriors were absolutely dreadful.

There's no such thing as mages being overpowered. It's working as intended.

lol frost has been too good for years? frost has consistently been the worst raiding in the game and the amount of things you wrote that was just flat out wrong is rather staggering.

[Charge me Doctor]

What are you on about? When was the last time that was Frost was the premier Mage spec for a significant duration?
.

Molten core & BWL & Ony kappa
Wasn't frost a go-to spec through the Draenor? I didn't bothered with it and raided fire through whole 6.*.*, but i do recall being called scrub for playing fire over frost, and every single mage in late pugs when my guild stopped bothering with raiding was frost.

[Tinary]

Molten core & BWL & Ony kappa
Wasn't frost a go-to spec through the Draenor?

Arcane was if you wanted to do good dps, Frost was just big numbers and better switching.

[Deleted]

Molten core & BWL & Ony kappa
Wasn't frost a go-to spec through the Draenor? I didn't bothered with it and raided fire through whole 6.*.*, but i do recall being called scrub for playing fire over frost, and every single mage in late pugs when my guild stopped bothering with raiding was frost.

wod was frost till hfc with ring (and more with valor really) arcane became by far best dps of all, and fire was usefull on xhul i believe

[Charge me Doctor]

Arcane was if you wanted to do good dps, Frost was just big numbers and better switching.

wod was frost till hfc with ring (and more with valor really) arcane became by far best dps of all, and fire was usefull on xhul i believe

To be fair, arcane surpassing all other mage specs is not a new thing because of the way they scale with stats. They are hands down the best scaling specs for mages, so the very last raid tier is going to be arcane unless blizzard change their mind on that

[Segus1992]

Doesn't feel like it when leveling with the spec...

Good point. Hold the press, we need to buff Frost because this one dude can't level as it.