FFXIV has over 6 million?

[Kakera]

I'm confused... is the main census website not common knowledge or something because this data is taken straight from lodestone (FFXIV version of armory). Or, is this discussion about something different? Either way...

https://ffxivcensus.com/

* (Any reference to "Active" players, refers to players who have claimed the 3.3 story minion)

^ This note here is extremely important when making claims about "active" players because for most new players completing all the Main Scenario Quests leading up to patch 3.3 (as it stands anyway without story jump being enabled yet) takes quite a lot of effort and it's understandable that numbers are low.

There are many many players that I know that legit only play for crafting and also just low level players that "play" but haven't finished MSQ so...

[Super Kami Dende]

Just like Justin Bieber

Just like Metallica

[lawow74]

Just like Justin Bieber

Justin Bieber is an MMO?

[tikcol]

justin bieber is an mmo?

yes, justin bieber is an mmo

[Echo of Soul]

Just like Justin Bieber

It's truly amazing how you can be so successful yet so incredibly awful, both as a person and as an artist.

[Wrecktangle]

I never said that is was perfect, there are a lot of things that annoy me. But overhauling the endgame isn't needed, it's a formula that works and that most players are happy with. QoL changes are needed though, a lot of them, for instance the glamour system could use a serious rework, inventory space is starting to run out.

"Not enough changes" isn't a good argument in my opinion. I don't think half of the game should be overhauled every expansion.

First off - thank you for responding. That is me being genuine.

I'm going to reference the origin of this topic to refresh both our minds because the goal post has moved quite considerably since then:

It looks like SB will have more changes thank goodness, but they don't need to do more because it's a later expansion, they need to do more because the previous didn't add/change enough. Again, this is all IMO and as always I welcome any discussion or analysis otherwise.

If you look at ARR it was good, even great, but it had its issues too. People were very excited to see where the game was going to go. The problem with HW is that the game didn't go anywhere. We got new story (which was excellent), but very little new content, almost every piece of content was just a coat of paint haphazardly thrown on an old wall. People noticed. Not just me, not just the "vocal minority", but people.

If SB ends up doing the exact same thing I expect the community wouldn't take kindly too it. Fortunately it appears that Yoshi listens and agrees that it was getting a little stale so he's shaking up the end game paradigm. We'll have to wait and see if its enough.

Now in regards to your actual response above:

Agreed some major QoL stuff needs to be tightened up. I greatly appreciate your specific examples and I think the large majority of the community agree they're sore spots.

We don't need half the game overhauled every expansion, I agree, but we definitely need overhauls as time goes on. You have boring uninteresting gear. Boring uninteresting Materia. Side content dead on arrival. Dungeons/EX Trials dead on arrival, etc. It's clear that changes are needed to better balance the content streams and some changes would be welcomed to spice up gameplay.

Most people got sick of it on HW launch because half the time it would pop Neverreap which led to the "Alwaysreap" thing.

Worst part of ARR is Amdapor Keep was the only worthwhile of the two. Wanderers Palace just took forever.

One thing that people don't realize is that the law of RNG isn't kind over a short term. I once had a time where I got Neverreap 8 times in a row. Sure over time it averages out, but I got burned out long before the average ever came...

I love Japanese companies, when they fail, they apologize, and now their honour is at stake, their corporate mentality is to do their utmost best to get it right.

This is what they did with FFXIV on the reboot, and they went through everything and went above. Shows you when you do a job thoroughly well, when you put full effort into the game, people will play. And they will stay.

They give you depth in every department, they are thorough, and they iterate enough to make sure they deliver. Now blizzard did a little of this for Legion.. look how many people started playing again...although the quality in the patches dipped and they are not as expansive, I think they can take lessons from FFXIV.

While it's true I love their humility too, it gets a little grating when they're ALWAYS apologizing. It's endearing once, maybe twice/thrice. After that it's incompetence/ignorance.

I think WoW is already taking lessons from FF14. They've pushed patches this expansion much more quickly than ever before in what I can only assume was in response to FF14's success.

Absolutely. It's not limited to those two games, though. FF14 would benefit immensely from a transmog/wardrobe system akin to WoW/D3 (I include D3 because I've seen that iteration of the wardrobe system), but both would benefit greatly from Guild Wars 2's dye system. Of course, that latter bit would be an absolute pipe dream of mine for both games, so at the very least, import WoW/D3 wardrobe system into FF14.

Now what I want is FF14 to take lessons from WoW and make relic weapons even half as cool as the artifact weapons we had. Unlocking appearances and colors from all different types of content was incredibly fun and rewarding. IMO of course.

I once posited that the Legion Legendary system should have been like the D3 cube. You can put them in there and gain the effects and put the effects on other pieces of gear. I wish FF14 had a system like this too to make gear a little more interesting.

It's truly amazing how you can be so successful yet so incredibly awful, both as a person and as an artist.

LOL. It's almost as if I said that myself.

[Kazgrel]

Zurvan was in a weird spot for a raid, as it was outdated content the minute it was released. I believe they intended it as a raid to give the people who weren't actually raiding Alexander something to do and the ability to somewhat catch up. Not that I necessarily agree with it. But if you were to make it harder, you'd need to add commensurate reward, and they were a bit stuck of what they could actually add that didn't trump A12S, and accessories were already slated to go to proto-Ultima.

Zurvan would have been a much more balanced fight had it been released at 3.4 instead of Sophia.

Outdated for anyone who hadn't cleared/farmed Savage Creator, definitely; the weapons still have value for folks who didn't do anima weapons or bother getting shire weapons (I need to get 1 more kill so I can buy at least one Zurv weapon with tokens so I can get the totems out of my inventory).

Not sure which I'd call easier between Zurvan and Sophia; gonna go with the latter since if you fell or were knocked off the platform, you could still be raised...that alone made the fight pretty faceroll.

- - - Updated - - -

Now what I want is FF14 to take lessons from WoW and make relic weapons even half as cool as the artifact weapons we had. Unlocking appearances and colors from all different types of content was incredibly fun and rewarding. IMO of course.

I once posited that the Legion Legendary system should have been like the D3 cube. You can put them in there and gain the effects and put the effects on other pieces of gear. I wish FF14 had a system like this too to make gear a little more interesting.

If they offered alternate colors/patterns or even some different variants of the weapon models along the way, I'd be all for that with the relic weapons. The ilvl 270 and 275 versions of the anima serve as an example of how that could be handled (since for the most part, the 275s are simply a different color of the 270s).

I'm skeptical of how the Horadrim cube would work in FF14 since 1. There's virtually no proc-like effects on any items (that I can think of) and 2. it would likely boil down to an "illusion of choice" matter, where it's all about selecting which item property gives you the best value.

[Typhoria]

With the current state of MMORPGS, none that are subscription based will ever sustain over 5M active again. If something incredibly innovative happens, this could change.We see peaks at the start of WoW expansions, but they quickly die off. The reasoning is people who played in the past (which is a huge number overall) just want to see what everything is about and lose interest afterward. FFXIV never had that large player base to begin with to cause such dynamic subscription swings, but I'm sure there will be quite a large subscription report shortly after Stormblood's release due to the same reason of past players wanting to see how the game changed.

[The Casualty]

Not sure which I'd call easier between Zurvan and Sophia; gonna go with the latter since if you fell or were knocked off the platform, you could still be raised...that alone made the fight pretty faceroll.

Oh I mean Zurvan - current stats - released at 3.4. Skipping Soar would have been less of a thing as people would have been many ilevels lower. I don't think the fight itself had a bad design, it's just his damage and HP at time of release was far undertuned for what people were able to do.

[Deleted]

Boy what a healthy thread this has evolved into. :kappakeepo:

[Deleted]

then whys another mmo out there on the market doing more than the guys with the most? Quality over quantity man. like congrats on having a playerbase so fucked up on your kool aid that they dont realize how lazy you are. thats pretty impressive technique no matter how shit your game is. but wow has been out for, what, 13 years now?

FFXIV has been out for almost 3 and it's already a much better game. I feel like FFXIV could be the future of this genre, but honestly I don't think Yoshida is that ambitious. I think he is pretty pleased with where things are at the moment considering his reaction to the overwhelmingly large and unexpected interest in the game at launch.

Dude. You played WoW -apparently- for 10 years. What do you expect? That it'll feel fresh?

As if you'll be playing FFXIV in 10 years.

[Kazgrel]

Oh I mean Zurvan - current stats - released at 3.4. Skipping Soar would have been less of a thing as people would have been many ilevels lower. I don't think the fight itself had a bad design, it's just his damage and HP at time of release was far undertuned for what people were able to do.

Ooo, good point; didn't process it that way. Zurv at ilvl 240-250 would've been a lot more interesting (because skipping Soar would've bordered on impossible, I would dare say, considering ilvl 235-245 weapons at best when 3.4 hit).

[Deleted]

Dude. You played WoW -apparently- for 10 years. What do you expect? That it'll feel fresh?

As if you'll be playing FFXIV in 10 years.

Who knows mate. I was a hardcore raider in WoW for 2/3s of wotlk celestial defender and all. Stopped half way into ICC cause of mixture of boredom and RL stuff.
FFXIV has been the first time I have EVER been subbed to an mmo for a concurrent 2.5 years without a break in between. It just did the things I wanted right. Not revolutionary by any means but to me it is THE ideal MMORPG for a player that wants to do both serious stuff and fun casual things.
Regarding the thing I was saying before though that is my opinion and people are free to like w/e they want. Why did we turn this into a game vs game thread?

[Kazgrel]

Who knows mate. I was a hardcore raider in WoW for 2/3s of wotlk celestial defender and all. Stopped half way into ICC cause of mixture of boredom and RL stuff.
FFXIV has been the first time I have EVER been subbed to an mmo for a concurrent 2.5 years without a break in between. It just did the things I wanted right. Not revolutionary by any means but to me it is THE ideal MMORPG for a player that wants to do both serious stuff and fun casual things.
Regarding the thing I was saying before though that is my opinion and people are free to like w/e they want. Why did we turn this into a game vs game thread?

It stems from the OP having posted this thread originally on the WoW general discussion subforum here. I believe that copy of the thread was deleted, so they posted it here, and any time someone starts spouting off sub numbers (official or not), it's gonna turn into a game vs. game dick swinging contest.

I won't dismiss sub numbers (official or not) entirely, but I don't use them as a measuring stick against other games; I simply use them as a tool to determine whether or not a game is growing. if I see a sudden drop in the number, it makes me wonder what might've happened. Same goes for any spikes in sub numbers.

[Interim]

Yeah thats how the japanese gaming media sells things that in the west we call "lifetime players". Thats not the same as active players. Its not in a slump or a user decline so servers are packed and thats good enough, i'd rather not see it become the next mainstream casual infested shithole

Too late. Your familiar with the entire game design yes? Not sure a more casual approach exists. Exclamation points n all. Good game but waiting for pantheon for an experience/hobby not a "game"

[Gandrake]

So based on your post am I safe to assume you believe that doing the relic weapon for 1 job should entitle you to it across all jobs in FF14? It's an interesting thought. On one hand I don't like it, but on the other it'd benefit me enormously as a player who can barely stomach grinding one.

if players required it to step into a large amount of content, then yes. that was the whole thing about the rings and cloaks. i have so many better things to do with my time than complete quests i have already completed and grinding out what is essentially a participation trophy that was implemented for baduals so they could feel special.

Relics, however, like I have said - are very different. They are completely optional. You don't need one for anything. The reward is the fact that you have done it.

I am sure Legion has also changed the game a little bit too, but I was turned off it when I realized I was basically going to spend my free time powering up a weapon. It's just so much better to log into the game, play it with your friends, get a good weapon and be raiding in core raid a few weeks later.

I literally have no idea what the heck you are talking about here. I asked you to cite specific examples, not incoherently ramble on about swinging axes, jumping like super mario and wearing loincloths.

if you're restricted to plate gear, you may not be able to wear these unique sets you may have come across. you might have come across something in wow that would have made a good link tmog and you can't use it... because it's not plate and the people with cow men in their game don't want you getting too silly even though link has been kicking ass in a dress and tights since 1987.

You completely dismissed my entire analysis. You said you don't get any unique raid content in WoW when compared to FF14, but I very clearly showed you were incorrect.

world of warcraft has 4 levels of difficulty for every raid meanwhile FFXIV gets 4 actual raids. Pretty simple.

I specifically asked if you prefer running the same 2 dungeons over and over for 3.5-4 months versus having a pool of 10+ dungeons to run at any given time that offer both meaningful rewards and challenges?

it's all the same really when you are running for tomes/badges/what have you

[Wrecktangle]

if you're restricted to plate gear, you may not be able to wear these unique sets you may have come across. you might have come across something in wow that would have made a good link tmog and you can't use it... because it's not plate and the people with cow men in their game don't want you getting too silly even though link has been kicking ass in a dress and tights since 1987.

If you're a PLD you can't wear WHM gear so how is that any different than Plate users not being able to wear non-plate? It's the exact same.

Link wears a tunic not a dress.

world of warcraft has 4 levels of difficulty for every raid meanwhile FFXIV gets 4 actual raids. Pretty simple.

What are you talking about? Do you post under the influence of hard drugs or something? WoW put out 4 UNIQUE RAIDS in 1 year. HW put out 4 UNIQUE RAIDS in 2 years. That's me being generous. I don't consider 24m content actual raiding content.

Don't let you hatred or bias drive your posting. Use logic and think about what you are saying and what other people are saying back.

it's all the same really when you are running for tomes/badges/what have you

???? Except it's not? Running the same dungeon over and over is not the same as running 10 different dungeons over and over.

I don't think you will find a SINGLE person on this forum who would agree with that stance.

[Gandrake]

If you're a PLD you can't wear WHM gear so how is that any different than Plate users not being able to wear non-plate? It's the exact same.

except that a lot of gear in FFXIV is for All Classes, Disciples of War or Disciples of Magic.... some are only for physical ranged dps, some are for caster dps, some are for healers etc. very few sets of equipment are class specific and basically ever piece of high quality gear (in terms of textures) you'd want to wear in wow is a class restricted item.

What are you talking about? Do you post under the influence of hard drugs or something?

i doubt you know much about "hard drugs" lol

but uhhhh i see 3 raids on my character page. 3 bosses in trival of valor? That's a raid? we also get primal fights which are honestly like a little mini raid when you throw them all together.

Link wears a tunic not a dress.

https://images.fun.com/products/3371...ank-dress3.jpg

[Faroth]

I don't consider 24m content actual raiding content.

Don't let you hatred or bias drive your posting. Use logic and think about what you are saying and what other people are saying back.

Hilariously ironic.

You've become a stereotypical "only mythic raiding is real content" poster at this point, my man.

[Banard]

The one I watched had this

"With over six million adventurers worldwide, there is no better time to join the resistance than now!"

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I don't know, could be could be not... I certainly see enough people in game on various servers to believe 6 million

pretty sure that number includes people like me...those that were down no wow at the time and bout the collectors edition, played for a few days and realised it was a poor substitute for a good game.