For a free internet!

[Molis]

Not watching that clown or his american shit show, but the internet should remain free and neutral.

Now now keep your John Oliver hate america free.

[Deleted]

Would this change affect foreign users accessing servers in the US?

Most likely. Those who control the pipes, control the flow.

No, it won't. ISPs don't run international traffic, that is handled by different communication companies.

Think of ISPs like local stores. They aren't producing anything, they aren't involved in international shipping, they are only selling stuff to their customers.

[Machismo]

wat

10wats

Just bring the licorice, and we'll fill you in.

[Sting]

Now now keep your John Oliver hate america free.

Hey, I'm still free to say whatever I want... for now

[haxartus]

They already have, and they did it to demand money from Netflix and to drive their users away from the competing service...

Comcast degraded the connection to Netflix, until Netflix paid them money. This was one of the main causes of the Net Neutrality debate & legislation.

What ??? 2Mbit ? Seriously ? You can't even watch 1080p with that...

[schwarzkopf]

Trump restarts climate change by withdrawing from the Paris deal - meh!!
Trump stops accepting refugees from countries bombed by the US - meh!!
Trump focuses in on denying people primary health care - meh!!

Trump tries to stop my flow of PORN!!!

PANIC!!!

If one can't be bothered defending the planet from Trump, why on earth should you be concerned about the internet.

[Orlong]

NN is the idea that every packet of data is given the same treatment by the Internet no matter its content. This way Comcast can't throttle Netflix because Netflix is a competitor. Spectrum can't throttle MSNBC because the GOP paid them to give special favor to Fox News. They can't bundle the Internet and give us, say, a "gaming package" that unthrottles online games and their webservers but leaves other parts not on the package slow or inaccessible.

Right now, the Internet is open, and free. All content moves through the internet at the same rate regardless of content. Now obviously, infrastructure might cause different speeds, but if your bandwidth narrows in one area, it narrows for ALL content, not just for this website or that website.

And that is not how it SHOULD be. When damn near half of all internet bandwith is consumed by people watching shitty compressed streamaing video from Netflix, and a large amount of the other traffic is a bunch of punk teens watching Angry Grandpa, and Francis videos on Youtube, it makes the internet service slower for everyone else using it for what it was meant for (gaming, reading news, and education).

We NEED to find a way to discourage people from watching countless hours of video online (which will have a great byproduct of increasing physical media sales so we will still be able to get high quality 4K HDR video and uncompressed Dolby Atmos and DTS Master Audio, and eventually 8K video products for years to come, instead of it wasting away because millennials are happy with shitty quality streaming video on their phones).

If the way to accomplish this is to charge more for people to use Netflix, either by having a "Netflix Tax", or by allowing ISPs to charge Netflix more to upload their streams, or to allow ISPs to throttle Netflix traffic, then Im all for it. After all, all the liberals pissed about this are the same ones who cheer the fat taxes and soda taxes saying people who do bad things should pay more. But I guess that should only be true for the things YOU dont consume.

Im sick and tired of coming home from work and getting online only to have my internet service slow down an hour later because all the kids came home from school and immediately get on their ipads and gaming consoles to watch Netflix. I literally get a 75% reduction in speed every day as soon as all the neighborhood kids come home, and I have Comcast cable, which is the only option other than DSL, and satellite which are both worse.

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What ??? 2Mbit ? Seriously ? You can't even watch 1080p with that...

You cant watch true 1080P at all with any connection to Netflix. Its ALWAYS compressed 1080P, go ahead and watch a "1080P" video and pause it. If its not clear like a picture. Its compressed. Alternatively, watch the same thing on a Blu-ray player and youll see a massive difference in quality.

[Adam Jensen]

And that is not how it SHOULD be. When damn near half of all internet bandwith is consumed by people watching shitty compressed streamaing video from Netflix, and a large amount of the other traffic is a bunch of punk teens watching Angry Grandpa, and Francis videos on Youtube, it makes the internet service slower for everyone else using it for what it was meant for (gaming, reading news, and education).

We NEED to find a way to discourage people from watching countless hours of video online (which will have a great byproduct of increasing physical media sales so we will still be able to get high quality 4K HDR video and uncompressed Dolby Atmos and DTS Master Audio, and eventually 8K video products for years to come, instead of it wasting away because millennials are happy with shitty quality streaming video on their phones).

If the way to accomplish this is to charge more for people to use Netflix, either by having a "Netflix Tax", or by allowing ISPs to charge Netflix more to upload their streams, or to allow ISPs to throttle Netflix traffic, then Im all for it. After all, all the liberals pissed about this are the same ones who cheer the fat taxes and soda taxes saying people who do bad things should pay more. But I guess that should only be true for the things YOU dont consume.

Im sick and tired of coming home from work and getting online only to have my internet service slow down an hour later because all the kids came home from school and immediately get on their ipads and gaming consoles to watch Netflix. I literally get a 75% reduction in speed every day as soon as all the neighborhood kids come home, and I have Comcast cable, which is the only option other than DSL, and satellite which are both worse.

That has nothing to do with NN, and everything to do with your bandwidth being inadequate. And I love how you, of all people, are demanding a tax on "things I don't like."

[Orlong]

It's simply the idea of protecting the current accessibility of the internet, of making sure all data is treated the same.

Accessibility wouldnt change. It may be perhaps slower with things Like Netflix, but youll always be able to read every webpage you want to. Its NOT about censorship, its about making sure there is enough bandwith for everyone so you bandwith hogs dont slow the whole internet down for everyone else with your binge watching Netflix, HULU, and Youtube

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Does Netflix pay for the bandwidth? They do? Do the Netflix consumers also pay for their bandwidth? They do? Then why should they have their service quality degraded because Comcast want's me to use their service instead?

Because Netflix doesnt pay MY ISP for the bandwith I use, they only pay their own ISP, and then they use up all of Comcast's bandwith from their customers using their service, which degrades the service of all of the other Comcast customers. Netflix should be paying Comcast too so that they can build additional infrastructure to support the Netflix service which uses nearly half of Comcast's bandwith nationwide

[LMuhlen]

Accessibility wouldnt change. It may be perhaps slower with things Like Netflix, but youll always be able to read every webpage you want to. Its NOT about censorship, its about making sure there is enough bandwith for everyone so you bandwith hogs dont slow the whole internet down for everyone else with your binge watching Netflix, HULU, and Youtube

That could be the intended use of it, but there is nothing preventing them from abusing their power. They could prevent you from gaming or reading something they don't like. it may not be censorship, but it could be equivalent to a ransom, "you want to read this site which is contrary to our ideals/is a competitor/doesn't pay us enough money, then you'll have to pay extra".

If they wanted to charge for high bandwidth content, they'd make a law where they can charge for bandwidth. What they are doing is arbitrarelly selecting what to charge for.

[Orlong]

Which is simply proof that we need regulations preventing shit where a company has to shell out money to every service provider in the nation because they deliver content online.

When the content they deliver online accounts for nearly 50% of all internet traffic, then they damn sure SHOULD be paying every ISP because they are causing inferior performance for everyone else

[Orlong]

That has nothing to do with NN, and everything to do with your bandwidth being inadequate. And I love how you, of all people, are demanding a tax on "things I don't like."

Unfortunately except for people who live in one of the few areas with FIOS service available, or youre willing to pay hundreds per month for business class internet service, Comcast (or Cox, or Time Warner, all of which share nodes through each community), it is the best bandwith the majority of Americans can get. Its a nationwide problem that internet service gets degraded because of assholes watching Netflix every waking moment

[Kujako]

Unfortunately except for people who live in one of the few areas with FIOS service available, or youre willing to pay hundreds per month for business class internet service, Comcast (or Cox, or Time Warner, all of which share nodes through each community), it is the best bandwith the majority of Americans can get. Its a nationwide problem that internet service gets degraded because of assholes watching Netflix every waking moment

How dare they use the bandwidth they pay for! The nerve!

[Crissi]

This is like the city taxing a popular restaurant beyond normal property / sales tax because the restaurant is popular and makes the road along it busy...

[Orlong]

Bullshit. Every ISP is getting paid to provide bandwidth to their customers, what they choose to do with it is up to them.

Yes and when I pay for my service I expect to get it 24 hours a day, not just during the hours when kids are school and cant watch Netflix, and when the ISP can no longer provide the service all of their customers pay for because Netflix wasnt around when people signed up for service and bandwith was great, then the only way to provide that service is to pay billions to upgrade their infrastructure, and the company who should be paying those billions, is NETFLIX (and their customers), not the ISP and customers who arent contributing to the problem. Someone shouldnt be able to make a website, market the hell out of it, and then use it to degrade the internet for everyone else without paying to support their traffic

[Crissi]

Yes and when I pay for my service I expect to get it 24 hours a day, not just during the hours when kids are school and cant watch Netflix, and when the ISP can no longer provide the service all of their customers pay for because Netflix wasnt around when people signed up for service and bandwith was great, then the only way to provide that service is to pay billions to upgrade their infrastructure, and the company who should be paying those billions, is NETFLIX (and their customers), not the ISP and customers who arent contributing to the problem. Someone shouldnt be able to make a website, market the hell out of it, and then use it to degrade the internet for everyone else without paying to support their traffic

Which will then be passed onto the consumer. Netflix isnt going to just eat the cost. and you can say "good!", but what if companies you do use get affected by this. Would you be ok paying higher prices for goods because the company you use is being charged higher prices form the ISPs just because?

[LMuhlen]

Same thing happens here. When Netflix rush hour starts, WoW becomes unplayable.

But I am the user the provider doesn't like, not the Netflix users. Netflix users buy the large bandwidth plans, I don't. (I used to, but it was pointless because it didn't reduce the latency issues).

Netflix users don't care about ping or package loss. It all boils down to average service for them, while I require constant instantaneous quality.

If resolution drops a little for Netflix users, most won't even notice, but when my latency increases, I throw a tantrum.

Which leads me to believe they would charge ME more if they could, and then in theory increase their infra to reduce package loss. But probably not, they would just charge more from me and not do anything. Because monopoly.

[Adam Jensen]

Accessibility wouldnt change. It may be perhaps slower with things Like Netflix, but youll always be able to read every webpage you want to. Its NOT about censorship, its about making sure there is enough bandwith for everyone so you bandwith hogs dont slow the whole internet down for everyone else with your binge watching Netflix, HULU, and Youtube

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Because Netflix doesnt pay MY ISP for the bandwith I use, they only pay their own ISP, and then they use up all of Comcast's bandwith from their customers using their service, which degrades the service of all of the other Comcast customers. Netflix should be paying Comcast too so that they can build additional infrastructure to support the Netflix service which uses nearly half of Comcast's bandwith nationwide

Except what you're missing is that everyone in your area pays for access to the same cables that bring the internet to your house, and their houses. Which means you have to share your internet bandwidth with them.

Thus, the problem you're having with Netflix isn't a Net Neutrality problem, but a problem of the bandwidth going into your area not being adequate to cover the use for all the persons living in that region. Fixing or axing NN won't fix your issue.

[Kujako]

Same thing happens here. When Netflix rush hour starts, WoW becomes unplayable.

But I am the user the provider doesn't like, not the Netflix users. Netflix users buy the large bandwidth plans, I don't. (I used to, but it was pointless because it didn't reduce the latency issues).

Netflix users don't care about ping or package loss. It all boils down to average service for them, while I require constant instantaneous quality.

If resolution drops a little for Netflix users, most won't even notice, but when my latency increases, I throw a tantrum.

Which leads me to believe they would charge ME more if they could, and then in theory increase their infra to reduce package loss. But probably not, they would just charge more from me and not do anything. Because monopoly.

So your ISP is overselling the bandwidth they have in your area. How is this Netflix's fault?

[Orlong]

Except what you're missing is that everyone in your area pays for access to the same cables that bring the internet to your house, and their houses. Which means you have to share your internet bandwidth with them.

Thus, the problem you're having with Netflix isn't a Net Neutrality problem, but a problem of the bandwidth going into your area not being adequate to cover the use for all the persons living in that region. Fixing or axing NN won't fix your issue.

Sure it will. If Comcast is able to charge Netflix $30 a month for every Netflix subscriber that users their lines, then less people will be willing to pay for Netflix (because Netflix will pass it on to the subscribers), thus there will be less Netflix users and my bandwith will return to its previous speed