Elemental 7.2.5 [Rant]

[Torm]

Hey guys, have you noticed those amazing changes in 7.2.5?



Tier 20 set bonuses? Only good for Council fights. Rest? Pretty much useless - on AoE we don't Flame Shock, on Single Target 'it's something I guess'. Shadow priests had similar set bonus and they ranted and got new one, better. We rant, we get nothing. And just side-note. Imagine how amazing those tier sets would be in M+ dungeons! AMAGAD!

New legendary ring? Oh nice free Echo of the Elements! But what to take instead of it? Storm Elemental? Nah, it's like 30k DPS decrease when you are not using any talent at all! (Yes, we have talent to lower our overall DPS, how amazing). So what about Liquid Magma Totem? Didn't they remove Searing Totem because it was boring af to maintain it every minute? /meh

New legendary gloves? They gonna get nerfed to the ground. Atm we can get infinite Ascendance with Earthquake on 4+ targets. Pretty amazing. Maybe if they would leave it as it is, we could be competetive

So how excited are you, about rerolling new more competetive class?
AoE niche? Oh thanks for that!

[Rezhka]

The only thing that can make Storm Elemental worth is to make it not replacing Fire Ele. It was good for single target back then (eventhough not that great), rather than current.

[Nyoken]

I'm use to it at this point...I don't expect anything over the top for Ele shamans anymore.

[Nyel]

I mean we are great on cleave and AoE fights but we are super bad when it comes to ST. Flame Shock still feels more of a hindrance then a benefit. Maelstorm should not only increase its duration but its damage as well. And even then our ST would be bad.

[Deleted]

If you watch PTR 7.2.5 raid fights, where Ele is super bugged aka. you can have unlimited uptime on ascendence -> and STILL with 100% uptime on ascendence ele shaman doesnt win in ST dmg.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T260GkwaWo

Notice the ele shaman named Trogorr - he has 100% uptime on ascende due to the new legendary end EQ bug, but still he doesnt do jack shit.

How sucky is ele shaman balance that even when their most powerful talent has 100% uptime, they dont do anything special.

This combined with the worst T20 bonus of all classes makes shaman a dead class.

[Nyel]

The thing is, Ascendence only improves Lava Burst. It doesn't do anything for FS, ES or LB. Lava Burst "spam" sounds good but really isn't because LvB isn't that strong. If Ascendence would be a +dmg% CD it would be different but it just removes the CD of LvB. That's not enough to be competitive.

[Socialhealer]

everything they're doing for ele shows they don't know how the spec works at all, clueless morons.

tier set buffs our multidotting, when we're a shit multidotting class anyway, it does nothing when we aoe, and it's pretty shit single target where we struggle, as you said the legendary ring gives us 2 talents we can do without, and perma ascendance seems hilariously broken and OP but its weak as fuck anyway.

the spec needs people who have a fucking clue, blizzard just make random changes and choices and then need another 7 months to re-work the spec because it's not viable for progression.....AGAIN.

[Torm]

I heard funny argument today on Facebook after certain Wowhead post. Commenting that Elemental Shamans are strong. They are doing high numbers on normal and heroic and they actually should be nerfed. I laughed.

[Nyel]

They are doing good on AoE and stacked fights. In most parts of Mythic+ as well. But as soon you need ST damage and there is no secondary target they become just bad.

[Deleted]

You would be better off playing Fire mage in 7.2.5 - they have sick AOE and their ST dmg is around 1-1,2mill currently on like 6min fights.

I doubt ele shaman can break 900k on ST over a 6min fight

[UnSigNed547]

Blizzard is too proud of their own creation in the T20 elemental set bonuses, so they fail to see that every elemental shaman is ranting about wanting change even from when they were first released and they promised all the bonuses were placeholder. Our bonuses still are the same and it's just as awful.

[Ele man]

I kept commenting here that ele is not suitable for raids.
However, people who are not interested in Mythic raid say that ele is useful. Even without experiencing it, they say.
I honestly do not know how hard these people here are playing wow. Their words are far from reality.

Ele is totally useless in top raid. This is not related to the performance of t20.
Even if damage is increased by 10%, this is the same.
When you look at wcl, ele is finally at the bottom. Nighthold's battle is designed to be very beneficial to ele. But ele is bottom dps spec.
Without fundamentally major changes or additions of utilities, the positions will be the same throughout the legion.
Do not expect this spec. I do not know if I'm pessimistic, but I'm just telling the truth.

[Deleted]

Right now ele is being pushed to the bottom of nh logs, because as raid groups gear up, things tend to die too fast. What this means in practice is that you have less add spawns/phases and less uptime on those, which translates to less chances to proc RNG overloads.

The fun part is that ToS has exactly one fight that allows for heavy add padding, with pretty much everything else being elemental's achilles heel - single target with heavy movement. It really doesn't take a genius to figure out where that will put this spec in 7.2.5, considering that at this moment we are due for precisely zero single target improvements of any kind.

What is Blizzard thinking? I honestly believe they don't give a toss. They chose a few specs to focus on for this patch cycle and that's it, the rest can either stfu or reroll as far as they are concerned.

[furiousferret]

All I know right now now is Ele is a liability in 6 of the 10 fights in Nighthold. We're bottom 3 in all those, and dead last in Trilliax and Elisande. Our poor single target does not make up for our niche aoe, other classes with great aoe don't have as drastic a drop off in ST fights.

I don't know about the T20 bonuses, we'll see how it plays out. Echo isn't a great dual talent, we don't need it aoe and if Storm Ele is that bad then its concerning.

I'm really concerned that we'll be left with no viable dps options in 7.2.5. I'll go resto but we already have a resto shammy.

[Crysth]

All I know right now now is Ele is a liability in 6 of the 10 fights in Nighthold. We're bottom 3 in all those, and dead last in Trilliax and Elisande. Our poor single target does not make up for our niche aoe, other classes with great aoe don't have as drastic a drop off in ST fights.

I don't know about the T20 bonuses, we'll see how it plays out. Echo isn't a great dual talent, we don't need it aoe and if Storm Ele is that bad then its concerning.

I'm really concerned that we'll be left with no viable dps options in 7.2.5. I'll go resto but we already have a resto shammy.

I've been gearing up and practicing enhance. I know its not stellar, but at least if I'm gonna be bottom tier, I'll at least be melee and have to deal with mechanics less.

[frychikn]

So I ask this question to all of you.

if you wanted to play a caster character, why would you roll an ele shaman over say a mage that has 3 specs?

I ask this because i've recently kind of hit a wall where I am asking myself this same question. I keep asking myself why the hell am I playing enhancement that sucks right now when I can play a rogue and i'll have a guaranteed good spec. Not to mention if I ever get bored of 1 of the specs, I have 2 more specs that fill the same role. If I get tired of Elemental, I have a melee and resto spec to play.

Maybe I'm stressing over stupid stuff, but I just cant fathom why I thought playing a hybrid would be better than playing a pure.

[Quulawl]

Personally, I play this ele since I started wow back in Vanilla. No other spec is filled with more fun for me like ele. On top of that I have so many acms, reputations exalted etc. which I'll never farm on a second char again.

Long story short - I've been an ele for too long and can't simply switch. Even if after such a long time I lost all hope that blizzard will ever make us viable.

[niil945]

Ele is totally useless in top raid. This is not related to the performance of t20.
Even if damage is increased by 10%, this is the same.
When you look at wcl, ele is finally at the bottom. Nighthold's battle is designed to be very beneficial to ele. But ele is bottom dps spec.
Without fundamentally major changes or additions of utilities, the positions will be the same throughout the legion.
Do not expect this spec. I do not know if I'm pessimistic, but I'm just telling the truth.

Granted, I'm certainly not going to say ele is fine, but you're being hyperbolic to a degree that detracts from your argument. There are 4 other specs that don't perform as well as Elemental in Nighthold. You are not on the bottom. You're not too far off by any means, but you are not the bottom.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/11

[Deleted]

Granted, I'm certainly not going to say ele is fine, but you're being hyperbolic to a degree that detracts from your argument. There are 4 other specs that don't perform as well as Elemental in Nighthold. You are not on the bottom. You're not too far off by any means, but you are not the bottom.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/11

Elemental is propped up pretty hard by Aluriel and Tichondrius though where Tichondrius is almost pure pad. Take them out and things would be much worse. Elemental is decent at bursting down adds (provided they sync with SK) but single target is tragic, we have the lowest boss dps overall.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...metric=bossdps

Nighthold design seems to favour elemental yet it still does quite poorly, tomb is looking more single target oriented and unless we see some nice tuning changes we will definitely be in that bottom spot.

[niil945]

Elemental is propped up pretty hard by Aluriel and Tichondrius though where Tichondrius is almost pure pad. Take them out and things would be much worse. Elemental is decent at bursting down adds (provided they sync with SK) but single target is tragic, we have the lowest boss dps overall.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...metric=bossdps

Nighthold design seems to favour elemental yet it still does quite poorly, tomb is looking more single target oriented and unless we see some nice tuning changes we will definitely be in that bottom spot.

Sure, I'm not saying they're amazing or anything. And I wasn't disputing that they're poor at single target. I play shadow, a spec that's one above you on the single target only list and below you in the overall. But adds matter. To remove them is simply biasing the results to favor the outcome you want to show. As an easy example shadow gains insanity off adds. Removing that damage doesn't remove the insanity that's gained by having VT on them, which is improving our single target by improving our void form uptime and getting us back into void form quicker. You can call it padding and meaningless all you want but those adds need to be killed and they do impact single target damage in meaningful ways that aren't simple to just remove the damage done value and have a realistic and complete picture of the total single target damage done. Unless of course you want to pretend that in this particular tier you are the worst damage dealer of all when you are in fact not.