Fury Legion Discussion

[Kokkos]

Any bis list fir fury for tomb

Legendary Helm+Pants, the other 4 pieces of t20, as much haste and mastery as you can get on the remaining pieces.

[Prime92]

Sure, it could look like that if you're looking at it without understanding the meaning of opportunity costs. 3 seconds every ~1min30sec was times where 2-3 GCDs weren't be used.

But no, we've already made clear that we've had a 5% damage buff for a few patches already (7.1 I believe). That buff got increased to 10% which is a 5% increase therefor the patch notes state that we've received a 5% buff to all abilities (compared to last patch).

Considering opportunity cost and the fact that we're not just removing a second trinket altogether rather we're replacing DoS with another good trinket breaks us out about even single target (and possibly slightly ahead according to Archi). Makes our AoE 5% better at the same time. Really we're just spreading our 3sec burst across the rest of the 1min27sec period. That and Fury has always scaled well with higher gear levels so we've got that going for us as well.

According to Archi from a couple of days before it was supposed to be an over 3% nerf overall with 40% DoS nerf + 5% dmg aura buff. I think the only way we could put 3 GCDs in 3 sec window was if we had both BL and 30% additional haste buff and it's still dodgy cause of latency, even with some residual time on BC/enrage/FB. You're also missing the fact, that DoS is basically the only trinket with base haste that does not suck ballz and loosing over 1.2k flat haste hurts a lot. Atm I'm sitting at just over 30% haste. I'm wondering how would swapping my 910 DoS for 905 terrorbound nexus work out but I'm sceptical.

[Dark Succ]

Thank you Anuibus.

[Arbiter]

According to Archi from a couple of days before it was supposed to be an over 3% nerf overall with 40% DoS nerf + 5% dmg aura buff. I think the only way we could put 3 GCDs in 3 sec window was if we had both BL and 30% additional haste buff and it's still dodgy cause of latency, even with some residual time on BC/enrage/FB. You're also missing the fact, that DoS is basically the only trinket with base haste that does not suck ballz and loosing over 1.2k flat haste hurts a lot. Atm I'm sitting at just over 30% haste. I'm wondering how would swapping my 910 DoS for 905 terrorbound nexus work out but I'm sceptical.

You can most definitely fit 3 GCDs with lust during BC as it's well below the 1s mark for GCDs during that time, and with CoF you can typically fit 2 BCs in during a lust. You're also not accounting for the delay there often is using DoS after Rampage which is likely due to latency (not referring to the GCD of Rampage).

Regardless, DoS is not the only trinket with base haste that doesn't suck and either way it doesn't have to have base haste to even be good. It's not the only stat worth using and haste procs are also nice to have. Arcano has base haste...chaos talisman, haste stat sticks, and toe knees all have base haste stats. None are terrible either only outshined by how much better DoS was. Terrorbound...well yea it's not that great for Fury single target.

At the end of the day it's not really a nerf and it's probably not smart to use other people as an excuse to think something is a nerf especially after that person just posted this:

Actually it wasn't nerfed for all classes - just Warriors.

That said, anyone who thinks that the Draught nerf is a nerf for Fury is just plain wrong. If you're smart enough to change trinkets to just about any other trinket in the game which has an equivalent or greater ilvl, it's actually overall neutral or even a buff.

Stop looking for reasons to whine and use that time to just find a decent replacement trinket.

[Prime92]

@Up
Seriously? Arcanocrystal? Chaos Talisman? Are you high? None of those trinkets are even obtainable in any reasonable way. I know some lucky people get CT from a weekly chest and TF Arcano from relinquished lottery crap but let's be reasonable. It's gambling and not possible to farm(yeah, I know some would say you can fam relinqs but that's fucking disgusting and repelling). All I'm saying is that haste was in most cases our best stat all the way and it's only getting better with t19 going away, switching haste for any other stat is suboptimal not to mention the additional effect. Getting 910+ trinket is going to be easier when tomb M hits but untill then it's going to be virtually impossible (apart from ToS hc trinkets), we have to wait for new trinket sims anyway. Oh and switching 15+% of overall dps for a 2k+ str stat stick is definately going to cut it...right, definately competitive trinket.

[Stanislav]

@Up
Seriously? Arcanocrystal? Chaos Talisman? Are you high? None of those trinkets are even obtainable in any reasonable way. I know some lucky people get CT from a weekly chest and TF Arcano from relinquished lottery crap but let's be reasonable. It's gambling and not possible to farm(yeah, I know some would say you can fam relinqs but that's fucking disgusting and repelling). All I'm saying is that haste was in most cases our best stat all the way and it's only getting better with t19 going away, switching haste for any other stat is suboptimal not to mention the additional effect. Getting 910+ trinket is going to be easier when tomb M hits but untill then it's going to be virtually impossible (apart from ToS hc trinkets), we have to wait for new trinket sims anyway. Oh and switching 15+% of overall dps for a 2k+ str stat stick is definately going to cut it...right, definately competitive trinket.

would you rather farm guldan every week with all your coins in order to land the new 940 DOS?

fuck that trinket and good riddence, i rather do the same dmg but have it come from the class instead of the DOS trinket.

normal TOS drops 905+ you wont have a problem replacing DOS within a week or two max.

we are also one of the only classes that got buffs to all specs in this patch, everyone else is eating nerfs left right and center so we will be still top on progress because execute phase is king there.

[Arbiter]

@Up
Seriously? Arcanocrystal? Chaos Talisman? Are you high? None of those trinkets are even obtainable in any reasonable way. I know some lucky people get CT from a weekly chest and TF Arcano from relinquished lottery crap but let's be reasonable. It's gambling and not possible to farm(yeah, I know some would say you can fam relinqs but that's fucking disgusting and repelling). All I'm saying is that haste was in most cases our best stat all the way and it's only getting better with t19 going away, switching haste for any other stat is suboptimal not to mention the additional effect. Getting 910+ trinket is going to be easier when tomb M hits but untill then it's going to be virtually impossible (apart from ToS hc trinkets), we have to wait for new trinket sims anyway. Oh and switching 15+% of overall dps for a 2k+ str stat stick is definately going to cut it...right, definately competitive trinket.

Those aren't the only competitive trinkets. I only named you some of the better trinkets with haste base stats on them. There's plenty of trinkets better than DoS after this patch hits. If you don't have any of them? Well keep using DoS. You'll still get the 5% buff of damage and it'll still be hardly a noticeable nerf on single target while being a buff on AoE. I'd beg to differ on them being obtainable though. I don't even play very much compared to some of the player base and I still have one of every single trinket ranging from 880-905. To argue at least one of those being completely unobtainable is ridiculous.

There also have been trinkets sims done for Fury in it's current state on PTR. Archi posted them.

Lastly, you obviously don't understand opportunity costs either. DoS doesn't account for "15+%" of our damage. It only shows up that way on the meters because of...what do you know? opportunity cost. Why even bother expressing your opinion and whining about everything if you can't even seem to understand how it works? If we didn't have to avoid using abilities for 3 seconds for the trinket then that would be more abilities used for millions of damage. This is why putting on literally any decent trinket instead of DoS will result in roughly equivalent dps with the 5% buff we're getting. Some of you FOTM people who only played Fury because of DoS seem to not understand that once again DoS isn't the only trinket that's good for Fury. It was just outshining the rest and for that we got an overall buff which does plenty to make up for it.

[Coolwasabi]

With many of demon mobs in ToS would it be worth trying to get decent item levels of the ring and neck set from CoS/Arc for damage to demon proc?

[Bigbazz]

The loss of Draught of Souls isn't a big deal like some of you are making it, they made a mistake having an item that was so incredibly powerful and to allow it to go on for the rest of the expansion would have been a damn shame. TOS is a new leaf, be happy that you don't have to be chained down to a stupid trinket like that for another 6+ months, which is the situation the guys with the high ilvl DOS (like 920+) were absolutely going to be stuck in.

You should be focussing your frustrations on the real issue with Fury going forward, and that's the lacklustre T20 set bonuses.

[Teranzil]

The loss of Draught of Souls isn't a big deal like some of you are making it, they made a mistake having an item that was so incredibly powerful and to allow it to go on for the rest of the expansion would have been a damn shame. TOS is a new leaf, be happy that you don't have to be chained down to a stupid trinket like that for another 6+ months, which is the situation the guys with the high ilvl DOS (like 920+) were absolutely going to be stuck in.

You should be focussing your frustrations on the real issue with Fury going forward, and that's the lacklustre T20 set bonuses.

In terms of damage, the bonuses are actually decent, albeit the proc on the 2p could do with a change I think. BT crits aren't going to be as common without T19 2p. If by lacklustre you mean it isn't very interesting, then yes, I'd have to agree. The only real issue Fury will have in ToS will be the execute phase, granted it's helped by the Battlelord ring, but then you've got a legendary that's only useful for 1/5 of a fight. Juggernaught is the culprit as it has been since the start of the expansion. Takes too long to ramp up and deal meaningful damage, especially when compared to Arms' new execute.

[Bigbazz]

In terms of damage, the bonuses are actually decent, albeit the proc on the 2p could do with a change I think. BT crits aren't going to be as common without T19 2p. If by lacklustre you mean it isn't very interesting, then yes, I'd have to agree. The only real issue Fury will have in ToS will be the execute phase, granted it's helped by the Battlelord ring, but then you've got a legendary that's only useful for 1/5 of a fight. Juggernaught is the culprit as it has been since the start of the expansion. Takes too long to ramp up and deal meaningful damage, especially when compared to Arms' new execute.

Yeah on single target the bonus is decent enough, but it's not very flexible in terms of gameplay and doesn't do much positive for the spec or the prospect of playing it going forward. If you look at the Arms T20 you get a bonus that really opens up some interesting gameplay scenarios and options, very exciting by comparison.

The Fury T20 I found really makes the execute phase just ugly, even if the ring does provide a solution to that. At least for me I was left feeling a bit disappointed by it, the DOS change I think was ultimately a good decision.

[orgonutil]

The loss of Draught of Souls isn't a big deal like some of you are making it, they made a mistake having an item that was so incredibly powerful and to allow it to go on for the rest of the expansion would have been a damn shame. TOS is a new leaf, be happy that you don't have to be chained down to a stupid trinket like that for another 6+ months, which is the situation the guys with the high ilvl DOS (like 920+) were absolutely going to be stuck in.

You should be focussing your frustrations on the real issue with Fury going forward, and that's the lacklustre T20 set bonuses.

but COF still bis ....

[Bigbazz]

but COF still bis ....

There is BIS and there was DOS in Nighthold which completely obliterated every other trinket. DOS also scaled quite heavily with ilvl where as COF doesn't since the only benefit is extra strength, which is a weak stat to begin with. It's fine for a previous tier trinket to remain BIS, it has happened in many previous expansions and many classes face that current situation with a number of trinkets right now, but DOS was a fairly unique case.

Not only that but a lot of people were asking Blizzard to nerf DOS specifically, discussion about it here on the forums, discussion about it over on the official forums.. That DOS specifically should get nerfed was widely discussed, and considering Blizzard publicly stated they weren't going to do it (nerf previous content trinkets that is), they probably thought hard on the decision before choosing to nerf DOS.. It was a special case, and if you can set aside feeling shafted that your best item got trashcanned, it was the right thing to do for the game.

[Jastall]

but COF still bis ....

You don't need a high ilvl CoF for it to be useful, since the only benefit of a higher ilvl one is some extra STR which is nothing amazing. By contrast DoS gets much more powerful so farming for that sweet, sweet TF would have been essential. CoF will probably be outmuscled by other trinkets at some point.

[Bigcountry11782]

would you rather farm guldan every week with all your coins in order to land the new 940 DOS?

fuck that trinket and good riddence, i rather do the same dmg but have it come from the class instead of the DOS trinket.

normal TOS drops 905+ you wont have a problem replacing DOS within a week or two max.

we are also one of the only classes that got buffs to all specs in this patch, everyone else is eating nerfs left right and center so we will be still top on progress because execute phase is king there.

Arms is gonna be king of executes come tomb Feels good.Arms is gonna dominate again.

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You don't need a high ilvl CoF for it to be useful, since the only benefit of a higher ilvl one is some extra STR which is nothing amazing. By contrast DoS gets much more powerful so farming for that sweet, sweet TF would have been essential. CoF will probably be outmuscled by other trinkets at some point.

You realize DoS is getting a 40% nerf for warriors tomorrow ya?Its garbage now.

[bajcli]

Arms is gonna be king of executes come tomb Feels good.Arms is gonna dominate again.

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You realize DoS is getting a 40% nerf for warriors tomorrow ya?Its garbage now.

"would have been"

[Jastall]

Arms is gonna be king of executes come tomb Feels good.Arms is gonna dominate again.

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You realize DoS is getting a 40% nerf for warriors tomorrow ya?Its garbage now.

Keywords: ''would have been''.

[Leyre]

You guys think the helm/ayala/and the cloak will still be the best options in tomb?

[potis]

You guys think the helm/ayala/and the cloak will still be the best options in tomb?

Its like no one ever reads or checks stuff. Check the new guide.

1)Ayala is useless for awhile now, the heavy crit it provides makes it bad since it has a bad proc rate.

2)Cloak is useless for awhile now because wearing it makes you wear the useless chest set of T19, lose lots of stats, its not a DPS gain overall.

3)Its Helm+new pants or Helms+New ring, depends what you prefer and how bad your guild is, longer execute phases > Ring is better.

[Arbiter]

You guys think the helm/ayala/and the cloak will still be the best options in tomb?

The 7.2.5 guide is up. Answer is there.