Resto in 7.2.5

[Purpleisbetter]

No dude, you're out of your mind.

You can't call anyone troll when you just wrote that shit about lege shoulders. You just can't.

[agittunc]

hello, i am not the most experienced resto druid. but i see this doom and gloom comments here and i wanna ask a few questions.

right now, resto druids have been amazing in 7.2. why is a few nerfs on resto so "drastic?" in t20p4 we get atleast 50+% uptime on a 200% eff buff which is already quite strong. when ur putting that in a melee group your gonna some crazy eff heals esp when it crits (already got like 240k eff crits and even more)

t19p2 is the only bonus that was really powerfull across the board. i top healing in most cases without any resto legendary. while all others have like the best legendaries. so how are people suggesting resto druids are not going to be top healers anymore?

t19p4 was really good with the shoulders. but do you REALLY need it? i never had the shoulders but i still top healing. doing 600k+ hps on 890 in so many occasions while i see 905 shamans and paladins do less. of course they might suck but i don't believe 2 small nerfs to our total healing output (4% less healing across the board) and a 16% cultivation nerf which is absolutely nothing. considering it stacks with mastery that "nerf" wont really show itself that much.

still don't see how rdruids are getting substantially weaker. esp when u get around 30% crit with 25% haste in raids your doing some serious raid healing. and thats what druid is designed for isn't it?

[Deleted]

idk the rdruid mastery would suggest theyre not designed for that but they get to do it anyway ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Low Hanging Fruit]

Druids will always be the around the best healers if encounters are deigned around constant raid damage all over the place which to tell you the truth Blizzard doesn't have much of a choice but to do. I mean could you image a fight with only tanks and small groups taking damage and no one else? Or fights that let people just stand still and never move period? These things are just apart of raiding now. Because of this druids will always be solid. They are just being brought down a little and others brought up because the gap was pretty big. Then also making it less about just spam away in all and any direction and doing some thinking while healing. This isn't a bad thing. Or else you get yourself into another disc priest situation where its just about blanket coverage and making other healers less important in the big picture.

[RestoSpirit]

hello, i am not the most experienced resto druid. but i see this doom and gloom comments here and i wanna ask a few questions.

right now, resto druids have been amazing in 7.2. why is a few nerfs on resto so "drastic?" in t20p4 we get atleast 50+% uptime on a 200% eff buff which is already quite strong. when ur putting that in a melee group your gonna some crazy eff heals esp when it crits (already got like 240k eff crits and even more)

t19p2 is the only bonus that was really powerfull across the board. i top healing in most cases without any resto legendary. while all others have like the best legendaries. so how are people suggesting resto druids are not going to be top healers anymore?

t19-4p was really good with the shoulders. but do you REALLY need it? i never had the shoulders but i still top healing. doing 600k+ hps on 890 in so many occasions while i see 905 shamans and paladins do less. of course they might suck but i don't believe 2 small nerfs to our total healing output (4% less healing across the board) and a 16% cultivation nerf which is absolutely nothing. considering it stacks with mastery that "nerf" wont really show itself that much.

still don't see how rdruids are getting substantially weaker. esp when u get around 30% crit with 25% haste in raids your doing some serious raid healing. and thats what druid is designed for isn't it?

Hey,

about the t20-4p: Someone else has done the complete math here, but I believe it's about 3-4% throughputgain. Not sure how you messure your 50% uptime but that would be in like optimal scenarios, remember efflo is 30sec and the new 4p is 10sec so you will get more like 35-40% average uptime.

While druids with t19+shoulders where insane, especially on high damage mythic encounters, the gap wasn't THAT big, it's like 10% which seems much, but considering the 4% total nerf, a 40% nerf to shoulders and not having the t19-4p we will (or atleast I will according to the legendary-analyser) lose about 26% throughput. Very skilled hpriests can already come very close, and some healers will recieve very strong buffs (~8-12% in some cases). So when we will lose 26% and everyone else gains ~10% thats a difference of 36%, which will put us second to last or even last in the healing hierarchy.

Blizzard just massively failed here, instead of nerfing the t19 set like they did with most classes they nerfed the legendary. Should have just removed the t19 4p entirely which would make us lose ~10% and would put shoulders (which had INSANE synergy with t19-4p) at around 7-8% which is fine for a "best in slot"-legendary.

Now what will happen is, we will all get very high rolled t19 and will keep the t19-4p which is probably still good considering the damage pattern of ToS. Blizzard will see that the nerfs did not achieve what they wanted and will remove t19 without compensating it. That will as said before put us last on healing. RIP druid. What you see is the result of devs not playing the game enough and them relying to much on their spreadsheets which won't reflect the true interactions ingame.

Some of the things I said may not be true for everyone here, since the actual throughput depends heavily on your raidsetup, the encounter-length and your general gear-setup. What I pointed out are mostly either best-case or worst-case scenarios, there is a lot in between which would take to much time to write out and please keep in mind this is not about healer balancing as a whole. Yeah blizzard fucked up priest and monks, but that's no reason to do the same with our class.

Cheers
RestoSpirit

[EliWallach]

Been through this so many times. GC used to drive me absolutely insane but we always ended up just fine. Mobility is such a huge advantage that as long as we're in the pack hps wise, it always works out. Example - phase 2 mythic Gul'dan with 2 rogues running around with 9 stacks each. T20 bonuses plus new ring combined with Flourish and G'Hanir will give us some pretty decent grouped burst, something we've missed since the demise of shroom bloom. So we should do well, perhaps not quite as well but good enough. The only complaint I have is mana. Why they nail us on that is a mystery to me. Perhaps because we have insta-casts but still, lower our OP hps - fine, but that also lowers our hpm so reduce costs to compensate.

[axxey]

While druids with t19+shoulders where insane, especially on high damage mythic encounters, the gap wasn't THAT big, it's like 10% which seems much, but considering the 4% total nerf, a 40% nerf to shoulders and not having the t19-4p we will (or atleast I will according to the legendary-analyser) lose about 26% throughput. Very skilled hpriests can already come very close, and some healers will recieve very strong buffs (~8-12% in some cases). So when we will lose 26% and everyone else gains ~10% thats a difference of 36%, which will put us second to last or even last in the healing hierarchy.

Blizzard just massively failed here, instead of nerfing the t19 set like they did with most classes they nerfed the legendary. Should have just removed the t19 4p entirely which would make us lose ~10% and would put shoulders (which had INSANE synergy with t19-4p) at around 7-8% which is fine for a "best in slot"-legendary.

Cheers
RestoSpirit

The synergi isn't just them though, it's overboard because of shoulders, germination, 4pc, flourish, deep rooted refreshes and dreamwalker. Shoulders facilitate maximizing uptime to be able to abuse the synergi strengths.

They should have just changed shoulders to wild growth instead of rejuv.

[Doogler]

Need to get a legendary rant off my chest. I currently have 8 legos, all from resto spec. The two I wanted to start off 7.2.5 with were the trinket and prydaz. Guess which two are the only ones I do not have? I have been running almost everything the last couple and no luck. I just know I am going to log in later today and open my cache and I will get the new helm.

I currently use the shoulders and ring. I am leaning towards sticking with the shoulders while I still have the t19 4-piece. Do you think this is the best choice? If not would be the best option? I generally don't have to worry about focusing on the tanks so I do not feel I really need the belt, though that is certainly one I will keep in mind as we head into ToS. This also rules out the wrists and of course gloves. Ekowraith is pretty meh and takes a tier slot. I do not want to have anything to do with sephuz. I will definitely keep using the ring for now and if I am going to change out the shoulders it seems my only options are the belt or boots. So come to think of it I will probably just use the belt.

[theburned]

Need to get a legendary rant off my chest. I currently have 8 legos, all from resto spec. The two I wanted to start off 7.2.5 with were the trinket and prydaz. Guess which two are the only ones I do not have? I have been running almost everything the last couple and no luck. I just know I am going to log in later today and open my cache and I will get the new helm.

I currently use the shoulders and ring. I am leaning thinking about sticking with the shoulders while I still have the t19 4-piece. Do you think this is the best choice? If not would be the best option? I generally don't have to worry about focusing on the tanks so I do not feel I really need the belt, though that is certainly one I will keep in mind as we head into ToS. This also rules out the wrists and of course gloves. Ekowraith is pretty meh and takes a tier slot. I do not want to have anything to do with sephuz. I will definitely keep using the ring for now and if I am going to change out the shoulders it seems my only options are the belt or boots. So come to think of it I will probably just use the belt.

Shoulders so far have been the best performing legendary for me on ptr, that is ofc still with t19 4p, I expect this to change once I am able to get Mythic t20 4p.
Below that I just dont think its worth using t20 over t19 anyway.

[kooz]

looks like it makes sense to get as high ilv t19 tier pieces as possible and keep using it with shoulders until 4pc t20 and/or possibly new lego ring drop.

[Glorious Leader]

Been through this so many times. GC used to drive me absolutely insane but we always ended up just fine. Mobility is such a huge advantage that as long as we're in the pack hps wise, it always works out. Example - phase 2 mythic Gul'dan with 2 rogues running around with 9 stacks each. T20 bonuses plus new ring combined with Flourish and G'Hanir will give us some pretty decent grouped burst, something we've missed since the demise of shroom bloom. So we should do well, perhaps not quite as well but good enough. The only complaint I have is mana. Why they nail us on that is a mystery to me. Perhaps because we have insta-casts but still, lower our OP hps - fine, but that also lowers our hpm so reduce costs to compensate.

Mobility is nice. It is not by any means an overwhelming advantage. Nor do we posess a monpoly on it. T20 is kinda shit especially relative to t19 but even just in general. The two bonuses have awful synergy. Want to maintain the buff to efflo but no low hp targets? Too bad.

The nerfs were overboard on every level.

[Tiberria]

Now that we have actual numbers from live, I don't think it paints all that great of a picture.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...unt&dataset=95

We are currently #4 out of 6 healers, are behind all of the other "throughput" healers, and the only two healers with lower numbers are locked into virtually guaranteed raid spots because of a unique toolkit. This also doesn't fully reflect the amount of hit we will be taking going into ToS, because when you swap out T19 for T20, there's a much steeper overall drop off than I think any other healer will see (it could be upwards of 5%). Plus, a lot of logs are suggesting shoulders are still 2-3% ahead of other legendaries, and that goes away with the tier swap as well. We probably lose 5-8% raw strength from these numbers in T20 gear, which suggests the spec is pretty much utter trash can, especially given how dependent it is on delivering top of the line throughput for its value.

[theburned]

Now that we have actual numbers from live, I don't think it paints all that great of a picture.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...unt&dataset=95

We are currently #4 out of 6 healers, are behind all of the other "throughput" healers, and the only two healers with lower numbers are locked into virtually guaranteed raid spots because of a unique toolkit. This also doesn't fully reflect the amount of hit we will be taking going into ToS, because when you swap out T19 for T20, there's a much steeper overall drop off than I think any other healer will see (it could be upwards of 5%). Plus, a lot of logs are suggesting shoulders are still 2-3% ahead of other legendaries, and that goes away with the tier swap as well. We probably lose 5-8% raw strength from these numbers in T20 gear, which suggests the spec is pretty much utter trash can, especially given how dependent it is on delivering top of the line throughput for its value.

Paladins bottom, nice meme.

[Deleted]

paladin t20 and mw scaling are pretty terrible btw so relax

[masterhorus8]

Plus, this is farm. Nothing is really letting Deep Rooted or Cultivation do any work yet. Actual numbers will show on the first few weeks of ToS.

[StaeleAilar]

Well i guess, after reading all of this (i am by no means a theorycrafter haha).. i've been debating going back to my on/off main for a few xpacs now - my priest - for ToS, intending to raid as holy... should i pursue a spot on a team that wants a hpriest? They seem to be hard to find, lots wanting resto druids, but if what im reading is the case, i doubt many of them have actually seen all of the changes and what is coming in terms of performance of resto druids.

[theburned]

Well i guess, after reading all of this (i am by no means a theorycrafter haha).. i've been debating going back to my on/off main for a few xpacs now - my priest - for ToS, intending to raid as holy... should i pursue a spot on a team that wants a hpriest? They seem to be hard to find, lots wanting resto druids, but if what im reading is the case, i doubt many of them have actually seen all of the changes and what is coming in terms of performance of resto druids.

A lot of people will just adapt what top guilds will do, and I dont see any top guilds dropping any druids as they have performed very well even after all the nerfs. But feel free to reroll back to priest.

[Shaker]

Its just months old farm now, and also with our current 4pc - not sure how many times people have to repeat it.

Holy priest is most certainly going to blow away resto druid in raw HPS come T20. They still have the absolute strongest legendary in the game too

[Purpleisbetter]

A lot of people will just adapt what top guilds will do, and I dont see any top guilds dropping any druids as they have performed very well even after all the nerfs. But feel free to reroll back to priest.

But if he's willing to go for a holy priest with all the consequences, then he's going for a net gain.

Besides, you shouldn't be surprised if top guilds might go with the occasional 0 r.druid here and there. The loss of output is noticeably now with shoulders and T19, it can only get worse.

I personally would reroll, but with a very demanding job and general laziness, i just switched main spec. I doubt Blizz is not aware how compromised resto druid is.

I just feel sorry my guild lost half of the healing team. Me and a guild mate dropped the spec for the time being.We also got the inspiration from the butthurts in guild that kept complaining, then rejoicing for our nerfs. Salty move but serves them right. Now endure the fucking pain whiny son of bitches. We don't heal, the guild wont raid.

[Deleted]

resto druids