After G7 summit, Merkel: "Europe Must Plot Own Course"

[Slant]

Dude, I was making fun of the guy's logic. :P I'm trying to figure out (through humor) how Germany could POSSIBLY be invading other countries like they clame. It was a made up scenario for the sake of poking fun at the idiotic poster Gilrak was referring to. I know everybody in EU is independent, that's kinda the point really in showing how silly the idea was. :P

I know, I'm supporting your view, I just wanted to stress that point, because so many people don't look beyond the drivel that was used over the Brexit and now think Germany is somehow puppeteering everyone in Europe. Which is so insane.

[Felya]

Like the Russia, Germany has had the same goal in mind for over a century. Domination of the European continent.

Not true, world/Europe dominance was limited to WW2. WW1 was not on Germany and being treated with the above logic after WW1, is what lead to Germany becoming what it did for WW2. Hitler explicitly used anti-West propaganda for being punished severely after WW1, to gain power.

Modern day Germany is not the Imperial Germany of the past, nor is it the Nazi Germany of its past. But it is still Germany, and its goal is to dominate and control Europe. Since war has failed them so many times, they are now attempting conquest through their economy. And they're proving to be somewhat successful.

Historically inaccurate premise, leading to a conclusion completely removed from reality.

The US has never dominated Europe.

Yeah, we have. For the last 70 years we dominated Europe. We are the ones that have military all over Europe. The dollar is the dominant trade currency, not the Euro. But, when starting with Germany, the fact that we explicitly dominated half of it, just 30 years ago, it exemplifiers the disconnect with reality at play here.

The US has simply protected Europe from being totally destroyed by the Russians and the Germans yet again. America asks for a strong, prosperous, peaceful, and independent Europe. Germany asks for subservience.

This is insane... Protect from Germany that was split between Russia and US for the majority of the last 100 years? At which point are you going to realize our dominance in Europe is to protect our selfs? We cannot build the military response to threats from Middle Easy or Europe or even Russia, without having bases all over Europe. That's our power...

[Dezerte]

I wouldn't count the US out yet, it can survive Trump for 4 or even 8 years I believe. But it certainly seems like, for at least at the moment, that the US presidency has little interest in diplomacy and we should be clear about what we think of that.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Would be nice if we would stop bowing down to the US, we can only win for ourselves that way.

[Voidism]

I like Merkel. I like germans.

I wouldn't mind being ""dominated"" by Germany.
People always say domination as if it's inherently bad...

[Draco-Onis]

To me it's just common sense. If Europe wants to be out from under the US defence umbrella, but not spend more on their own defence (which means cuts in social welfare etc, and is thus unthinkable), they HAVE to have good relations with Russia et al. Otherwise Russia just has its own way with them all, because Putin has muscle to bully them.

It takes two to tango Russia seems to have no interest in getting along with its neighbors, Putin needs that tension to keep the Russian people in check otherwise they may start focusing on how horrible they are doing domestically.

[Felya]

Would be nice if we would stop bowing down to the US, we can only win for ourselves that way.

Do you love the irony of Trump supporters complaining about Europe's dominance of US? Ain't that hoot?

[Draco-Onis]

Do you love the irony of Trump supporters complaining about Europe's dominance of US? Ain't that hoot?

Trump supporters couldn't tell France from Germany on a map

[Cosmic Janitor]

Trump supporters couldn't tell France from Germany on a map

Half of them probably think Spain is south of Texas..

[Drutt]

they HAVE to have good relations with Russia et al. Otherwise Russia just has its own way with them all, because Putin has muscle to bully them.

That just doesn't add up.

German and French military spending alone is more than the Russian military budget. Individually, they're a bit behind Russia but certainly not by an order of magnitude.

Anyone who honestly believes Russia could bully the EU in the face of the combined military might of the EU nations has been fooled by years of Russian posturing.

[Deleted]

We don't feel like Germany rules over us, you're trying too hard.

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Work together so we can stand against the other world powers?

I'm glad you can speak for your entire people, or I mean, the entire continent of Europe.

[Felya]

To me it's just common sense. If Europe wants to be out from under the US defence umbrella, but not spend more on their own defence (which means cuts in social welfare etc, and is thus unthinkable), they HAVE to have good relations with Russia et al. Otherwise Russia just has its own way with them all, because Putin has muscle to bully them.

This is not true. Russia does not have the capacity to muscle anyone. Europe, with Germany specifically, switching over to renewable energy, it cut off Russia's influence. With oil prices dropping, prior to Trump at least, while Europe taking initiative to get away from oil, Russia is losing influence. It's not a coincidence that Russian espionage has exploded, at a time when their ability to thrust influence in Europe is fading.

Russia cannot fight either economically or militarily wise, against either Europe or US. Especially if US and EU are a united force. It pushes Russia squarely to China, which isn't that hot of a relationship either. The only thing Russia can do now is divide Europe and cut US interest. Which they have done successfully, by blaming all ills on the west. They need to maintain oil prices as much as possible and keep things like the Paris accord as empty as possible. Which again they are being successful with, as Trump sees similar benefit in oil and angst towards renewable energy, as Russia does.

Things like the OP is what Russia needs to stay relevant... divide and conquer...

[Mayhem]

I'm glad you can speak for your entire people, or I mean, the entire continent of Europe.

Considering the majority want's to give the EU more power rather than less, his assertion isn't unfounded.

[Draco-Onis]

I'm glad you can speak for your entire people, or I mean, the entire continent of Europe.

Well most polls show a distrust of Brussels not Germany, the Germans seems to have mostly positive image in the EU. The EU needs a makeover so Germany and France are in the best position to put in changes to make it more popular and if the UK didn't brexit they could have shaped its future.

[Felya]

That just doesn't add up.

German and French military spending alone is more than the Russian military budget. Individually, they're a bit behind Russia but certainly not by an order of magnitude.

Anyone who honestly believes Russia could bully the EU in the face of the combined military might of the EU nations has been fooled by years of Russian posturing.

Divide and conquer... With Trump using all ways that US dominates the world, as a negative and doubling down on fossil fuel. There has not been a point where Russian influence has the capacity to grow, as it has now. The trust of the west is at a low point, the unity that US and EU had for 70+ years is fading fast. After 3 decades of political demand to get off fossil fuels in US, we have given up and are even questioning the Paris accord. Russia has not been in a better position for at least 50 years.

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I'm glad you can speak for your entire people, or I mean, the entire continent of Europe.

Great reply, to someone explicitly saying we should work together.

[Deleted]

Not true, world/Europe dominance was limited to WW2. WW1 was not on Germany and being treated with the above logic after WW1, is what lead to Germany becoming what it did for WW2. Hitler explicitly used anti-West propaganda for being punished severely after WW1, to gain power.



Historically inaccurate premise, leading to a conclusion completely removed from reality.



Yeah, we have. For the last 70 years we dominated Europe. We are the ones that have military all over Europe. The dollar is the dominant trade currency, not the Euro. But, when starting with Germany, the fact that we explicitly dominated half of it, just 30 years ago, it exemplifiers the disconnect with reality at play here.



This is insane... Protect from Germany that was split between Russia and US for the majority of the last 100 years? At which point are you going to realize our dominance in Europe is to protect our selfs? We cannot build the military response to threats from Middle Easy or Europe or even Russia, without having bases all over Europe. That's our power...

You really think that we can't project military power in the Middle East without Germany? This must be a joke. The US doesn't need Germany to conduct military operations in the Middle East.

The goal of Germany before WW1 was to conquer Europe. WW1 was anticipated by Germany, and was instigated by Germany. I'm not buying into western propaganda, you're buying into Nazi propaganda. Germany was an Empire looking for total conquest and domination of continental Europe.

And how is my premise historically inaccurate? Germany has trIed to dominate Europe since the fall Napoleon. That's historically accurate. Don't try to play down the past because it doesn't conform to your current view of Germany. You can disagree with me on their intentions now, but their past intentions are historical facts.

We have military stationed in Germany because Germany tried the world conquest thing a couple of times. And oh, let's not forget about the holocaust. Our occupation of Germany was necessary, and it was in no way an occupation of Europe. I feel like you've gotten all of your history from German textbooks, at this point.

We split Germany because they tried to dominate Europe. We split Europe to prevent another war. Sorry, pal, but the we'd likely be living a post apocalyptic world if we had just let Germany get off for their crimes against the entire world. Fighting in WW2 wasn't some power play. It was a crusade against tyranny and pure evil. Of all wars, it was the most justified. The only reason we're in Europe today is to protect against Russia, and from the Germans. Not to fight off ISIS.

[Elba]

They can save a hell of a lot on defence though, which is a plus.

Lol, you really think defense spending would decrease? Hell, it will cost more if they can't use our infrastructure.

[Independent voter]

Putin must be chortling with glee and rubbing his hands together. "Yes, yes, my plans are coming to fruition!"

[Darkeon]

Why are you?

I'd re-read it, fella.

[Blade Wolf]

So we've gone from Merkel wanting to drown Europe with refugees to her wanting complete European domination with Germany leading it?