1. #33181
    Scarab Lord TriHard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    I like the atmosphere of the towns, but it's ruined by the spell spam, so I usually afk in other areas when multitasking.

    But at least 14 doesn't have randomly insane annoying NPC's making noise that you can't do anything about like a certain other MMO...
    Mute your sound, go to youtube, search for "Final Fantasy XIV: Pa-paya!"
    Enjoy <w<

  2. #33182
    The Lightbringer MrPaladinGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Queen Gremlin View Post
    Mute your sound, go to youtube, search for "Final Fantasy XIV: Pa-paya!"
    Enjoy <w<

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  3. #33183
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    But at least 14 doesn't have randomly insane annoying NPC's making noise that you can't do anything about like a certain other MMO...
    I beg to differ.

    If you play with Japanese voice overs and go to the little villages like Horizon you often hear sounds that sound like an orgy is going on.

  4. #33184
    The Lightbringer MrPaladinGuy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aruhen View Post
    I beg to differ.

    If you play with Japanese voice overs and go to the little villages like Horizon you often hear sounds that sound like an orgy is going on.
    I actually can't tell if you're serious.
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  5. #33185
    Living Memory Sesshomaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    I actually can't tell if you're serious.
    @Aruhen is serious. I play with the Japanese voiceovers as well and Quarrymill sounds very crowded, socially and.. Well.. @Aruhen, take over for me.

  6. #33186
    Quote Originally Posted by Queen Gremlin View Post
    Question is if I'll make it in time though. I have tons of people that can help me with the primal bosses and so on.
    If you really beat your head against a wall and skip as much dialogue and cutscenes as possible, you'll make it with some time to spare, but be prepared for the grind and not let it get to you ... you'll be teleporting back and forth all over the place for days to get it done. Friends may help speed up the process some, but duty finder (as healer) popped pretty fast and only had a few bad groups out of all the content; had an early morning group where some people made mistakes and the tanks rage quit from one wipe with "it isn't worth them tomes" before exiting; and the others were some groups where people needed to just learn or react a bit better, but most of the time I could heal through and insta-res the more unforgiving mistakes.

    It is either that or if you have the expendable income, toss $25 at the MSQ problem and power level to 60 on the job you want and collect as much gear as you can to make the starting area feel less daunting with the assumed increase in mob hp and attack damage; as it was stepping from ARR MSQ into HW zones with mainly just the gear from questing.

    I know because I skipped through pretty much everything, I'll be rerolling just to take my time through the entire storyline again at some point once I'm comfortable with where I am with the jobs I care about playing. That is the only downside of wanting to jump right into SB and being so far behind, as I was only just 50 and didn't even have my weapon finished; leviathan wasn't out left when I last played for more than a couple days.
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  7. #33187
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    But at least 14 doesn't have randomly insane annoying NPC's making noise that you can't do anything about like a certain other MMO...
    *insert obnoxious Dwarven laughter here*

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    I actually can't tell if you're serious.
    She is referring to the "mass gathering" sound effect.
    Yeah, some moans in there are quite... "just what ARE they doing?!"

  8. #33188
    About the whole 'Healer has to DPS QQ' argument taking 6 pages or so, I'd like to say the following:

    When you encounter a bad dps, or a mediocre one, you don't go telling them 'Hey you fucking suck, do your rotation perfectly and perform good enough to reach DPS reqs for A12 Savage in this Expert dungeon!!!!'. If you do, you are an elitist and should just get out immediately, cause no one likes you.

    This is the case for healers too, if they can heal well, but don't do enough dps, that means that they are the equivalent of a mediocre dps. So you shouldn't call them horrible players or whatever.

    I'd like to mention that I was a Paladin for the entirety of my FF XIV experience, so neither of those cases are about ME. I just want to defend the healers that some of you act like jerks towards. An as a WHM alt, I usually spam Stone, Wind, Assize and Holy as much as possible, especially Holy cause it's gorgeous. But that's MY CHOICE

    I have cleared only up to A7 savage when it was current and I am by no means an Elysium player, but I am not a horrible one either. Back then, 1.2-1.3k dps was pretty good for a Paladin, while sustaining themselves, I don't know what's the norm now. But I have never complained about people only healing, or doing their rotations badly. You know why? Because I don't have this accursed ACT shit installed to check others. If someone fails, and we can't do the run, I can simply leave, no need to be a jerk. How do I know my performance you ask? Simple, all I have to do is ask one of my raiders to inform me about my performance through their ACT. I also asked them to tell me whenever my group would be wiping and I would have to replace someone, or give them a tip about how to improve.

    Also @ Granyala, you said earlier 'Most people I encounter horribly SUCK an this game and I'n not even setting high standards, because I am a far cry from any elite savage-clear player myself.', well even if you don't have high standards, that doesn't mean that you aren't an ass.

  9. #33189
    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    I like the atmosphere of the towns, but it's ruined by the spell spam, so I usually afk in other areas when multitasking.

    But at least 14 doesn't have randomly insane annoying NPC's making noise that you can't do anything about like a certain other MMO...
    You should be able to turn off spell effects for others. Not sure if that mutes the sound, though.

  10. #33190
    I actually can't tell if you're serious.
    Oh I'm serious. Try it out and go to Horizon were it seems to happen more frequently.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    You should be able to turn off spell effects for others. Not sure if that mutes the sound, though.
    I don't have a sub atm but I swear there's an option to turn down other people's volume. I'm not sure if it's only for party members or if its for everyone but I do remember doing this because it would give me a headache in raids.
    Last edited by Aruhen; 2017-05-24 at 01:53 PM.

  11. #33191
    Living Memory Sesshomaru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aruhen View Post
    [...]
    I don't have a sub atm ( health reasons ) but I swear there's an option to turn down other people's volume. I'm not sure if it's only for party members or if its for everyone but I do remember doing this because it would give me a headache in raids.
    Just came home from work and checking the settings. Under "Sound Settings", the lowest column is the "Player Effect Volume" which you seemingly can regulate; yourself, party and other PCs should be other players.

    Picture below.
    Spoiler: 


    No idea if it completely mutes everything (the sound itself) as @Faroth said, but at least should dampen the noise quite a bit.
    Not that I am going to check it as I prefer to have it as it currently is & am using speakers instead of headphones.
    I only get headaches with headphones.

  12. #33192
    Quote Originally Posted by Valaut View Post
    About the whole 'Healer has to DPS QQ' argument taking 6 pages or so, I'd like to say the following:

    When you encounter a bad dps, or a mediocre one, you don't go telling them 'Hey you fucking suck, do your rotation perfectly and perform good enough to reach DPS reqs for A12 Savage in this Expert dungeon!!!!'. If you do, you are an elitist and should just get out immediately, cause no one likes you.

    This is the case for healers too, if they can heal well, but don't do enough dps, that means that they are the equivalent of a mediocre dps. So you shouldn't call them horrible players or whatever.

    I'd like to mention that I was a Paladin for the entirety of my FF XIV experience, so neither of those cases are about ME. I just want to defend the healers that some of you act like jerks towards. An as a WHM alt, I usually spam Stone, Wind, Assize and Holy as much as possible, especially Holy cause it's gorgeous. But that's MY CHOICE

    I have cleared only up to A7 savage when it was current and I am by no means an Elysium player, but I am not a horrible one either. Back then, 1.2-1.3k dps was pretty good for a Paladin, while sustaining themselves, I don't know what's the norm now. But I have never complained about people only healing, or doing their rotations badly. You know why? Because I don't have this accursed ACT shit installed to check others. If someone fails, and we can't do the run, I can simply leave, no need to be a jerk. How do I know my performance you ask? Simple, all I have to do is ask one of my raiders to inform me about my performance through their ACT. I also asked them to tell me whenever my group would be wiping and I would have to replace someone, or give them a tip about how to improve.

    Also @ Granyala, you said earlier 'Most people I encounter horribly SUCK an this game and I'n not even setting high standards, because I am a far cry from any elite savage-clear player myself.', well even if you don't have high standards, that doesn't mean that you aren't an ass.
    I think you are missing the mark. Most of these call outs are for healers not doing ANY dps, especially when they are in content that barely requires healing. There are healers in full i270 script gear with team mates who are similar ilevel who won't do anything but heal in a roulette - often times meaning they are standing around doing absolutely nothing for huge swathes of the instance.

    It would be directly comparable to you hitting Rage of Halone a couple times on a boss and then turning autoattack off and just standing there until your threat lead diminishes.
    As long as you are holding threat and maybe popping a cooldown to mitigate incoming damage you are performing the main role functions of a tank, but it would be silly to suggest that you stop there with your performance.

    Also bolded for the weird double standard. You yourself won't run ACT, but you are totally cool with benefiting from the information. If you are asking numbers and parser information, you are essentially running a parser by proxy. The first couple sentences also imply that the only reason you don't complain or harass people is because you don't have the parser information staring at you on the screen.

  13. #33193
    The Lightbringer Nurvus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrPaladinGuy View Post
    But at least 14 doesn't have randomly insane annoying NPC's making noise that you can't do anything about like a certain other MMO...
    Yeah it does.
    Those random background dialogs/laughters become annoying very quickly. They "loop" too quickly. SE should add more samples so that you don't notice the exact same sound so often and so predictably.

    Fortunately, there are some quiet places.
    Why did you create a new thread? Use the search function and post in existing threads!
    Why did you necro a thread?

  14. #33194
    Quote Originally Posted by Resiak1066 View Post
    As Faroth said, the MSQ is the entire identity of the game though. The entire game is wrapped around it. The dungeons are build around it, including the cut scenes that occur after them. The trials, the raids. Everything is connected to the MSQ. Theres no magic switch at 60 where the end game just changes everything. It's a constant build. We don't want to see that identity suffer.
    I'm not disagreeing with that. What I am saying is that our community is so dangerously close to turning into an echo chamber where we refuse new players because they have differing viewpoints or criticize the game. Then instead of defending ourselves or dismantling their arguments we resort to attacking these players with saddening displays of leave we don't want you here attitude. It's not healthy for the game, and frankly it's hypocritical when so many of us praise the games community in the same sentence.

  15. #33195
    Quote Originally Posted by Wrecktangle View Post
    I'm not disagreeing with that. What I am saying is that our community is so dangerously close to turning into an echo chamber where we refuse new players because they have differing viewpoints or criticize the game. Then instead of defending ourselves or dismantling their arguments we resort to attacking these players with saddening displays of leave we don't want you here attitude. It's not healthy for the game, and frankly it's hypocritical when so many of us praise the games community in the same sentence.
    This is why I think the MSQ is important: ______
    Response: No it's not, nobody should have to do it if they don't want to. It's stupid. It's not even good. In fact, it's shit.

    This is why I'm concerned about opening the floodgates to people who don't care about the game as it is.
    Response: *ignore concern entirely & talk about how something else supports an opposing fact

    These are the reason I'm concerned about development being pushed to become more like WoW and lose what makes FFXIV different, based on what I've seen before.
    Response: None of that ever happened, let me tell you why everything about this game is wrong despite claiming I love this game.

    "The MSQ shouldn't even be a part of the game's requirements, even for each expansion at launch."
    "I disagree, here's why the MSQ is crucial and a core of the game: [Present reasons]"
    "The MSQ is shit, it shouldn't be forced on players."
    "Again, [Repeat reasons]"
    "I don't see why anyone has to bother with this if they don't want to!"

    That's pretty much how it feels 9 times out of 10. That's why people get emotional responses to suggestions of "This game needs to be completely changed, I don't care how many of you love it, obviously more of us hate it because I perceive it so and want it to be different." It feels like if you like the game, you have to address demands for change with rational analysis, but the ones demanding change have no burden to evaluate why the systems are in place or why people want them to remain. It's a one way discussion where one side is always kept on the defensive of the discussion. End result: They get defensive.

    To be clear, Wreck, I consider you in the 1 out of 10, even if we butt heads. One day, perhaps I shall have a pizza with you and we will create the greatest MMORPG ever imagined. It'll fall apart due to lack of funding, but WE'LL CREATE IT ON PAPER!
    Last edited by Faroth; 2017-05-24 at 05:14 PM.

  16. #33196
    I've been musing lately that the "high-skill" gameplay in FFXIV is very different than the "low-skill" gameplay. For example, if you're a tank running with a high-skill healer, you do things like switch stances, more dps combos, etc. On the other hand, if you can't trust your healer, you don't do things like that (well, maybe WAR does).

    In contrast, in WoW, high-skill gameplay is more or less the same as low-skill gameplay. You do roughly the same thing, but execute at a higher level.

    I think a lot of the disagreement about FFXIV these days comes from people having trouble with the switch from low-skill to high-skill playstyles, especially in random groups. Some people insist that you should start with and expect high-skill gameplay. Other people prefer to start with low-skill, and once you're sure the group can handle it, switch to high-skill. Some people aren't confident in their skills, and would prefer to play with the safer low-skill gameplay.

  17. #33197
    The Unstoppable Force Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Valaut View Post
    When you encounter a bad dps, or a mediocre one, you don't go telling them 'Hey you fucking suck, do your rotation perfectly and perform good enough to reach DPS reqs for A12 Savage in this Expert dungeon!!!!'.
    Actually I do.
    Of course not with insults, but if I encounter mistakes I speak out.

    Had a monk the other day that used arm of destroyer as part of the 3-4mob groups AoE rotation and ran out of TP fast. He was quite thankful when I told him that Arm was not worth the TP in that context and that he should stick to single target while finishing with rock breaker.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Valaut View Post
    Also @ Granyala, you said earlier 'Most people I encounter horribly SUCK an this game and I'n not even setting high standards, because I am a far cry from any elite savage-clear player myself.', well even if you don't have high standards, that doesn't mean that you aren't an ass.
    Yeah, I know. Truth hurts.
    It's a well know fact that most players in MMOs are rather... well... bad.

    10 years in a raiding guild + officer experience + analyzing performances in logs confirm the above.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by RohanV View Post
    I've been musing lately that the "high-skill" gameplay in FFXIV is very different than the "low-skill" gameplay. For example, if you're a tank running with a high-skill healer, you do things like switch stances, more dps combos, etc. On the other hand, if you can't trust your healer, you don't do things like that (well, maybe WAR does).
    Hit the nail right on the head.

  18. #33198
    Quote Originally Posted by Valaut View Post
    About the whole 'Healer has to DPS QQ' argument taking 6 pages or so, I'd like to say the following:

    When you encounter a bad dps, or a mediocre one, you don't go telling them 'Hey you fucking suck, do your rotation perfectly and perform good enough to reach DPS reqs for A12 Savage in this Expert dungeon!!!!'. If you do, you are an elitist and should just get out immediately, cause no one likes you.

    This is the case for healers too, if they can heal well, but don't do enough dps, that means that they are the equivalent of a mediocre dps. So you shouldn't call them horrible players or whatever.

    I'd like to mention that I was a Paladin for the entirety of my FF XIV experience, so neither of those cases are about ME. I just want to defend the healers that some of you act like jerks towards. An as a WHM alt, I usually spam Stone, Wind, Assize and Holy as much as possible, especially Holy cause it's gorgeous. But that's MY CHOICE

    I have cleared only up to A7 savage when it was current and I am by no means an Elysium player, but I am not a horrible one either. Back then, 1.2-1.3k dps was pretty good for a Paladin, while sustaining themselves, I don't know what's the norm now. But I have never complained about people only healing, or doing their rotations badly. You know why? Because I don't have this accursed ACT shit installed to check others. If someone fails, and we can't do the run, I can simply leave, no need to be a jerk. How do I know my performance you ask? Simple, all I have to do is ask one of my raiders to inform me about my performance through their ACT. I also asked them to tell me whenever my group would be wiping and I would have to replace someone, or give them a tip about how to improve.

    Also @ Granyala, you said earlier 'Most people I encounter horribly SUCK an this game and I'n not even setting high standards, because I am a far cry from any elite savage-clear player myself.', well even if you don't have high standards, that doesn't mean that you aren't an ass.
    So you get a pass because you personally don't have it installed even though you're more than willing to ask for the information from someone else and use it to your advantage? Yeah that goes over about as well as a crooked politician trying to get out of a murder charge because HE didn't pull the trigger...it was the assassin he paid that pulled the trigger. GTFO.

    You're missing the point entirely.

    Also, most people don't like or appreciate getting called out when they're doing something wrong, and the person calling them out therefore looks like an ass to them. Well, as @Granyala already said, the truth hurts sometimes. I personally would rather come across as a little bit of an ass for pointing out how someone is "doing it wrong" and provide some feedback than suffer through a dungeon or raid with someone either deliberately or inadvertently not doing their job and making the whole situation worse for everyone involved. If the person is willing to listen to criticism and improve their performance it's win win, if they're an ass about it and refuse to improve then it's lose lose...but in that situation I'd usually kick them. But for me their performance has to be REALLY bad for me to take it that far.

    As I've said before, along with many others (someone even has a quote about it), yeah you pay your sub...but so do the other people in the group/ raid which means there's always AT LEAST 3 more people who pay a sub alongside you, which means you're in the minority. Playing sub optimally on purpose is disrespectful to everyone else in the group, and being unwilling to change your playstyle to be more effective and/or helpful to the group or raid is just as disrespectful.
    Last edited by Katchii; 2017-05-24 at 06:23 PM.

  19. #33199
    Quote Originally Posted by Faroth View Post
    This is why I think the MSQ is important: ______
    Response: No it's not, nobody should have to do it if they don't want to. It's stupid. It's not even good. In fact, it's shit.

    This is why I'm concerned about opening the floodgates to people who don't care about the game as it is.
    Response: *ignore concern entirely & talk about how something else supports an opposing fact

    These are the reason I'm concerned about development being pushed to become more like WoW and lose what makes FFXIV different, based on what I've seen before.
    Response: None of that ever happened, let me tell you why everything about this game is wrong despite claiming I love this game.

    "The MSQ shouldn't even be a part of the game's requirements, even for each expansion at launch."
    "I disagree, here's why the MSQ is crucial and a core of the game: [Present reasons]"
    "The MSQ is shit, it shouldn't be forced on players."
    "Again, [Repeat reasons]"
    "I don't see why anyone has to bother with this if they don't want to!"

    That's pretty much how it feels 9 times out of 10. That's why people get emotional responses to suggestions of "This game needs to be completely changed, I don't care how many of you love it, obviously more of us hate it because I perceive it so and want it to be different." It feels like if you like the game, you have to address demands for change with rational analysis, but the ones demanding change have no burden to evaluate why the systems are in place or why people want them to remain. It's a one way discussion where one side is always kept on the defensive of the discussion. End result: They get defensive.

    To be clear, Wreck, I consider you in the 1 out of 10, even if we butt heads. One day, perhaps I shall have a pizza with you and we will create the greatest MMORPG ever imagined. It'll fall apart due to lack of funding, but WE'LL CREATE IT ON PAPER!
    I'm not going to say every person is as eloquent and unbiased as I am, because that'd be a lie lol. However, sometimes people just want to be heard and you have to tease the information out of them (if you want it, otherwise I recommend just ignoring their post). For instance the one guy earlier who was really aggressive about some stuff. All it took was a simple calm down and explain your feelings logically and you might get better responses, I felt that they did once they followed that advice.

    You'll see me use this strategy a lot when someone is being particularly obtuse. Instead of trying to refute them offer them the opportunity to clarify or deepen their stance. You can sometimes find that people aren't talking about what they think they are or something else entirely. The MSQ is shit. etc. etc. Instead of responding with all the good about it, ask them to clarify why is it shit? What features are bad? Are there any redeeming ones? What would you change if you could, etc.?

    Quote Originally Posted by RohanV View Post
    I've been musing lately that the "high-skill" gameplay in FFXIV is very different than the "low-skill" gameplay. For example, if you're a tank running with a high-skill healer, you do things like switch stances, more dps combos, etc. On the other hand, if you can't trust your healer, you don't do things like that (well, maybe WAR does).

    In contrast, in WoW, high-skill gameplay is more or less the same as low-skill gameplay. You do roughly the same thing, but execute at a higher level.

    I think a lot of the disagreement about FFXIV these days comes from people having trouble with the switch from low-skill to high-skill playstyles, especially in random groups. Some people insist that you should start with and expect high-skill gameplay. Other people prefer to start with low-skill, and once you're sure the group can handle it, switch to high-skill. Some people aren't confident in their skills, and would prefer to play with the safer low-skill gameplay.
    The first part is dead on.

    The second part, while I can't speak for everyone, its usually not about requiring high level play in trivial content, it's always been about effort. You can do low#s, but be there. Be trying. Cast abilities that make sense, avoid damage, etc. Ask questions, etc. Watching netflix while healing is not putting effort in. Doing 360 dps in i220 gear is not effort (I don't know DPS numbers these days) that's pushing one button over and over regardless of the situation.

    Regarding my personal approach. I always start high intensity and dial it back if necessary. I'm a firm believer that putting people in the shit shows their true character. If someone asks me to dial it back I always do.

  20. #33200
    I honestly dont see whats so hard about communnication.

    As a tank. Start the dungeons saying "Big pulls?". Healer responds and you are good to go. DPS are irrelevant. Thier job doesnt become any easier or harder by the so called high-skill gameplay.

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