Was quite left leaning, but have slowly been turned off by the left.

[Elite Peon]

I am pretty sure that almost every sensible democrat/liberal would identify as a conservative libertarian if they actually looked into it . Socialism only works if you have unlimited resources but that's NOT this world and for every hard working human 10 are lazy and useless .We need small governments , we need freedom to do whatever we want with our lives and bodies as long as it does not effect other people in a negative ( and yes killing unborn babies counts ) way....I would think most of you liberals would agree with that libertarian philosophy ..btw long ago started by those old white slave owners who wrote the constitution .

[Ravenblade]

I used to be actually more conservative when I was young which was more of a result of the political circumstances at that time (Fall of the Wall, reunification) and my first vote was actually conservative too. However I have turned to be more leaning left over time in a classic way with a hiatus from politics as I grew disenchanted of it altogether during my younger years. For me being left is always focusing on political issues that do in fact aim at humans protecting from the stupidity of..., well, humans. Humans tend to be short-living and therefore short-sighted beings, seeing what's happening around them now is more important than what will happen to the children when they grow up and have to deal with a mess that they've inherited.

I also tend to view a lot social policies in a different light than in my younger years especially since I have experienced and seen the effects of neoliberal policies of the post-2000 years. What being left is not about to me is developing a false sense of morality that incorporates novelty concepts that would declare everyone a minority which needs to be protected and not to be harassed or spoken about in derogatory manner using new kinds of speech. The latter seems to be the icky glue on which people define the entire Left since gender and race issues seem to dominate the entire political debate there, especially in the US, while you could do that you would be entirely missing the point of actual Leftist politics in practice. That's how you get an actual neoliberal running for president promising half-heartedly working towards some social policies and being mistaken as left. It's not!

I think it's most popular as a Churchill quote but apparently he just used it, it goes back to at least Otto von Bismarck.
"He who is not a socialist at 19, has no heart. He who is still a socialist at 30, has no brain."

Bismarck hated socialists for different reasons than why they are hated today. Mainly because Bismarck himself wasn't fond of this whole democracy thing and socialists strove for more parliamentarian influence on politics. They were the predecessors of modern social democrats. Bismarck, the ever-grumpy Iron Chancellor, wanted to preserve monarchy for all eternity and his harsh conservative stance is based on different reasons than what we would use today. In modern terms his views are reactionary and that of the socialists back then would be decried as timid today.

[Orange Joe]

Should be easy enough to prove one way or the other by associating age brackets with voting records.

We have been through the data, up until the baby boomers they vote more conservative. Then 2 silent gens and the greatest gen both leaned more liberal.



It's not that people vote conservative when they get older. It's current older generations vote more conservative.



40 years ago people that were voting republican at 18 are still voting republican at 65+

[Spectral]

Hillary is shit. She used to be a Republican. She and her husband are neoliberals, and during his presidency Bill Clinton might as well have been a Republican for the many things he accomplished for them that they never could for themselves. FWIW, Hillary is also very hawkish.

Further, any politician that talks anything about free markets is talking absolute nonsense. There are no free markets anywhere in the world. Everything is regulated, it just depends which side gets the advantages of whatever new economic policy is sharted forth.

Not sure why any of this is somehow news or surprising.

Edit: reading some of the thread following the quote above is just depressing. Some of the shit many of you believe is literally as if it were pulled out of your butts. The lack of knowledge or any appreciation for just how little some of you know is frankly shocking. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunnin...3Kruger_effect

I should not have been surprised but somehow I always am. George Carlin talking about some of you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOrHoob0n9o

And this why you morons voted for Trump and still think it was the right choice.

My reply above is still correct in light of your response:

In reality, any chart that places Hillary Clinton so far to the right that there's barely any space between her and Pinochet is concealing more than it illuminates.

If your view of the world is such that there's more distance between Stein and Sanders than Clinton and Pinochet, you are almost certainly guilty of out-group homogeneity bias.

[Louisa Bannon]

If your view of the world is such that there's more distance between Stein and Sanders than Clinton and Pinochet.....Zzzzz

Pinochet was a kind of populist/nationalist. My nanny's Chilean husband was actually a supporter (and against his own interests, of course). Many such governments have popular support in South America. Things change when things go sour.

I bet you don't actually have any idea what you are talking about.

[JohnBrown1917]

It's always a bit surreal to see people who constantly demonstrate a single-minded zeal entirely detached from any real substance accuse others of being indoctrinated or brainwashed.

We have a guy like that in our parliament(his party has 2 seats), he always talks about the evils of the left and cultural Marxism. Also whined about being put on the right side of the parlaiment, next to the PVV(Wilders), because he was a "moderate".
Also gave his first speech in parliament in Latin, after which the Immigrant female Moroccan-Dutch speaker of the house told him off and that he needed to behave himself and speak in Dutch.


Truly, one of the most glorious moments in politics.

- - - Updated - - -

In Europe/Canada it would. US politics is skewed so far to the right he isn't here.

Its social democracy that is center-left(so, Sanders), Democratic socialism is solid in the Libertarian left.

- - - Updated - - -

I am pretty sure that almost every sensible democrat/liberal would identify as a conservative libertarian if they actually looked into it . Socialism only works if you have unlimited resources but that's NOT this world and for every hard working human 10 are lazy and useless .We need small governments , we need freedom to do whatever we want with our lives and bodies as long as it does not effect other people in a negative ( and yes killing unborn babies counts ) way....I would think most of you liberals would agree with that libertarian philosophy ..btw long ago started by those old white slave owners who wrote the constitution .

Conservative libertarians..? That makes no sense, conservatives are on the authoritarian side.
Liberalism and the US dems also have nothing to do with socialism, socalism is left wing, Libs/US dems are right wing.

[Baelic]

Nothing says fiscal responsibility like a 20+ billion wall we don' need. But lets forget that as I doubt it happens, please explain in what world this version of the republcian party is fiscally responsible.

Why the do you think that I think that the republican party is fiscally responsible?

[Stormspellz]

He refers to himself as just socialist. Regardless, does being a Democratic Socialist make him a centrist?

GoP refer to themselves "conservates" doesn't mean they focus on conservering anything beyond religious dogma

[Mafic]

GoP refer to themselves "conservates" doesn't mean they focus on conservering anything beyond religious dogma

American Republicans were originally the true liberals. But they have run away from most liberal ideals to the point that only Libertarians still retain liberal ideals in modern day American politics.

[Spectral]

Pinochet was a kind of populist/nationalist. My nanny's Chilean husband was actually a supporter (and against his own interests, of course). Many such governments have popular support in South America. Things change when things go sour.

I bet you don't actually have any idea what you are talking about.[/IMG]

I know exactly what I'm talking about. I'm not slandering Pinochet, I'm saying that if someone think Pinochet and Clinton are basically the same politically, their compass is not well-tuned.

[Molis]

I am right in the center and do not identify with the protesting SJWs or the bible thumping racists.

@Unhinged I am with you and do not really know where to go.

As an example:
People can do what they want it is not my business so pro gay marriage, pro choice etc
I do not want to be taxed into oblivion and feel military defense is important for our country