Sylvanas Knowingly Damns Her Rangers?

[Mehrunes]

And Sylvanas is a character I do not like, she's a character I want gone. The stuff she has done is bad and, even if she isn't QUITE as bad as the Lich King, I see her as being on the same path leading to it. It's just a matter of time.

Unless you count getting captured by Kil'jaedan and entombed by him in a block of ice (and even KJ isn't stupid enough to do it again after it backfired in his face) no one can be on the same path as the Lich King because there was no path for the Lich King. He didn't descent into villainy. From the get go he wanted to scour all life, starting with humanity. Something that Sylvanas isn't remotely close to.

It was long 12 years, but a good one. Let us hope for 12 more.

Also: 12 more years of high elves not being playable race.

There is not enough space on Earth to contain another 12 years' worth of this level of salt generation.

[Friendlyimmolation]

isn't slyvanas main job right now just trying to survive

Survival of her and the Forsaken, so yea.

Second: For someone who leads so many forsaken, and is undead as well, it would make sense for them to learn some necromancy. EVERYONE can learn it.

if Hecular is anything to show by it, its hard for a necromancer to raise a single sentient undead unless powered by the lich king.

[Sigxy]

Unless you count getting captured by Kil'jaedan and entombed by him in a block of ice (and even KJ isn't stupid enough to do it again after it backfired in his face) no one can be on the same path as the Lich King because there was no path for the Lich King. He didn't descent into villainy. From the get go he wanted to scour all life, starting with humanity. Something that Sylvanas isn't remotely close to.

I obviously don't mean she would become the literal Lich King. But she is definitely going the way to do the same stuff he did, just that she doesn't really think of it like that herself and, with her methods, not quite as obvious.

[Hyral]

Well originally during the scourge civil war in Capital City, it wasn't just that Arthas was losing powers due to Illidan attacking the frozen and the undead revolted for freedom, just that he was losing power and the scourge he lost contro lof went on a frenzy and/or started following whoever was strong enough to get control of them.

If I remember correctly, the "forsaken have free will" meme started in WoW. Until that retcon they were just sylvanas' scourge, just like how the dreadlords have their own scourge and other powerful undead who could stay sane during that ordeal got their own minions too.

Now if the story had remained that way, and Sylvanas was still controlling her scourge, this piece of dialog wouldn't be confusing. But with the WoW retcons it doesn't make sense.

Just shitty lore, as is usual for Legion.

[Aquamonkey]

isn't slyvanas main job right now just trying to survive

I thought that was everyone's main job.

[ItachiZaku]

But can you really?

Is... is this why the alliance can't have nice things?

[Friendlyimmolation]

I thought that was everyone's main job.

only hers. Everyone else just kinda flops over.

[Mehrunes]

Is... is this why the alliance can't have nice things?

A rational person would say "yes", but the truth is beyond the realm of reason. And the truth is that Alliance can't have nice things because Blizzard wants them dead.

[Friendlyimmolation]

A rational person would say "yes", but the truth is beyond the realm of reason. And the truth is that Alliance can't have nice things because Blizzard wants them dead.

or to all roll humans. Which I guess could be a form of death based on your feelings towards them.

[Mehrunes]

I obviously don't mean she would become the literal Lich King. But she is definitely going the way to do the same stuff he did, just that she doesn't really think of it like that herself and, with her methods, not quite as obvious.

So Sylvanas, who doesn't want to scour all life is going to do the same stuff he did, which was attempting to scour all life, because...?

[Sigxy]

Well originally during the scourge civil war in Capital City, it wasn't just that Arthas was losing powers due to Illidan attacking the frozen and the undead revolted for freedom, just that he was losing power and the scourge he lost contro lof went on a frenzy and/or started following whoever was strong enough to get control of them.

If I remember correctly, the "forsaken have free will" meme started in WoW. Until that retcon they were just sylvanas' scourge, just like how the dreadlords have their own scourge and other powerful undead who could stay sane during that ordeal got their own minions too.

Now if the story had remained that way, and Sylvanas was still controlling her scourge, this piece of dialog wouldn't be confusing. But with the WoW retcons it doesn't make sense.

Just shitty lore, as is usual for Legion.

Only thing I can think of to justify the thing, is that some undead like ghouls and such were controlled and the Forsaken were the ones who gained free will and-- wait hang on where did all the non-WoW-Forsaken undead go? They kept banshees and Abominations but what happened to the rest?

So Sylvanas, who doesn't want to scour all life is going to do the same stuff he did, which was attempting to scour all life, because...?

She doesn't say she want to scour all life, no. But when she wants to find new ways to raise more forsaken, even wanting to capture a new source for her Val'kyr (one who wasn't even fighting against her, thus attacking those who wanted nothing bad towards the Forsaken, and making dodgy deals with a certain witch), just give it time and she'll be wanting more and more!

[Aquamonkey]

If I remember correctly, the "forsaken have free will" meme started in WoW. Until that retcon they were just sylvanas' scourge, just like how the dreadlords have their own scourge and other powerful undead who could stay sane during that ordeal got their own minions too.

Now if the story had remained that way, and Sylvanas was still controlling her scourge, this piece of dialog wouldn't be confusing. But with the WoW retcons it doesn't make sense.

Sylvanas and her undead had free will in WC3. The enslavement that happened was of the living though banshee possession.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Only thing I can think of to justify the thing, is that some undead like ghouls and such were controlled and the Forsaken were the ones who gained free will and-- wait hang on where did all the non-WoW-Forsaken undead go? They kept banshees and Abominations but what happened to the rest?

Ghouls are the final form of undead, mindless and hungry for flesh.

She doesn't say she want to scour all life, no. But when she wants to find new ways to raise more forsaken, even wanting to capture a new source for her Val'kyr (one who wasn't even fighting against her, thus attacking those who wanted nothing bad towards the Forsaken, and making dodgy deals with a certain witch), just give it time and she'll be wanting more and more!

going to have to see it to believe it, dealing Heyla is a far cry from wanting to scour the planet and rule over it.

[Sigxy]

Ghouls are the final form of undead, mindless and hungry for flesh.

going to have to see it to believe it, dealing Heyla is a far cry from wanting to scour the planet and rule over it.

Either that or the zombies. But otherwise, when it gets to those... erm... low-unlife beings...(?) then I presume someone had to be in control of them.

And yeah, understandable - it's just some opinion I have at the moment. I feel her actions are so far showing nothing but bad stuff, but I can't really go tell people what to believe when there's no proof about it.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Either that or the zombies. But otherwise, when it gets to those... erm... low-unlife beings...(?) then I presume someone had to be in control of them.

\

I mean literally the final form of a zombie is a ghoul, undeath mutates the zombie into a ghoul, or had the potential to.

Atleast that was the old lore.

[Sigxy]

\

I mean literally the final form of a zombie is a ghoul, undeath mutates the zombie into a ghoul, or had the potential to.

Atleast that was the old lore.

Huh, really? I though it was just more of a case of what kind of undead you were. Thought a Ghoul was one of the possible 'lowest form' since there are a few.

Good lord, if people thought evolution was hard, try toss in magic and undeath into the blender... x_x

[Friendlyimmolation]

Huh, really? I though it was just more of a case of what kind of undead you were. Thought a Ghoul was one of the possible 'lowest form' since there are a few.

Good lord, if people thought evolution was hard, try toss in magic and undeath into the blender... x_x

/wave hands in air

magic.

The wowpedia article on it no longer has a citation (swear it used too) So iit might no longer be "true undeath"

[Aquamonkey]

\

I mean literally the final form of a zombie is a ghoul, undeath mutates the zombie into a ghoul, or had the potential to.

Atleast that was the old lore.

I'm pretty sure that was in the RPG.

[Sigxy]

/wave hands in air

magic.

The wowpedia article on it no longer has a citation (swear it used too) So iit might no longer be "true undeath"

...Yeah I guess this isn't going to get us much further on this topic anyway. So. Can at least agree on this and move on:

/wave hands in air

MAGIC!

I'm pretty sure that was in the RPG.

And judging by your signature, I guess there's no answer to that anymore!

[Gelannerai]

I somewhat feel that the Andorhal quest chain was something the quest designer(s) put there because they thought it was cool, but then the lore devs saw it and had to play damage control with the "newly Undead frenzy" thing, since without that the militia being raised seemingly goes against the narrative of the "free-willed Forsaken." #Catathings

Personally I feel that the Mind-Slave girl in Undercity is a bit more egregious in this regard since she's a constant in Undercity.