Single-payer healthcare could cost $400 billion to implement in California

[Theinquisition]

Are you going to debate his claims and/or the article or not?

I just chuckle at the pettiness.

Bread...orbitus...arane...wells...i push...i could care less about their personal opinions of me.

It's oddly intresting to me who some people can have such a intense hatred of someone they have never met.

Chances are most of us, in person, could probably have a beer and a civil conversation.

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Does the article calculate the cost of single-payer accounting for the significant discount that a monopsony could achieve for medicine, medical services, equipment and consumables or does it use existing values? The primary reason for single payer is that the negotiating power of establishing a monopsony.

The government isnt exactly known for its ability to negotiate prices.

For example...i used to be a helicopter mechanic in the army. Do you know how badly boeing gauges the government for parts?

One example....1gb usb data sticks used to store component vibration information from the flight computer...

500$
Thats just one VERY tame example.

If the government cant negotiate those prices, what makes you think they can for medicine?

The government is far to corrupt with too many hands in the pot and backs to be scratched.

[Garnier Fructis]

Unless this includes price controls, this shouldn't be passed. There's a reason single payer isn't ungodly expensive in other countries, and that reason is because the medical industry isn't allowed to charge whatever they feel like.

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If the government cant negotiate those prices, what makes you think they can for medicine?

Did we switch from talking about the state government to the federal government, here?

[schwarzkopf]

Fun fact - single payer, properly done universal health care will SAVE $1.6 trillion a year in the US.

[Arganis]

Two pills of aspirin will be $30 in a hospital when you go to Walgreens around the corner a buy an entire bottle for half that lol. Lack of price controls is probably the only sane starting point.

Lack of price control is the only reason healthcare in the US is out of control to begin with. $2000 per mile Ambulance rides. $400 a stitch. $2000 for completely unnecessary, yet mandatory, blood work that's itemized to max out cost. $15000 CT Scans. And the list goes on and on. All complete bullshit that essentially boils down to nothing but racketeering. All of which I've experienced first hand.

Only complete idiots buy the explanations that go with those prices, while most of the rest of the civilized world gets to enjoy universal healthcare.

[GreenJesus]

Where is your huuuuuge wall when you need it, huh?

Idk. I heard there was this thing called DEPORTATION!

[PosPosPos]

Fun fact - single payer, properly done universal health care will SAVE $1.6 trillion a year in the US.

Fun fact - Republicans do not care, especially if it actually benefits their voter base.

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Idk. I heard there was this thing called DEPORTATION!

Do Trump supporters not even know the definition of the word "wall" nowadays?

This is really sad. Oh, and you are on ignore, bye.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

LOL refer to previous post

Look Dranei lover, I'm not against the "idea" of universal healthcare, I just don't trust our government in implementing it. CBO has estimated the cost at 2.6 trillion for the first year and 30 trillion over 10. Ouch

Then you need a better government. Everyone else seems to be able to manage it.

[crazyfool319]

If the illegals weren't here in the first place they wouldn't be at the hospital. And we wouldn't have to pay for their healthcare. Check mate.

If the illegals werent here we would still pay the exact same amount of money in taxes and hospital bills every year. The difference really would be that the people running healthcare would increase their own profits. Id rather pay for their healthcare and get mine in the same fell swoop than pay taxes and have to pay my own insurance on top of it. If people werent so selfish, they would realize that they actually benefit from this. Dont look at it like you are paying for a random illegals health care, look at it like you are paying your own or your kids. Most likely if they instituted single payer you would pay less in health tax than you would in insurance.

[PosPosPos]

Then you need a better government. Everyone else seems to be able to manage it.

The root of the problem isn't the government, but that almost half of the population consisting of Trump supporters seems to be incapable of setting aside their zealotry and hate of everyone who doesn't belong to their echo chamber to objectively weigh the pros and cons of having a good healthcare system.

[GreenJesus]

If the illegals werent here we would still pay the exact same amount of money in taxes and hospital bills every year. The difference really would be that the people running healthcare would increase their own profits. Id rather pay for their healthcare and get mine in the same fell swoop than pay taxes and have to pay my own insurance on top of it. If people werent so selfish, they would realize that they actually benefit from this. Dont look at it like you are paying for a random illegals health care, look at it like you are paying your own or your kids. Most likely if they instituted single payer you would pay less in health tax than you would in insurance.

What? But they skip out on the payment and get it for free.... They clog the system, make other people wait, and make everyone else's costs go up to make up for them. My "white" friend had cancer but his parents had to sell their house to pay for it meanwhile some illegal shits line up out the door to get free treatment. I don't care if it isn't "PC". Fuck that. They can all die for I care. They don't belong in our country and we shouldn't suffer for them.

[crazyfool319]

LOL refer to previous post

Look Dranei lover, I'm not against the "idea" of universal healthcare, I just don't trust our government in implementing it. CBO has estimated the cost at 2.6 trillion for the first year and 30 trillion over 10. Ouch

Based on these numbers, that allots 92600 dollars to each person over ten years. Not each tax payer, but each person living in the US legally. Those numbers just arent realistic. Just to get that off the ground in the first year each PERSON (once again not tax payer) would cost a smidge more than 8000 bucks to the tax payers. Those numbers are simply too high, even at our massively inflated prices. That allots almost 700 dollars per month per person in the US. I know hospitals are busy, but i guarantee you that more people are out of hospitals than in one.

[Deianeira]

I just chuckle at the pettiness.

Bread...orbitus...arane...wells...i push...i could care less about their personal opinions of me.

It's oddly intresting to me who some people can have such a intense hatred of someone they have never met.

Chances are most of us, in person, could probably have a beer and a civil conversation.

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The government isnt exactly known for its ability to negotiate prices.

For example...i used to be a helicopter mechanic in the army. Do you know how badly boeing gauges the government for parts?

One example....1gb usb data sticks used to store component vibration information from the flight computer...

500$
Thats just one VERY tame example.

If the government cant negotiate those prices, what makes you think they can for medicine?

The government is far to corrupt with too many hands in the pot and backs to be scratched.

You do realise that most likely politicians have clauses that prevent them to negotiate the prices for them like the provisions in ACA that they cant negotiate prices for medicine and medical equipment.

[Orlong]

Because it is cheaper to include illegal immigrants than to exclude them and have them show up at emergency rooms driving up costs for US citizens. This is why Texas and California ERs are always strained.

Or they could exclude illegal immigrants, and when they show up at the ER, treat them, bill them, arrest them (for being in the US illegally), deport them, and sell all of their belongings to pay the bill if they wont pay with cash

[Mafic]

Or they could exclude illegal immigrants, and when they show up at the ER, treat them, bill them, arrest them, deport them, and sell all of their belongings to pay the bill if they wont pay with cash

It costs even more taxpayer money to do what you outlined. That is why the US currently has a policy to treat even illegal immigrants and it is a core part of UN humanitarian standards.

[Orlong]

Reading this, I was initially thinking that sounded like a LOT of money. Then I decided to look into what that would be per person a year based on that estimated 200 billion in additional taxes. It works out to $5019 a year per person (based on the current population of CA, not what it would be in the future when this would be implemented). Again, it sounds like a lot. Then I decided to check what I paid for my single coverage. Its $430 a month for me. That works out to $5160 a year. So IF I lived in CA and IF this was implemented, it would actually be slightly cheaper for me. When I factor in what I'm paying for my deductible, this is actually MUCH cheaper per year.

And youll wait weeks for services because all of the illegal aliens will now be able to make appointments at the doctor offices. Flooding the market with more customers without drastically increasing staff and office space leads to significantly worse care for everyone other than the people who had no insurance before

[zEmini]

PERS prevents them from having a balanced budget period.

Just another reason for Oregonians to just kick it over. Or better yet, vote to reduce PERS payouts

[Tic Tacs]

What? But they skip out on the payment and get it for free.... They clog the system, make other people wait, and make everyone else's costs go up to make up for them. My "white" friend had cancer but his parents had to sell their house to pay for it meanwhile some illegal shits line up out the door to get free treatment. I don't care if it isn't "PC". Fuck that. They can all die for I care. They don't belong in our country and we shouldn't suffer for them.

Do you really believe illegals are clogging the system? lol... If so, why not just show up to the hospital without any papers - which makes you illegal is it not? - and get free sweet care, it is so easy, right?

[Daelak]

Single payer is a pipe dream without real reforms in place first to reduce costs across the board.

Sounds like a person that has no idea how a "single-payer" system even works.

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California is probably one of the few states that could actually afford this. Oregon would go broke. Will be interesting to see how this goes.

If California does successfully implement this program it will cause the largest brain drains from midwestern and southern states, creating an even more desperate and impoverished life for the people in those areas. California, before any type of QoL increase like state mandated health care, is leaps and bounds ahead of other states, this would solidify an absolute advantage that no conservative ideology nor politician yapping about tax cuts and "choice" memes to keep the best people in their states.

[Orlong]

It costs even more taxpayer money to do what you outlined. That is why the US currently has a policy to treat even illegal immigrants and it is a core part of UN humanitarian standards.

The UN doesnt make our laws, nor do we have to follow any of their "rules". And it doesnt cost more than $1000.00 for a plane ticket to any country they came from

[Deleted]

Universal healthcare is totally realistic and a far better option than exists in the US at current. However, if you open it up to illegal migrants it will rapidly become unaffordable as it will act a magnet for people with health issues. The simple solution is if you live there legally its free if you are illegal you pay or at least contribute to any care you receive. Otherwise if I was from Brazil, Mexico or Nigeria and needed medical care I'd go to California and get some of the best care in the world for free. You'd see millions flock there every year as healthcare tourists.