Why do YOU think Healthcare is a Right and not a Privilege?

[Halyon]

So they're getting profits from taking care about other people. I see no problem with that. My point was - being a doctor is not a charity job, it's jsut a normal job. People have to earn money for their hard work. What they're doing in their free time doesn't concern me.

That's fine, may or may not be their primary motivation. And no, being a doctor is not a charity, not saying it should be either. However, talking about motivation with you pigeon-holing personal greed is rather dishonest to the doctors who care less about their pay-grade than their patients. What people do in their spare time can influence other things, so that it doesn't concern you means fuck all to the point at hand, if it can fuel something else.

This is ridiculous.

"It was just an example."

It was just an example. It's not just anecdote, it's a fact.

...I don't think you fully grasp how sample-sizes work.

[petej0]

Pretty much this. Rights are personal and don't infringe or effect another's rights.

They are not infringing on anothers rights though.

[Deleted]

Yes, it does. That's what they want. That's want they invented themselves. To help anyone and everyone, regardless of the circumstance. This is why combat medics can tell their COs to fuck off when they forbid them to help enemy wounded. But to them, it's not enslavement, it's what they do. Help people.

I'l pass on being a slave thank's - But more importantly, we don't - The state mandating something is not the same thing as choosing too.

Btw, the same logic enslaves you, too. If you can help someone at a car accident but you don't, you're likely to face charges for that.

Varies by jurisdiction, and i'm not entirely on board with those laws.
Oh PS That's the Geneva convention, its a different thing.

[Dragoncurry]

Healthcare can't be free.

The cost of managing healthcare professionals is too high. The cost of the actual healthcare is too high. End of story. Privilege, right, blah blah blah, none of that matters. You have to reduce cost somewhere. If you don't pay the physicians who run the show, no one will be physicians (or really competent ones), and if you don't maintain the rates, you won't be able to afford maintenance of your current operations.

Hospitals are very bureaucratic as well, so they aren't the leaders in IT, BI infrastructure, or shifts in hospital models, so the chance of these costs decreasing is even more slim. End of story, Healthcare is not a privilege or a right. It's simply a cost that has be paid in some form.

And if you want to know if care given by one individual to another is a right or a privilege, well...it's definitely not required by anyone to be a good samaritan, now is it.

[Flurryfang]

I think that in a modern western country, it is good to have an overall healthcare system, which helps everybody nomatter what. It is good for the country/nation and the more healthy people you have, the more a productive population you have.

[Dragoncurry]

I think that in a modern western country, it is good to have an overall healthcare system, which helps everybody nomatter what. It is good for the country/nation and the more healthy people you have, the more a productive population you have.

We don't provide poor healthcare. We just don't provide it to everyone.

[Flurryfang]

We don't provide poor healthcare. We just don't provide it to everyone.

I never said anything about poor heathcare. I just think that everybody should be provided. Having healthcare be a buisness which needs a profit, is in my eyes a dumm thing, since having a good healthcare system increases the production of nearly all other parts of society aswell.

[Deleted]

This logic enslaves doctors.

They chose to be one.
And they get the massive privilege of them having exclusive control over the business of treating patients.
It is servitude in exchange for state-backed professional monopoly. Hardly slavery.

[Deleted]

They chose to be one.

I said the logic.

[Frozen Death Knight]

Getting injured or sick is something that can happen to anyone at any time. A society will not function very well if people can't be treated for things that will not make them bounce back into society.

The irony of it all is that despite the US having more resources than anyone else to improve the living standards of its citizens, Americans still get worse health care for higher the cost than countries that have embraced universal health care. It really doesn't make a lot of sense to argue that universal health care will be automatically worse and cost more when your current system is already pretty bad. That the country can't do something like universal health care a reality just reinforces my dislike for the overall culture in the US.

[Deleted]

I said the logic.

Logic itself has no agency to enslave people.
Explain further.

[Dragoncurry]

I never said anything about poor heathcare. I just think that everybody should be provided. Having healthcare be a buisness which needs a profit, is in my eyes a dumm thing, since having a good healthcare system increases the production of nearly all other parts of society aswell.

I don't think you need to make all parts of society productive. It's not always a good trade off. If you spend $500,000 making someone productive, and he provides less than $500,000 productivity, you've just negatively impacted your society right? Why shouldn't I just invest that money in young kids' education for example?

[DisposableHero]

Because you can need healthcare to survive through no fault of your own.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

Ask yourself a question, "Does being part of the human race come with any extra stipulations?"

Life is a multiplayer game, you're in a guild with 8 billion other players, and if you abandon it you jeopardize your humanity and possibly your soul.

If you oppose universal healthcare then you are a murderer. It's come down to this-there is no more discussion, there is no more time for words.

[Deleted]

Logic itself has no agency to enslave people.
Explain further.

If people are entitled to healthcare, that's not the same thing as medical professionals choosing to care for everyone.

[Dragoncurry]

Ask yourself a question, "Does being part of the human race come with any extra stipulations?"

Life is a multiplayer game, you're in a guild with 8 billion other players, and if you abandon it you jeopardize your humanity and possibly your soul.

If you oppose universal healthcare then you are a murderer. It's come down to this-there is no more discussion, there is no more time for words.

Lol stop plz.

- - - Updated - - -

If people are entitled to healthcare, that's not the same thing as medical professionals choosing to care for everyone.

People are entitled to access to healthcare? Ofc, medical professionals don't have to choose to care for you. Or take your insurance.

[Deleted]

If people are entitled to healthcare, that's not the same thing as medical professionals choosing to care for everyone.

To be clear, the entitlement doesn't require doctors exist. Only that the state be willing to persuade free citizens into choosing the profession.
"professionals choosing to care for everyone" is just a weird paradigm: they choose to fulfill some requirements and be granted privileges and payment accordingly. But I'm still not seeing how that paradigm requires slavery.

[petej0]

And if you want to know if care given by one individual to another is a right or a privilege, well...it's definitely not required by anyone to be a good samaritan, now is it.

Its neither. You are paying them to provide a service for you. They are not doing it free or by force (a right). They are not doing it out of the goodness of their heart (a privilege). They are doing it in return for compensation ( a service). What we need to do is find a way so everyone can afford this service.

[Sinyc]

Diseases and injuries only happen to people that misuse their bodies? Genetics and accidents don't happen?

This IS a Jaylock thread you know??? You just go baited.

[Dragoncurry]

Its neither. You are paying them to provide a service for you. They are not doing it free or by force (a right). They are not doing it out of the goodness of their heart (a privilege). They are doing it in return for compensation ( a service). What we need to do is find a way so everyone can afford this service.

Everyone can afford this service? Are you lowering the cost of the service or raising the ability for everyone to pay the current rate?