Vanish broken?

[Swalload]

The problem with your entire approach to this thread is that you're saying your style of "fun" is the only one. Get out of here with that nonsense. It's a game. You're this worked up over an easily counterable ability in the PVP portion of a much larger game?

I never, in any of my posts here said that playing a stealth character is not fun. If you only came here to prove how stupid you are, mission accomplished.

If anyone is worked up here it's the rogue players taking this way too personal, which was very predictable from the start.

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Please just stop responding to him. No response, means he will move on. The account is registered in April 2017. It's a troll account. All of the posts made are antagonizing ones.

That's what makes my day. People so offended they have to go out of their way to stalk others trying to prove a point while obviously only making baseless assumptions.

Not everyone made a MMOC account the day they first subscribed to WoW, but judgeing from your last 2 posts, thinking is clearly not your strong suit.

Infracted.

[Mafic]

Vanish fails to work, because they changed how spells and abilities are queued up in WoD.

If person A hits Vanish while person B hits a spell at the same time both will go through. In the past Vanish would register first and the spell would not go through. This was even more true when Vanish was capable of dodging incoming spells before it was reworked.

[ymirsson]

We already went over this, most classes can't run from a fight unless the opponent lets them voluntarily and either way no one has it as easy as vanish (except maybe night elf stealth+flight form but that only works in world pvp).

Their abilities have range but unless they have someone to peel for them, every melee just stick to them and they end up fighting in melee as well.

You never fought a good ranged player, do you?

Either way no one ever considered fighting at range as being either cowardly or dishonorable and I don't understand why you try to put that and stealth in the same basket.

There are more then enough examples of just this in game and also in real life that i have a hard time not to laugh in your face.

[Swalload]

You never fought a good ranged player, do you?

You don't even know what I play and it also makes no difference, just look at tournament games (or any decently rated arena), range classes end up in melee or having someone else help them cuz none of the range can keep melees away in the current state of the game, melees have more gap closer than range have options to keep them at bay (which to some extent makes sense otherwise they would get kited forever, also most range are just as tanky as melee so why should they never get hit?)

There are more then enough examples of just this in game and also in real life that i have a hard time not to laugh in your face.

Okay I let it go in your previous posts because I didn't want to be that guy but it's THAN, not THEN, please learn to use them in the right context.

You don't have a hard time, you don't even have a valid exemple so you go with the laughing instead, whatever floats your boat, it's not like you can make me go from right to wrong with your biased opinion.

[ymirsson]

Okay I let it go in your previous posts because I didn't want to be that guy but it's THAN, not THEN, please learn to use them in the right context.

You don't have a hard time, you don't even have a valid exemple so you go with the laughing instead, whatever floats your boat, it's not like you can make me go from right to wrong with your biased opinion.

And i thought context is not as important to you. Also, it's EXAMPLE, not EXEMPLE.

[Swalload]

And i thought context is not as important to you. Also, it's EXAMPLE, not EXEMPLE.

Pardon my french, good sir.

[Hellrime]

Oh we're playing that game now, k.

So you feel the need to play a class designed around cowardly actions. Are you a coward in real life?

Doesn't calling people cowards behind a computer seem the least bit ironic to you? No? Okay... I mean it is a f'ing fictional character class, lol.

[Swalload]

Doesn't calling people cowards behind a computer seem the least bit ironic to you? No? Okay... I mean it is a f'ing fictional character class, lol.

If you read the conversation you would have understood that this was just piling on the stupid subject of assuming what people are irl that he started.

[Deleted]

You realize hunters have abilities that "mark" targets which work through invis and vanish? And demonhunters? And ass rogues?

Also, if you press vanish and it's on cooldown, it won't work....

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Pvp combat takes 10 seconds to drop. Same as always. It used to be pve and pvp. You ever wonder why it takes 10sec to restealth when you cc and run in pvp? Because you can drop combat mid-fight to re-stealth, it's a core rogue thing in pvp, unlike pve where npcs are in-combat with you unless you vanish.

There is nothing wrong with vanish. It is not broken. If you check closely you will find the cause of it breaking.

I personally have not encountered any issues with vanish breaking that i could not explain, in legion.

Just came back to read this after some time and I don't know man. Seems kinda rude to be talking like that when you are the one who doesn't understand how things work.

Vanish not working properly is something that happens in pvp and that is probably why you don't see it happening. The things you listed, like demon hunters, vendetta, vanish on cooldown (come on man) etc. are very basic things know to pretty much anyone who does pvp. Not sure about the most recent hunters mark, cause haven't done pvp too seriosly in legion but the old ones always got removed with vanish. We area talking about vanish failing when it should not for any reason.

It is obvious they changed something with pets and vanish. It used to instantly drop pets from attacking you but now they hit you for a second or 2 and might even keep hitting you till they break your stealth. I have had a shaman send raptors on me, vanish and have the raptors follow me a long time until they finally catch up and hit you in stealth. Same with hunter pets.

The worst part is that sometimes randomly your vanish just doesn't do anything. This has nothing to do with things that are supposed to break stealth. Like dueling a warrior, using vanish and getting instantly charged, because you are still visible and your vanish did nothing but is on cooldown. Regardless of what is done to you, you should have your few seconds in stealth, unless its something that instantly removes stealth.

And the timer to drop pvp combat has been 6 seconds for a long time, probably still is. Can't recall it being 10 seconds ever or at least not in the past 4 expansions. If it was 10 seconds you wouldn't even be able to restealth during blind. Vanish not being broken is not a fact, it's your opinion based on inadequate experience. I don't have anything against you but at least try not to talk to people like they are stupid, when you are the one who don't know whats going on.

[elfporn]

Just came back to read this after some time and I don't know man. Seems kinda rude to be talking like that when you are the one who doesn't understand how things work.

Vanish not working properly is something that happens in pvp and that is probably why you don't see it happening. The things you listed, like demon hunters, vendetta, vanish on cooldown (come on man) etc. are very basic things know to pretty much anyone who does pvp. Not sure about the most recent hunters mark, cause haven't done pvp too seriosly in legion but the old ones always got removed with vanish. We area talking about vanish failing when it should not for any reason.

It is obvious they changed something with pets and vanish. It used to instantly drop pets from attacking you but now they hit you for a second or 2 and might even keep hitting you till they break your stealth. I have had a shaman send raptors on me, vanish and have the raptors follow me a long time until they finally catch up and hit you in stealth. Same with hunter pets.

The worst part is that sometimes randomly your vanish just doesn't do anything. This has nothing to do with things that are supposed to break stealth. Like dueling a warrior, using vanish and getting instantly charged, because you are still visible and your vanish did nothing but is on cooldown. Regardless of what is done to you, you should have your few seconds in stealth, unless its something that instantly removes stealth.

And the timer to drop pvp combat has been 6 seconds for a long time, probably still is. Can't recall it being 10 seconds ever or at least not in the past 4 expansions. If it was 10 seconds you wouldn't even be able to restealth during blind. Vanish not being broken is not a fact, it's your opinion based on inadequate experience. I don't have anything against you but at least try not to talk to people like they are stupid, when you are the one who don't know whats going on.

It's not a lack of adequate experience.

I spoke in such a way as to make these claims sound stupid... because they are.

Hunter's mark has always "marked" a target, always stuck, even through vanish.

Your vanish ALWAYS works. Server input lag/spell queue coupled with travel time can seeminglky break you out instantly. The warrior charging you pressed his charge before you vanished. The same thing happens id you use dfa or ss and the target teleports before the attak lands - you goto the target, and the attack completes.

My "inadequate experience" is such that i find out what actually happened and why. As i said, in legion, vanish has never been broken.

If you think it is truly broken, despite perfectly good explainations telling why something can happen, provide logs to argue about it.

[Deleted]

It's not a lack of adequate experience.

I spoke in such a way as to make these claims sound stupid... because they are.

Hunter's mark has always "marked" a target, always stuck, even through vanish.

Your vanish ALWAYS works. Server input lag/spell queue coupled with travel time can seeminglky break you out instantly. The warrior charging you pressed his charge before you vanished. The same thing happens id you use dfa or ss and the target teleports before the attak lands - you goto the target, and the attack completes.

My "inadequate experience" is such that i find out what actually happened and why. As i said, in legion, vanish has never been broken.

If you think it is truly broken, despite perfectly good explainations telling why something can happen, provide logs to argue about it.

Hunter's mark having always stuck through vanish is just not true and again just shows that you don't know enough. It did stay on you if you just normally used stealth. Vanish removed it.

I always check why my stealth or vanish breaks if I immediately don't see a reason for it. There is still no reason why charge should break you out instantly. Vanish has 3 seconds of immunity to not break from damage or harmful effects. Doesn't matter which spell goes off first, you should still trigger your vanish stealth for 3 seconds or the spell doesn't work correctly. Only things like flare should be able to cancel it instantly. And it's not connected to charge hitting you. It has happened other times too, without a logical reason and in a very similar way. But rarely. It feels as if you vanish in a flare but there are no hunters. There would be no reason for me to complain about vanish if this did not happen.

And do you think it's intended for pets to not stop attacking you and break you out of vanish after the 3 seconds? I'ts just broken. Again, happens randomly, not regularly.

It is not the first time I see you posting things about pvp, thinking you know something you don't. You probably just haven't played enough pvp to notice this and judging by you commets, you might not even know when vanish breaks without a proper reason.

[Zoe nom]

Vanish has always been broken.

[elfporn]

Hunter's mark having always stuck through vanish is just not true and again just shows that you don't know enough. It did stay on you if you just normally used stealth. Vanish removed it.

I always check why my stealth or vanish breaks if I immediately don't see a reason for it. There is still no reason why charge should break you out instantly. Vanish has 3 seconds of immunity to not break from damage or harmful effects. Doesn't matter which spell goes off first, you should still trigger your vanish stealth for 3 seconds or the spell doesn't work correctly. Only things like flare should be able to cancel it instantly. And it's not connected to charge hitting you. It has happened other times too, without a logical reason and in a very similar way. But rarely. It feels as if you vanish in a flare but there are no hunters. There would be no reason for me to complain about vanish if this did not happen.

And do you think it's intended for pets to not stop attacking you and break you out of vanish after the 3 seconds? I'ts just broken. Again, happens randomly, not regularly.

It is not the first time I see you posting things about pvp, thinking you know something you don't. You probably just haven't played enough pvp to notice this and judging by you commets, you might not even know when vanish breaks without a proper reason.

Here is the old hunters mark. http://www.wowhead.com/spell=177114/hunters-mark

Notice the bit about always being able to track the target, and target unable to stealth. If memory serves correctly in the past i had to remove hunters mark with cloak and not vanish. Maybe im wrong. In legion, as far as ive noticed, the behavior is the same, despite a different tooltip.

Vanish does not apply any sort of immunity as youre implying. It grants 3sec of invis, and if no dmg is taken, or attacks made, you gain full stealth. If a warrior charges you a split second before you vanish, his attack will complete and you will not gain stealth, its very simple to understand, even if bad for QoL.

But yes, i admit, im not a pvp elitist. Ive never claimed to be an expert at pvp, but i can say that during all of legion ive never had problems with vanish. Not in the extensive world pvp or in pve. If a hunter has me marked, im screwed until i lose it, its not a bug, its class mechanics (dont need to be a pvp dbag to understand them)

You make me sound like ive not been playing rogue since release or that i havnt gotten glad before (i have, s3). Just because i dont pvp now doesnt mean i dont have an intimate understanding of the game.

Log your pvp shit, get a record of the "bugged" vanish. Then come back and bitch and moan some more at people who cant help you.

[Djanco]

Elf I'm pretty sure from sometime wrath onward they changed it so that vanish automatically removes hunter's mark. I'm not sure when that change was exactly but it's supposed to work like that now. Vendetta, however. Different story. I feel like it's also worth mentioning if you carry around haunted memento in your bag, when the little voidwalker guy spawns, it breaks your stealth.

[Henako]

I remember the glory days of vanishing between dot ticks to re-open.

[elfporn]

Elf I'm pretty sure from sometime wrath onward they changed it so that vanish automatically removes hunter's mark. I'm not sure when that change was exactly but it's supposed to work like that now. Vendetta, however. Different story. I feel like it's also worth mentioning if you carry around haunted memento in your bag, when the little voidwalker guy spawns, it breaks your stealth.

Id like to know more about the hunters mark history. Afaik it has always been the same. But its definitely possible im wrong.

[Deleted]

QUOTE=elfporn;45626948]

Vanish does not apply any sort of immunity as youre implying. It grants 3sec of invis, and if no dmg is taken, or attacks made, you gain full stealth. If a warrior charges you a split second before you vanish, his attack will complete and you will not gain stealth, its very simple to understand, even if bad for QoL.

Log your pvp shit, get a record of the "bugged" vanish. Then come back and bitch and moan some more at people who cant help you.[/QUOTE]

It's pretty hard to log something that happens randomly. That you might understand. And didn't mean to make a debate about this. You started that with your response.

But there are 2 ways vanish should work in that situation. You vanish before the charge and remain vanished for 3 seconds although you get charged or you vanish right after charge and remain vanished for 3 seconds. No damage or attack other than flare instantly breaks vanish. It has been like that since they changed vanish to work like that. Charge does bot break vanish. Damage does not break vanish until the 3 seconds is over. If you don't take damage, you will gain stealth. You would know this, if you had enough experience. But since this is a pve forum, only few people can back that up.

I am not a pvp elitist or an elitist at all. It's you who started with the elitist attitude and lost a lot of credibility after all that. S3 gladiator might have been good back then, but it doesn't mean you know anything about pvp after that. It's dangerous to think you know things for whatever reason, when you actually can't be sure. Makes you look stupid. There really is no reason to carry on with this and have a pointless debate in this topic. I have said what I wanted and you either understand it or you don't. For that reason im out.

[elfporn]

QUOTE=elfporn;45626948]

Vanish does not apply any sort of immunity as youre implying. It grants 3sec of invis, and if no dmg is taken, or attacks made, you gain full stealth. If a warrior charges you a split second before you vanish, his attack will complete and you will not gain stealth, its very simple to understand, even if bad for QoL.

Log your pvp shit, get a record of the "bugged" vanish. Then come back and bitch and moan some more at people who cant help you.

It's pretty hard to log something that happens randomly. That you might understand. And didn't mean to make a debate about this. You started that with your response.

But there are 2 ways vanish should work in that situation. You vanish before the charge and remain vanished for 3 seconds although you get charged or you vanish right after charge and remain vanished for 3 seconds. No damage or attack other than flare instantly breaks vanish. It has been like that since they changed vanish to work like that. Charge does bot break vanish. Damage does not break vanish until the 3 seconds is over. If you don't take damage, you will gain stealth. You would know this, if you had enough experience. But since this is a pve forum, only few people can back that up.

I am not a pvp elitist or an elitist at all. It's you who started with the elitist attitude and lost a lot of credibility after all that. S3 gladiator might have been good back then, but it doesn't mean you know anything about pvp after that. It's dangerous to think you know things for whatever reason, when you actually can't be sure. Makes you look stupid. There really is no reason to carry on with this and have a pointless debate in this topic. I have said what I wanted and you either understand it or you don't. For that reason im out.

I didn't call you an elitist. I have never made claims, in this thread or others, that i am a pvp expert in current content (i thought i made that clear?) - this subject matter pertains to class ability mechanics, not specifically pvp. I relate my experiences since legion has launched, explaining that i am able to point to and explain each instance where vanish seems "broken" and find an answer for why it happened, even if that answer is unsatisfactory. I also attempted to correct you when you seemed to not understand how vanish works.

You appear a week later, denouncing my experience with the game while sounding as if you don't understand how the ability works, though after all this, i think you've finally found the words to express that you may understand how vanish works (even if you may not understand the back end of the spell-queue system).

There is no debate on whether vanish is broken or bugged. Do your homework, replicate this issue (if it exists) then come back to demonstrate it. If you can duplicate the issue, then you've completed the first step towards troubleshooting, and should submit a ticket to blizzard to get it fixed.

[Critical92]

If vanish breaks because of damage it is a bug, end of discussion. Vanish can not break without a bug.
Even when you vanish with vendetta on you and the other rogue attacks you, you should still be in vanish until the 3 sec buff expires.
Vanish can only be suppressed with flare and nothing else.
I have also seen wierd things with vanish in the last time. I opened on a warrior but i saw that he gets help, so i vanished with ca. 1 sec left on cheap shot, but as cheap shot run out i got stormbolted. The warrior even did a 180 to hit me and that means he saw me while i was in vanish.
I have also seen a lot of rogues in vanish for a good 1-2 sec running away or around thinking i can't see them.

[elfporn]

If vanish breaks because of damage it is a bug, end of discussion. Vanish can not break without a bug.
Even when you vanish with vendetta on you and the other rogue attacks you, you should still be in vanish until the 3 sec buff expires.
Vanish can only be suppressed with flare and nothing else.
I have also seen wierd things with vanish in the last time. I opened on a warrior but i saw that he gets help, so i vanished with ca. 1 sec left on cheap shot, but as cheap shot run out i got stormbolted. The warrior even did a 180 to hit me and that means he saw me while i was in vanish.
I have also seen a lot of rogues in vanish for a good 1-2 sec running away or around thinking i can't see them.

Perhaps this merits testing. Test if you can still attack and see a rogue that vanishes with your vendetta on. But then if you do so, and you can still see and attack said rogue, then according to the ability tooltip for vendetta, it's working correctly....

This is an instance where clarification of the proper behavior (even when we have past experience to draw on for what we think is the correct behavior) is warranted from a dev. Preferably not Ion.

I still maintain that I personally have not had any issues with correctly utilizing vanish in pvp(or pve) situations. I will attempt to duplicate the vanish buff being removed when i get a chance and see if i can get an idea whats actually happening in combat log.