Rip m+

[Onikaroshi]

And is that a bad thing? Spamming mythic+ dungeons gets rather tiresome quickly. They where after all made for the challenge, not the AP farmfest they have turned into.

That would be all fine and dandy if it were that way from the start, but it wasn't, its been the same reward structure since August. They're basically making the same effort less rewarding, won't even bother with a weekly +10 if this goes live like this, not worth the effort (don't farm ap either)

[Noxina]

Even Foci isn't a good option though. Top parses have it because they got lucky with procs and it's easier to get than a memento or horn. Also there's only one bis relic in NH for FDK's. There aren't any good Frost Relics in Nighthold, so forced to farm black rook or mythic EN and hope for Titanforge.

Ah true, for some reason I thought Heart of Frost from Spellblade was Blast Radius, but its Ambidexterity (which is really nice for ST).

[tristannarutofan]

im confused by all the people that want crap loot they cant use.

If i'm good enough to take out a 13 dungeon, prefer to do 10s since it has a chance at upgrade without being to difficult, then anything lower than a 8 is probably incapable of giving an upgrade unless i do a ton for that 2% chance at titanforge.

Why would I want any loot on those first few keys? regardless of if its 3 or 6 or whatever. None of it is a potential upgrade. Better to get to 10 asap and get 1-3 pieces of gear i can use.

Like why do yall want these 850 pieces by spamming lvl 4 dungeons . Quests give better.

Now not only will more people be doing content more appropriate for them but even if you fail to be a timer as long as you get it eventually you get an upgrade.

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Youve been running the same dungeons over and over and over for 8 months. How do you still enjoy that?

not sure what this pointless spam is for but i'll answer.

There are like a dozen dungeons so most of the time its different. so if i do 3 dungeons a day i will probably only have done the same dungeon twice a week.

I mean i'm not sure if you are just ignorant or what. Diablo is an entire game built on the premise of doing the same dungeon over and over. I had friends in highschool play hours of Halo and Halo 2 killing the same people on the same 3 maps over and over. Like How is this even a question about a game?

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Well that is the problem actually if high geared players have no reason to do myth lower keys then these who are just stepping there will have some problems with assembling a group
Good for my alts is that they already are in High gear and can handle with them in myth 9-10 bad is for my shammy who i will level when i reach AR lv 50

it was bad for the game in general for so many high lvl players to shoe in on the lower lvl scene in order to get fast easy AP. People end up getting carried and thats how i end up in +8s with people who dont know the mechanics and get my key depleted.

the major thing is that you get loot no matter what unless you just...leave. You get gear and if you do GOOD then you get MORE gear and if you fail then you get a slightly easier one. This means while yes we wont have less low +s done in half the time that you will still gear up MORE quickly than the way it is now. If your group is able to complete a dungeon and its fiting for them then you will get 3 pieces of gear similar to your Ilvl and gear up.

the reason to skip over people who should be running the dungeon and taking people who shouldnt, is removed. This is how it should have been at the start

[Xirrohon]

not sure what this pointless spam is for but i'll answer.

There are like a dozen dungeons so most of the time its different. so if i do 3 dungeons a day i will probably only have done the same dungeon twice a week.

I mean i'm not sure if you are just ignorant or what. Diablo is an entire game built on the premise of doing the same dungeon over and over. I had friends in highschool play hours of Halo and Halo 2 killing the same people on the same 3 maps over and over. Like How is this even a question about a game?

No, its not different. Ignorant? Are you ignorant about the fact that they are the same? And yes, Diablo, PoE are boring af because all you do is run the same stuff over and over again. I would say that LoL and Dota also fall into that category because basically every map is the same and every game starts the same. I dont like those types of games. WoW was never a game like that until Legion. New content came out and you went and did it a few times, not over and over and over incessantly because you pretty had to for Arti Power. If you like that type of game, well... then grats, because that is what you have. Doesnt make me ignorant because I dont like to do the same stuff over and over and over again...

[Deleted]

Because if you do the +13, you get a +14 or a +15, which rewards better gear when you complete it. If you fail the +15, you get a +14. You can literally keep running keys, and there is never a point where you can't do that. It is simply not possible for you to 'waste' the +11 or +12.

Yeah, because it is much more efficient to purposefully fail runs (with only 2 items) to get back to keys that you can complete instead of just doing all of them with 3 items without fails. Nevermind the fact that good groups can routinely 2/3 chest 15+ keys, too, which is ccompletely useless now.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

They need to just go back to 1 chest with a piece for all 5 players like it was in the beta.
They only changed it because they didn't want people outgearing EN as easily. Now we are at a place where the best gear that DROPS from there is still lightyears away from mythic raid gear outside of titanforge.

1 chest with 100 percent chance at loot, and the new "3 chest" gives you the 2/5 chance again.

This whole running 40 minutes of a dungeon and getting no loot is absurd and has never been how it was in any other 5 man content.

[Sensimilla]

Loot isn't exactly being halved. Doing same dungeons as 5 is faster and there's no random if deadweight takes away your loot or not. More convenience means that something should be taken away.

Loot is being halved and that is exactly what is happening. Along with this we have less chance of getting a desired item from a dungeon, that means, if you have bad RNG you need to run the dungeon more times than now with a chest rewarding only 3 (2 in worst case) items per run. It is NOT faster.

[RoKPaNda]

Titanforging is real culprit behind many questionable things, but it's not going away any time soon.

lol no.

Titanforging is one of the best things they did with this expansion. It adds incentive to run additional content for a rare chance at an upgrade vs saying fuck that content because there is zero chance of there being an upgrade. The idea that Preach and Asmongold fans have about 860 gear TFing up to 900+ on a regular basis is ludicrous. Very rarely happens. Without TF this expansion would be hot garbage with the majority if it's content already abandoned.

[Deleted]

Titanforging is one of the best things they did with this expansion.

Titanforging is promoting getting many useless epics in hope of getting anything remotely useful. It's really toxic. Also if it was that rare then guilds wouldn't have 905 at Guldan, which is base itemlevel that he drops.

Only people that are happy with titanforging are ones that got something that they didn't deserve.

[Smag]

Regarding Mythic raiding and M+ gearing.

When Legion hit, I've decided to basically have two mains - my Holy Paladin (10 years and running) and a newly minted Resto Druid (cos FotM). The only difference thay had was a 24h leveling gap. I did everything almost the same on both chars. My HPally was in Mythic progression, and my druid never stepped a foot in a raid, except maybe some LFR for the Balance of Power thing. But Druid did M+, a lot of them. Pally just did a mandatory 10+ and maybe 6-8 runs for AP.

Strange thing tho, by the time ToV hit, the ilvl difference was 2. TWO. Granted, healers get loot last in progress guilds (bar some boss mechanic exceptions), but 2? My Druid even had 4 legendaries compared two 3 on my pally. That just showed me that running M+ to the max was a viable path of PVE progression.

Just came back after a 7 month sabatical, and I don't see myself doing any mythic raiding any time soon. But man, do I love me some 15+ keys to run. As a healer, you are almost sleeping during anything, other than progression or two-three weeks after the first kill. In M+ - every high key run is a clutch and I fucking love it. Sucks you can't get tier sets now (wasn't the problem before), but it's still pretty viable.

We'll see how it goes with the new changes.

[Magneto]

lol no.

Titanforging is one of the best things they did with this expansion. It adds incentive to run additional content for a rare chance at an upgrade vs saying fuck that content because there is zero chance of there being an upgrade. The idea that Preach and Asmongold fans have about 860 gear TFing up to 900+ on a regular basis is ludicrous. Very rarely happens. Without TF this expansion would be hot garbage with the majority if it's content already abandoned.

from a game developers view generating content with pseudo surplus values might be a nice and economical appealing idea, but - believe it or not - that's simply shitting on your customers at the same time.

[Onikaroshi]

Titanforging is promoting getting many useless epics in hope of getting anything remotely useful. It's really toxic. Also if it was that rare then guilds wouldn't have 905 at Guldan, which is base itemlevel that he drops.

Only people that are happy with titanforging are ones that got something that they didn't deserve.

He drops 910, you can hit 911 ilvl with ZERO WF/TF and ZERO gear from him. 927 weapon, 2 940 legendaries, and 905 in the rest of the slots. Your point is invalid, WF chance is pretty good, getting those good TF though is few and far between.

[Tootie]

What exactly decides how much the key is upgraded by? They only said the key CAN be upgraded by 2 and 3 steps. Won't players in the end still want to rush through to finish to get +3?

It would be better if they "graded" players on how they handled the affixes instead, if all 5 players die to volcanic maybe they don't deserve an upgrade at all. Just a thought

[Onikaroshi]

from a game developers view generating content with pseudo surplus values might be a nice and economical appealing idea, but - believe it or not - that's simply shitting on your customers at the same time.

Some people love it, some hate it, just the same as everything. If they remove it you'd have the same amount of people bitching about it being gone as you do bitching about it existing. It's you're ALWAYS shitting on one set of customers to please another.

[Kirbypro]

lol no.

Titanforging is one of the best things they did with this expansion. It adds incentive to run additional content for a rare chance at an upgrade vs saying fuck that content because there is zero chance of there being an upgrade. The idea that Preach and Asmongold fans have about 860 gear TFing up to 900+ on a regular basis is ludicrous. Very rarely happens. Without TF this expansion would be hot garbage with the majority if it's content already abandoned.

You are a delusional casual. Stuff titanforges 910+ all the time. Any full run of NH on personal loot on any level and you'll see one or two items titanforge 910+. Its disgusting.

Titanforging is promoting getting many useless epics in hope of getting anything remotely useful. It's really toxic. Also if it was that rare then guilds wouldn't have 905 at Guldan, which is base itemlevel that he drops.

Only people that are happy with titanforging are ones that got something that they didn't deserve.

Completely agree man.

As a hunter main, I've been farming M Ursoc for the entire expansion for a chance at a high titanforged Bloodthirsty Instinct because it is literally God's gift to hunters. Do I enjoy it...HELL NO.

[Onikaroshi]

What exactly decides how much the key is upgraded by? They only said the key CAN be upgraded by 2 and 3 steps. Won't players in the end still want to rush through to finish to get +3?

It would be better if they "graded" players on how they handled the affixes instead, if all 5 players die to volcanic maybe they don't deserve an upgrade at all. Just a thought

Same way the do now, what is now a +3 timer will still be a +3 timer. You'll just get less loot and if you fail it won't deplete.

[Deleted]

it was bad for the game in general for so many high lvl players to shoe in on the lower lvl scene in order to get fast easy AP. People end up getting carried and thats how i end up in +8s with people who dont know the mechanics and get my key depleted.

the major thing is that you get loot no matter what unless you just...leave. You get gear and if you do GOOD then you get MORE gear and if you fail then you get a slightly easier one. This means while yes we wont have less low +s done in half the time that you will still gear up MORE quickly than the way it is now. If your group is able to complete a dungeon and its fiting for them then you will get 3 pieces of gear similar to your Ilvl and gear up.

the reason to skip over people who should be running the dungeon and taking people who shouldnt, is removed. This is how it should have been at the start

On theory is how things should work but on practic they wont work as you or devs expected Because ppl will still invite 900+ in mythic key 2 it will be just more rare to find these.Besides that if i make a group for myth 2 lets say how can be sure that other 870s who i invite will play the same level as me how much of these ppl will have flask or food or good enough exerience to get m2 to m5

[Tootie]

Thanks brother!

[Onikaroshi]

You are a delusional casual. Stuff titanforges 910+ all the time. Any full run of NH on personal loot on any level and you'll see one or two items titanforge 910+. Its disgusting.




Completely agree man.

As a hunter main, I've been farming M Ursoc for the entire expansion for a chance at a high titanforged Bloodthirsty Instinct because it is literally God's gift to hunters. Do I enjoy it...HELL NO.

On average the highest we see from a full NH Heroic clear on farm is 900, seeing a 910 every time is either lucky or a flat out lie. Sure you'll see it a ton on Mythic and we do, but its just WF for the most part then....

And on bloodthirsty... the trinket is the problem, not the system, its like the arcano, it needs an adjustment.

[Spoonman]

I think the big thing blizzard is missing with m+ is that if they lower the reason to do m+ they also lower the reason to even play the game anymore

It's not like there are a lot of stuff to do

If they would have only changed the depleted mechanic and skipped the other it would have been a good change for the game but instead they ruined everything yet again. Just Blizzard Things i guess, sigh