Champion Catch Up Mechanic?

[Eapoe]

The issue with a catchup mechanic is that some classes have the ability to put in work orders for follower items. If Blizz put in a catch up mechanic it would completely undermine, and be a big F You! to, the players who invested in that and are still using it. The offset would have to be making that give a very decent chance at legendary follower items to be crafted vs what it is now.
Keep in mind, I'm not saying it's not kind of crap all classes can't get this perk, but for the ones that can it works against them.

[Jurani]

Don't know if anyone has said this but the classes that don't have work orders for champion equipment have a slightly different talent that gives gear after missions. I know the monk has that.

[Thorbalt]

Don't know if anyone has said this but the classes that don't have work orders for champion equipment have a slightly different talent that gives gear after missions. I know the monk has that.

and they tend to get a hell of a lot more item missions than classes that have the follower work orders too

[Marrilaife]

and they tend to get a hell of a lot more item missions than classes that have the follower work orders too

Don't think so, I'm in the process of upgrading followers on DK (with work orders), Monk & Shaman (with no work orders just the mission reclamation perk) and I'd say the amount of armament missions they get is the same, the only chars that get less are the ones that already have everything on 900 (this could be intended). Shamans have the "defeat grimtotem for random armament" quest but it's really rare and random to pop (not static daily or weekly).

[JemiS]

The issue with a catchup mechanic is that some classes have the ability to put in work orders for follower items. If Blizz put in a catch up mechanic it would completely undermine, and be a big F You! to, the players who invested in that and are still using it. The offset would have to be making that give a very decent chance at legendary follower items to be crafted vs what it is now.
Keep in mind, I'm not saying it's not kind of crap all classes can't get this perk, but for the ones that can it works against them.

How does it work against them? They still gear up faster, and they can swap perks when they don't need it anymore.

[BrioWoW]

Special troop just costs more garrison resources, it's a waste. Free seal is worth 1k gold/week, which is nothing.

Free seal is worth 4k gold a week, assuming you want to use gold cost and not OR cost, as it keeps you from having to spend on the third seal which is 4k gold.

[Vorecien]

Would you be happy for a catch up mechanic for followers / champions?

Obviously if you have been playing since 7.0 all your followers will likely be 900 and epic, however if you're recently 110 in 7.2 you're going to find your followers needing 200 ilvl to hit 900 (which is for the BS missions). I have a few fresh 110's (some unlucky enough not to have the follower gear cache upgrade) and thought how much better it would be if we could buy tokens that boost followers to 850. What's your opinion?

I like the idea. The likely reason is probably the gold you can attain through order hall missions. Albeit, less than the garrison, but still a decent amount on a daily basis. We probably will never see it, but it's a nice idea, nonetheless. You should submit the idea, though. (You can do this in-game.)

[Marrilaife]

How does it work against them? They still gear up faster, and they can swap perks when they don't need it anymore.

Some perks obsolete itself over time and it doesn't seem to be a problem in general, not just armaments when you geared up champs, but the quest upgrades once you're done levelling, I'd also say a lot of the special upgrades that give hidden appearances are only worth keeping until you get said appearance.

Having catch up mechanism now also doesn't invalidate all the gold, caches, ap and whatnot you got pre 7.2 so I dunno how people can say it's a fuck you to old players when they reaped benefits, they didn't gear the champs just for looking pretty.

It's the same as free obliterum forge - those who unlocked it early had potential to make much more gold than those who got it free with catch up mechanism.

Even if you could buy armaments for OR or gold it's not exactly free, so old players would still be in a better situation they don't have to buy them, but newer players and alts wouldn't be in such a disadvantage. It's a bit sad that for example new character can benefit from nether disruptor by killing the world boss, but can't really benefit from the command center because it requires 900 ilvl followers for the missions. Yes, they can benefit from the rotating perk but that is very RNG, the previous one with free legendary champion equipment was amazing, but before that the one with +10% to stats on broken isles was barely noticeable (you already get the various zone proc abilities that help you while the building is up).

Anyway I don't mind catch up like for example we had in garrisons, in 6.2 we got a vendor selling non-max level armors for followers and they weren't even very gold efficient (1k gold per follower, since it needed 2 items for 500g each), you could use it or you could cheapskate and gear your followers the old way, or you could use frozen arms of the hero that was tradeable between players.

It really doesn't invalidate anyone's progress, and helps alts, and still the earlier you gear up your champs the earlier you can reap rewards from the system, so everyone profits.

[cuafpr]

some simple bonus follow XP missions would do the trick nicely

[Deleted]

Equipping followers and levelling them iis quite trivial, so no. I recently levelled an alt and the followers are already epic and most at 900, all within less then two weeks. Thats more then fast enouggh in my book.

Except some classes can only get follower upgrades through missions themselves or a rare weekly quest.

[jayinjersey]

What they need to fix is the issue of the Quest iLevels.

I'm specifically talking about if you happened to increase one or two followers over spreading your iLevel tokens evenly you suddenly have all 850-900 quests but only 1 or 2 850-900 champions.

Even my armor token quests are coming in as 885/900 levels.

[Deleted]

It didn't take weeks to get them to 850 and it didn't take more than 2 weeks to get them to 900. I don't see a problem here.
Even hitting legendary was quick af.

It's just annoying to do in the first place, because I'm not really bothering with WQs on alts and I need ressources to get things done and buildings constructed. But a new character that is being played as a main shouldn't have these problems.

[JemiS]

It didn't take weeks to get them to 850 and it didn't take more than 2 weeks to get them to 900. I don't see a problem here.
Even hitting legendary was quick af.

Again, I'm betting you were playing a class that allows you to place work orders from equipment.

Either way, you're looking at any new 100 that's well over a month from having followers geared to 900- more if they're a class that can't put in work orders.

[Deleted]

Again, I'm betting you were playing a class that allows you to place work orders from equipment.

Either way, you're looking at any new 100 that's well over a month from having followers geared to 900- more if they're a class that can't put in work orders.

So what, a month is nothing. Looking for another afk-gold machine?

Make X alts, gear their followers up to 900 in days, get home with 100k/day?

[Deleted]

Don't know if anyone has said this but the classes that don't have work orders for champion equipment have a slightly different talent that gives gear after missions. I know the monk has that.

All down to RNG as well which is BS.

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and they tend to get a hell of a lot more item missions than classes that have the follower work orders too

Mine dont.

[Eapoe]

How does it work against them? They still gear up faster, and they can swap perks when they don't need it anymore.

So you're asking for a catch up mechanism that bypasses a perk that allows for quicker gearing of followers but don't understand how that undermines the perk? The catch up would literally make this an unnecessary and worthless pick for those classes with the ability to pick it.
I'm not against a catch up mechanic, but to justify it the Class Hall upgrade would have to be changed to a different benefit (maybe something along the lines of bonus chance at legendary follower items) to make it worth having after a catch up was implemented.
Catch up is literally taking a perk that some classes have and giving it to everyone, that's where the slap in the face to some of the playerbase lies.
The Oblitirum Forge is a poor example (the one another poster that quoted you used) as that is something that everyone that has been playing since launch has had access to and could have utilized, not something that only select players could take advantage of.
As per the statement above, a catch-up is fine, but the perk would then have to be changed to compensate for those classes that have the perk as now everyone would essentially have the same benefit (a way to gear followers ilvl and slots faster).

[JemiS]

So you're asking for a catch up mechanism that bypasses a perk that allows for quicker gearing of followers but don't understand how that undermines the perk? The catch up would literally make this an unnecessary and worthless pick for those classes with the ability to pick it.
I'm not against a catch up mechanic, but to justify it the Class Hall upgrade would have to be changed to a different benefit (maybe something along the lines of bonus chance at legendary follower items) to make it worth having after a catch up was implemented.
Catch up is literally taking a perk that some classes have and giving it to everyone, that's where the slap in the face to some of the playerbase lies.
The Oblitirum Forge is a poor example (the one another poster that quoted you used) as that is something that everyone that has been playing since launch has had access to and could have utilized, not something that only select players could take advantage of.
As per the statement above, a catch-up is fine, but the perk would then have to be changed to compensate for those classes that have the perk as now everyone would essentially have the same benefit (a way to gear followers ilvl and slots faster).

Catch up + Perk = faster gearing.

It's still a perk, even with the catchup.

And then you change it to the other option, just like any of the other class hall perks that become useless after a certain point.

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So what, a month is nothing. Looking for another afk-gold machine?

Make X alts, gear their followers up to 900 in days, get home with 100k/day?

You can already do this pretty easily if you pick the right class, that has work orders. And that's what anyone looking to do this with alts will do, especially since you can just send OR from a main to do it.

Who this hurts is new players / returning players on a class without work orders.

And for the record, I have 8/12 classes at 110 with maxed followers, so this isn't personal.

[Riistov]

No MMORPG games should not have any catch up mechanics in fist place.

Said no one ever.

Its not 2004 anymore.

[Eapoe]

Catch up + Perk = faster gearing.

It's still a perk, even with the catchup.

And then you change it to the other option, just like any of the other class hall perks that become useless after a certain point.

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You can already do this pretty easily if you pick the right class, that has work orders. And that's what anyone looking to do this with alts will do, especially since you can just send OR from a main to do it.

Who this hurts is new players / returning players on a class without work orders.

And for the record, I have 8/12 classes at 110 with maxed followers, so this isn't personal.

A catchup literally negates the perk. Why is this hard to grasp? It's a row 4 class hall upgrade, which takes roughly 7-14 days to get (can't remember the exact days) where almost all catch up mechanics are something that are instanteous to a week long task to complete. There would be no perk to be gained for people to take that ability. You would be correct if this is the first thing to pick from but it is not.
Keep in mind follower ilvls aren't the only thing that would need a catchup as players would also then ask for, if not also need, to complete the missions as well.
So again, they either need to change how the perk works for people that have it, move it to the first choice (thereby negating the choice in that row) or replace it completely.

[JemiS]

A catchup literally negates the perk. Why is this hard to grasp? It's a row 4 class hall upgrade, which takes roughly 7-14 days to get (can't remember the exact days) where almost all catch up mechanics are something that are instanteous to a week long task to complete. There would be no perk to be gained for people to take that ability. You would be correct if this is the first thing to pick from but it is not.
Keep in mind follower ilvls aren't the only thing that would need a catchup as players would also then ask for, if not also need, to complete the missions as well.
So again, they either need to change how the perk works for people that have it, move it to the first choice (thereby negating the choice in that row) or replace it completely.

Well, since they lowered the time to research it substantially (as well as the cost) already.... Not sure how valid your point is? My last 110 had it within 2 days of hitting 110, and I could have had it faster if I'd logged on more frequently. Maybe check facts before you make arguments based on incorrect assumptions?

Rank 1 & 2 don't require 110, so you already have those by the time you start needing to gear followers. Rank 3 now takes 6 hours and 500 OR, so you get that the same day you hit 110. Rank 4 takes 12 hours and costs 2k OR. So while it's not the first perk someone picks up, you can get it within 18 hours of hitting 110, which is pretty instantaneous.

You're also making assumptions about how catch up mechanics would work, and if they'd extend to 900.

It would be perfectly reasonable to have, say, an expensive catch up (500 OR for a 10 ilvl upgrade) or have a catch up that only worked to 850, making the perk still perfectly valid. You're arguing that "any catch up" mechanic takes no time to a week, but I'd like to see support for that. There are lots of catch up mechanics that are slower.