Tinkers In Our Future?

[Rhamses]

I'm thinking they would probably just scrap the engineering profession (or maybe just revamp the whole profession system) and call the Tinker, the Engineer. It's more marketable, so i wouldn't be surprised.

I doubt it. The term "Tinker" is well known in the WoW community, and it's immediately recognizable as a term for Gnome or Goblin inventors who use technology to fight with. Even the Warcraft RPG used "Tinker" as a character class instead of Engineer.

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Point is. Goblin and Gnomes are the least popular races, now why would they give a class EXCLUSIVELY to the two races that people like the least? It does not make sense and they already know it would backfire.

Had they given the class to Orcs and Draenei as well as the midget races, then I could POSSIBLY see it happening, the Orcs have always been great at engineering and the Draenei's technology is far superior to anything else in Warcraft and they also have the best engineers in the lore as proven by the Exodar.

Problem is that Orcs and Draenei piloting mechs looks pretty dumb, and a Tinker class using every type of tech in the game would be unfocused. Classes should be focused, and the specs should be somewhat interrelated. While having Goblin tech in one spec, and Draenei tech in another spec sounds cool on paper, in reality it would be all over the place and kill the class fantasy.

Tinker will destroy the Engineering profession's purpose and they can definitely not remove engineering altogether because a lot of people have paid tons of gold to get that shit up to max. And also, they've never done a new class after one another so I don't see it happening.

Nah, engineering will be fine. In fact, I think that a tech class would actually increase the popularity of the profession.

[Ielenia]

Problem is that Orcs and Draenei piloting mechs looks pretty dumb,

No, they don't. Proof if that is all those mech mounts we have and even Tauren piloting those look cool.

and a Tinker class using every type of tech in the game would be unfocused. Classes should be focused, and the specs should be somewhat interrelated. While having Goblin tech in one spec, and Draenei tech in another spec sounds cool on paper, in reality it would be all over the place and kill the class fantasy.

"Unfocused"? "Unfocused" how? And your idea of each spec having a "race" identity makes no sense. At best it's going to be mostly "generic tech" with one or two abilities focusing on the player's race, like shamans and their totems.

[Rhamses]

No, they don't. Proof if that is all those mech mounts we have and even Tauren piloting those look cool.

Those are mounts, not combat forms. Also they would have to have their size reduced in order for them to fit into doorways/hallways within dungeons, making them look even sillier. Mechs work for Gnomes and Goblins because they're so small. You could make a Gnome or Goblin mech Draenei or Tauren size and it works out just fine. You can't make a Draenei riding a mech into Draenei size, that just wouldn't make any sense.

"Unfocused"? "Unfocused" how? And your idea of each spec having a "race" identity makes no sense. At best it's going to be mostly "generic tech" with one or two abilities focusing on the player's race, like shamans and their totems.

You got my response mixed up. I was saying that a class needs to have cohesive specs, so having specs with racial identities wouldn't work. I agree with you that there will be individualized cosmetics determined by the race of the pilot.

[Ielenia]

Those are mounts, not combat forms. Also they would have to have their size reduced in order for them to fit into doorways/hallways within dungeons,

You're acting as if it's 100% factual that, if implemented, the tech class will run around permanently in a mech and not just have it as a cooldown like Metamorphosis or Avatar or Ascension. That's unlikely to happen, for the reasons you just stated.

[Rhamses]

You're acting as if it's 100% factual that, if implemented, the tech class will run around permanently in a mech and not just have it as a cooldown like Metamorphosis or Avatar or Ascension. That's unlikely to happen, for the reasons you just stated.

If the class is restricted to Gnomes and Goblins, they certainly could run around permanently in mech mode if that's what they want to do. In some cases they would have to, since there are dungeons that have doorways that the player has to move through while fighting.

[Ielenia]

If the class is restricted to Gnomes and Goblins, they certainly could run around permanently in mech mode if that's what they want to do.

Even then, it's unlikely to happen.

In some cases they would have to, since there are dungeons that have doorways that the player has to move through while fighting.

Not sure if you noticed, the smallest door one has to go through while in a fight you could pass a dragon through without much trouble.

[Saverem]

We already have Tinkerers, they're called Engineers.

[Rhamses]

Even then, it's unlikely to happen.

What's unlikely to happen?

Not sure if you noticed, the smallest door one has to go through while in a fight you could pass a dragon through without much trouble.

You really think you could fit a dragon through the doorways in Shadowfang Keep or the Stockades? Yeah right!

[Ielenia]

What's unlikely to happen?

Perma-tank.

You really think you could fit a dragon through the doorways in Shadowfang Keep or the Stockades? Yeah right!

*shrug* So a few lower level dungeons have smaller doors, but still, even using size-enhancing items, I'm pretty sure you can still run through them, unless something changed recently. For the higher levels, point still stands. Especially in raids.

[Teriz]

We already have Tinkerers, they're called Engineers.

We have an Engineer class in WoW? When did that happen?

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You really think you could fit a dragon through the doorways in Shadowfang Keep or the Stockades? Yeah right!

Yeah, even Draenei and Tauren have collision issues with some doorways in a few dungeons. No way Blizzard would make something bigger than a Tauren or Draenei as something playable. A Tauren or Draenei driving a mech would have to be larger than the character themselves. As you said, Gnomes and Goblins don't have that issue because they're far smaller.

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Perma-tank.

Probably not a perma-tank, but something akin to Guardian Druids, which stay in tank form the majority of the time.

*shrug* So a few lower level dungeons have smaller doors, but still, even using size-enhancing items, I'm pretty sure you can still run through them, unless something changed recently. For the higher levels, point still stands. Especially in raids.

No, if you use size-enhancing potions, you can't get through regular-sized doorways, that's a fact.

[Rhamses]

Perma-tank.

Wouldn't a tank have to stay in tank mode during a dungeon fight?

*shrug* So a few lower level dungeons have smaller doors, but still, even using size-enhancing items, I'm pretty sure you can still run through them, unless something changed recently. For the higher levels, point still stands. Especially in raids.

I'm pretty sure Blizzard designs characters to fit in all dungeons and instances.

Not really sure why you're arguing about this. Goblins and Gnomes being the size of Taurens while riding a mech solves the problem, and just makes a lot more sense than having a Draenei in a mech be the exact same size as a standard Draenei.

[-Joker-]

No. As far as I know, he never appeared. Care to show where has it appeared in any of the previous Warcraft games and their expansions, please?

None of those existed before WoW, so you're making a point against an argument that does not exist, rendering your entire point rather moot.

How did you put it? Ignoring shit doesn't make it wrong, or instantly disqualify it. Also, being willfully ignorant doesn't help this discussion, so I'd say we're done here.

[Ielenia]

Probably not a perma-tank, but something akin to Guardian Druids, which stay in tank form the majority of the time.

... In other words, a perma-tank, since it has no time limit for usage.

No, if you use size-enhancing potions, you can't get through regular-sized doorways, that's a fact.

True. I tested that. However, that's unlikely to be an issue, since giving 'perma-tank' is a very unlikely idea, and two, in the unlikely event that the 'perma-tank' exists, if given at the character at later levels, it doesn't become an issue as the later dungeons have wider and taller passageways. and raids are, in their vast majority, huge in scope.

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Wouldn't a tank have to stay in tank mode during a dungeon fight?

Cute.

Not really sure why you're arguing about this. Goblins and Gnomes being the size of Taurens while riding a mech solves the problem, and just makes a lot more sense than having a Draenei in a mech be the exact same size as a standard Draenei.

I'd say that's one more reason why giving an actual mech for the tinker as a permanent "form" is unlikely.

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How did you put it? Ignoring shit doesn't make it wrong, or instantly disqualify it. Also, being willfully ignorant doesn't help this discussion, so I'd say we're done here.

You made the claim that Gelbin Mekkatorque appeared in an official campaign, and when I called your BS, instead of either showing your evidence to back your claim, or owning up to it and admitting you were making stuff up, you decide to act "holier-than-thou" and try to weasel yourself out by trying to put the blame on me.

Grow a pair and man up. Either show the evidence of your claim, or admit that you were making stuff up.

[Raugnaut]

I personally would like it, providing that its a tank, dps, and heal trinity.

Tank - Armored suit. Goblins/Gnomes have already been mentioned with their robo-suit/Shredder. But you could also have, say, Draenei tinkers with their Auchindoun suits, or Troll tinkers with a Golem, ect.

Dps - Ranged weaponry imo. Ranged explosives, grenades, ray-guns, ect.

Heal - Chemical healing. Like the WC3 Alchemist hero.

[Teriz]

... In other words, a perma-tank, since it has no time limit for usage.

Gotcha.

True. I tested that. However, that's unlikely to be an issue, since giving 'perma-tank' is a very unlikely idea, and two, in the unlikely event that the 'perma-tank' exists, if given at the character at later levels, it doesn't become an issue as the later dungeons have wider and taller passageways. and raids are, in their vast majority, huge in scope.

It becomes an issue if the class begins at level 1 and needs to level through old content, which is highly likely. I don't think a Tinker class would be a hero class.

[Ielenia]

It becomes an issue if the class begins at level 1 and needs to level through old content, which is highly likely. I don't think a Tinker class would be a hero class.

Re-read what I wrote in that quote: "if given to the character at later levels", meaning he gets that ability at, say, level 35 or 45. It's not like low level content is hard or anything. All a tank needs to do is hold aggro since everything does super-fast. Don't need to even touch your survival CDs.

[Teriz]

Re-read what I wrote in that quote: "if given to the character at later levels", meaning he gets that ability at, say, level 35 or 45. It's not like low level content is hard or anything. All a tank needs to do is hold aggro since everything does super-fast. Don't need to even touch your survival CDs.

Based on modern class design, its fairly unlikely that they'll keep the main aspect of a tank spec's ability until later levels. In every case, regular classes get their main tank attributes at level 10, when they choose their spec. Further, if you're rolling a mech class, you're going to want to ride around in that mech as quickly as possible.

Additionally, I'm willing to bet that there's later dungeons that also have doorways that dragons can't fit through, like Blackrock Depths, Stormstout Brewery, or Grim Batol.

Again, all of this is resolved if you just keep a tinker class exclusive to Gnomes and Goblins.

[Ielenia]

Based on modern class design, its fairly unlikely that they'll keep the main aspect of a tank spec's ability until later levels. In every case, regular classes get their main tank attributes at level 10, when they choose their spec. Further, if you're rolling a mech class, you're going to want to ride around in that mech as quickly as possible.

Additionally, I'm willing to bet that there's later dungeons that also have doorways that dragons can't fit through, like Blackrock Depths, Stormstout Brewery, or Grim Batol.

Again, all of this is resolved if you just keep a tinker class exclusive to Gnomes and Goblins.

So I asked a friend of mine to help with a couple comparing shots:

None of us are using size-altering buffs or debuffs, and you can see that, in comparison, the gnome riding the mech looks much bigger than the night elf standing normally, and still bigger even when the night elf climbs into a mech as well. I mean, Tauren druids' Moonkin form isn't too big, and a human riding a mech isn't much bigger (if at all, didn't compare) than a moonkin, so why do you say it would look 'silly'?

[Alydael]

We already have Tinkers on Azeroth, but should they be a playable class?

I think they should remove engineering as a prof and make a tinker class based off of it.

I also think they should remove the "mechanical" pets for hunters and shift that over to the tinker class as well (maybe one spec can be a pet spec based around little robots and mechs).

I imagine the tinker class not so much as a class that has "specs" but a class that preps (or "tinkers") for what is needed for the raid that night. He/she tailors their creations for what their role will be.

[Teriz]

So I asked a friend of mine to help with a couple comparing shots:

None of us are using size-altering buffs or debuffs, and you can see that, in comparison, the gnome riding the mech looks much bigger than the night elf standing normally, and still bigger even when the night elf climbs into a mech as well. I mean, Tauren druids' Moonkin form isn't too big, and a human riding a mech isn't much bigger (if at all, didn't compare) than a moonkin, so why do you say it would look 'silly'?

It's silly because a larger character would make a larger overall character when a mech is applied. Again, a Draenei already has some collision issues with doorways. A Draenei in a mech would be far too large to fit through. The only way that would work is if they squish the character in size and make it the same size, or only slightly larger than a standard Draenei, which makes no sense and looks silly.

Also it's doubtful that a mech used for a player class would be the Sky Golem (though I would hope that they would use something similar for Goblin tinkers).

Again, if the class is Goblin/Gnome only, none of this is a problem.