New legendary ring (Soul of the Highlord)

[Talvindius]

I'd disagree with the first part only in the sense that since all of our damage comes during Crusade, a string of bad luck (no crits, having to run out, etc) means a bad parse. That, combined with our silly passive (99% parse anytime someone dies during Crusade), makes ret parsing feel like hoping everything goes right.

Either way, I've always enjoyed DP even if it is a bit RNG. I'm definitely looking forward to having that 5 back to back DP during Crusade come through.

Ret damage outside of crusade isn't that bad if you have cloak and enough haste to take advantage of it. I can average between 500 and 600k without using crusade at all.

I can understand the importance of crusade if youre running low haste build and ring/belt but even if I use wings suboptimally I can ususally get a decent parse regardless.

[Morally Grey Storm]

Ret damage outside of crusade isn't that bad

compared to..?

[Burgerberg]

Ret damage outside of crusade isn't that bad if you have cloak and enough haste to take advantage of it. I can average between 500 and 600k without using crusade at all.

How much haste is that?

Over 30%?

[PointerToAddress]

Solsacra already did what I wanted to do on sims (w/ an updated version of simcraft) and they seem to confirm what I was seeing. The ring is competitive but not necessarily BiS. Chain+Whispers is still BiS if you don't plan to use T19, and you only want to use T19 if your pieces are within 10-15 ilvls from your current difficulty. So if you have Mythic ToS you, having 915+ T19 pieces will be a DPS increase. If you do use T19 then BiS is Chain+Liadrin. In any case Highlord is close enough that you may use it in some situations.

Still emphasizing that everything is subject to change until ToS launch.

[Talvindius]

How much haste is that?

Over 30%?

25% with 4 pc is plenty. I had 30% at one point but it felt weaker and it was way too easy to cap HP.

[Burgerberg]

25% with 4 pc is plenty. I had 30% at one point but it felt weaker and it was way too easy to cap HP.

But what is really the difference between 25% and, say, 21%? If I'm not squeezing any more in after 21% then what's the point to get the extra?

There's a bit of confusion here on what haste value seems best. Some say it doesn't matter as long as you're not below 13% haste, some say ~19% is fine, some say 22-25%, a few say go higher, etc. It's all over the place.

[PointerToAddress]

But what is really the difference between 25% and, say, 21%? If I'm not squeezing any more in after 21% then what's the point to get the extra?

There's a bit of confusion here on what haste value seems best. Some say it doesn't matter as long as you're not below 13% haste, some say ~19% is fine, some say 22-25%, a few say go higher, etc. It's all over the place.

Honestly it's more about having the T19 4pc and how that generates HP and it's synergy with Whispers and Fires. When people say get to 20-22% it's more because you don't really need more since Fires and T194pc gives enough HP to maintain a high enough uptime of the Whisper buff. So, like you said, you have a higher chance to cap HP gains if you go higher. You can, but run the chance of capping.

Now with T20 you don't have the T194pc proc, so that means that to maintain the Whispers buff you need to go higher in haste. Unfortunately Fires doesn't seem to Sim as high as Zeal at high haste so that means you need to go even higher, say 30%, if you want to maintain the Whispers buff a bit easier. Again, you don't need to if you like how Fires work, but your DPS potential will be less.

It's all about the Whispers buff and how comfortable you are with the rotation to maintain that. On the other hand if you don't use Whispers then it's all about how you easily you react to the rotation. Low haste = fires, high haste = Zeal. But as far as sims go high haste seems to Sim higher.

[stolker]

But what is really the difference between 25% and, say, 21%? If I'm not squeezing any more in after 21% then what's the point to get the extra?

There's a bit of confusion here on what haste value seems best. Some say it doesn't matter as long as you're not below 13% haste, some say ~19% is fine, some say 22-25%, a few say go higher, etc. It's all over the place.

Tons of bullshit misinformation whenever this comes up, so here's the objective truth: With cloak, you NEED around 20% or it will be theoretically (and especially practically) impossible to get 3 GCDs into the cloak buff, which is important so you can 2x HP generator + hp Spender within the buff window. In practice you will probably need around 21-22% depending on your ping. At least to me with 20% haste it happens regularly that simple lag causes buff downtime because an ability JUST missed the buff window. With 22% it happens extremely infrequently so I stay around that value.

Also, any extra point in haste obviously reduces the cooldown of all your holy power generators, besides buffing your auto attack damage and reducing GCD in general. Doesn't sound like that much but if you have 'too much' of the other stats in relation to haste, haste can easily become your top stat priority for a while just because it gives a larger relative increase.

[Tangra]

Will this allow us to take dp twice? For double proc chance?

[Talvindius]

But what is really the difference between 25% and, say, 21%? If I'm not squeezing any more in after 21% then what's the point to get the extra?

There's a bit of confusion here on what haste value seems best. Some say it doesn't matter as long as you're not below 13% haste, some say ~19% is fine, some say 22-25%, a few say go higher, etc. It's all over the place.

I just tried some different values and im doing the best with around 25%. I also got outdpsed by another pally with cloak/belt and he said he liked 25% which is how I got around to trying it out.

[Reith]

Will this allow us to take dp twice? For double proc chance?

No. Thete's video demonstrated that once you equip it, it highlights that talent and doesn't allow you to pick it again. You have to pick either Crusade or the dead talent if you want a talent choice there.

[Deleted]

Well in a specc that the key factor in gameplay is to hit generators to build up resources and spend them during a buff window and all these are getting increased numbers if casted within a small amount of time (wings,whispers,shoulders,legionfall etcetcetcetc) then haste is always going to be a valid secondary.
But honestly never before had I simmed my toon so many times halfway in the expansion

[Easo]

Hmmm, Holy Shield for Protection... Well, as long as the fight has some magical damage, sure, why not, will be useful. Plus I really hate how rarely I need it, when it was one of the main protection abilities some time ago.
P.S.
Interesting name, though. It's not like it will contain our own soul...

[Easo]

You know you can pick Holy Shield as a talent for that exact scenario, right?

Not sure if I understand what you mean.

[Doctor Funkenstein]

I'm really confused by this ring.

As a Protection paladin, what exactly does it do? All I can figure is that it lets me change to Holy Shield without having to use a consumable or be in a rest area. How the fuck is that legendary?

[Reith]

I'm really confused by this ring.

As a Protection paladin, what exactly does it do? All I can figure is that it lets me change to Holy Shield without having to use a consumable or be in a rest area. How the fuck is that legendary?

You can choose another talent on the same row simultaneously.

[Lucetia]

I'm really confused by this ring.

As a Protection paladin, what exactly does it do? All I can figure is that it lets me change to Holy Shield without having to use a consumable or be in a rest area. How the fuck is that legendary?

Basically it let's you have that talent AND another talent on that same row. If you already chose Holy Shield then respec and choose a different talent and both will be active.

[Calimon-ZJ]

I'm really confused by this ring.

As a Protection paladin, what exactly does it do? All I can figure is that it lets me change to Holy Shield without having to use a consumable or be in a rest area. How the fuck is that legendary?

so much facepalm

When posting, please remember to remain respectful to other forum users, and to contribute to the topic of the thread. - Malthanis

[Doctor Funkenstein]

so much facepalm

You have me confused with someone who gives a fuck about an elitist asshole.

[Reith]

You have me confused with someone who gives a fuck about an elitist asshole.

Just ignore him. He's probably from the discord. No need for a fight here.