Pitbulls are Violent Dogs

[Calfredd]

Ah yes, the return of the legendary pitbull thread that repeats itself every few months and everybody has the same discussion as the last thread.

Next time on Nanook12 Makes a Thread: Rich People, Should They All Just Be Gunned Down in the Street?.

[lockedout]

the problem with blues (and reds) is that people buy and sell based purely on "rare" (it's actually very common) colors with zero thought to temper or soundness of dog. So you end up with a poorly socialized dog that's in pain basically from birth that also may or may not have a low tolerance for bullshit, a fight response to fear coupled with anxiety, or various other tempers that don't do well with idiots that buy them knowing nothing of dogs.

Blues are show dogs, you'd never throw a blue in the pit. Not to say they can't be aggressive.

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Next time on Nanook12 Makes a Thread: Rich People, Should They All Just Be Gunned Down in the Street?.

Do we get to keep their $?

[CptEgo]

I believe it, but I also believe that when raised properly, they can also be the most gentle.

Any normal dog is 'gentle', it's not like animals can be assholes is it?

[Evangeliste]

I'd like to point out these statistics are the ones 'reported' and known. There have been other attacks that won't exactly reach the same ring-fencing as this particular statistic and sorry but that goes for any set of statistics - almost every documented agenda like this will simply not include every detail, section and so on.

We don't see mass amounts of tiger attacks either but recently here in the UK a zookeeper was mauled to death by one, it's not the first nor will it be the last in the world but that doesn't mean nowhere else hasn't had a same brush of fate, an attack even could be when the person survives but is injured and not national news or even correlated properly into a standardised, recognised set of results. They are so dangerous why are we keeping them in zoo's then? Same attitude can apply to all things.

I agree that perhaps there should be a license and such but honestly, the reason why they don't is simply because statistically they don't actually have mass amounts of attacks to warrant things. The control on it too would also be insane and most likely unable to do so. Whose going to regulate it and check on people?

[Vanyali]

Blues are show dogs, you'd never throw a blue in the pit. Not to say they can't be aggressive.

Blues aren't a special type of pitbull, and APBT aren't "show dogs" so much as game / working dogs. The show line isn't all that distinct, and doesn't care much about red or blue. Game dogs care even less about color, given that they're for working purposes and not a conformation contest.

You're probably thinking of American Bullies, which are explicitly not APBT, aren't really a breed, and are the epitome of "pitbull"... and color still matters fuckall for them being show or not.

[Demsi]

They're a breed of peace

[Mihalik]

The issue is still not with the dog, but with the owners. Pit bulls unfortunately appeal to a certain kind of person who either has no idea how to fucking raise and handle a dog or who intentionally wants a vicious "badass" dog. If we ban Pit bull ownership, you know what will happen?

They'll jump on another breed like a Rottweiler or German Shepard and do the same fucking thing all over again with those breeds. End result? Same fucking thing.

[Dug]

Next time on Nanook12 Makes a Thread: Rich People, Should They All Just Be Gunned Down in the Street?.

And the next: Why don't women go after intellectuals (like myself)?

[undeadmoon]

I'm of two minds, Pit Bulls when well cared for and trained are good, caring and great dogs, some of the sweetest dogs I've met were Pits...However, I don't think that most people are willing or are capable of giving the attention that they need when they are young, at least this is something you see often in my area, and due to their natures of being people pleasers, they are easily made to fight or if neglected, easily become too territorial.

Actually I could say that for all of the mastiff, bully, and well, all terrier breeds, as people don't understand that dogs need training, socialization and then some sort of routine.

Having worked at a shelter as a volunteer for 5 years in my late 20's, I can tell you that I was rarely scared of the pit bulls and mastiffs they brought in even most of the street or fight dogs, but I was more worried about the smaller terrier and toy breeds, as I've seen them fuck up peoples arms, hands and fingers, including one veterinary surgeon who lost the ability to control her thumb and forefinger due to a Pomeranian mauling of all things, and vet. tech who lost fingers after a small poodle tore up his hand. Smaller dog bites were a daily thing, and ER trips for them were probably once every 3 weeks so...Cat maulings were way more often, but that's another story.

Larger dog bites are more devastating on average, therefore are more likely to get reported; plus, in some cities/counties/states they have mandatory reporting for large dog bites or attacks, smaller dogs bite/attack more often, are often more aggressive and harder to socialize/train due to inbreeding/puppy milling, add into that most people don't report their bites unless they require surgery or cause function loss/loss of body part, and numbers start to get skewered.

I mean don't get me wrong, I grew up in a place where dog fighting was a huge underground thing, and seeing a Pit bull, mutt, or rottweiler on the street was a cause for alarm because we had dog attacks from fight dogs that got out or were orphaned on almost weekly basis, so I can understand the fear some people have about pits or even all large dogs, but I have a hard time condemning an animal for the faults of the people who raised it or a breed because of the people who bred it or bred in certain characteristics. But here again I'm contradicting myself because even when I worked in the shelter, while I felt sad briefly for the animal, I had no qualms when they put down aggressive dogs of any breed, or aggressive cats, for that matter.

If anything, we should be trying to re-breed back in some of the British bull terrier blood and some of the original American pit bulls who exist, they are both far less likely to have aggressive tendencies, less strong jaws, less muscle mass, and have less hip and heart problems, but neither of those are considered quite as "attractive" so it would be a hard sell.

I don't think banning the breed outright is the solution so much as public education, eradication of dog fighting as pastime, and rebreeding in certain traits would alleviate most if not all of the problems with Pit bulls, the problem is getting that ball rolling.

Edit: I just wanted to add in that I agree with those saying that the kind of shitty people who are helping to cause the problems with Pit Bulls would just move onto another breed and ruin it if Pit Bulls are full on banned. Education and social pushes to stop that shit along with responsible breeding are the way to go.

[Altrec]

Well, you can't say "my pitbull is sweet, so there's no way this is true". There's a problem with the breed. If there wasn't, he wouldn't see so many bans in place. And it's more than "bad owners". Some breeds are more prone to aggression than others.

Just because some politicians bought into some emotional hyperbole and legislated for a ban does not actually prove anything. You using the fact that some people banned the breed(rightly or wrongly) as proof that there is a problem is essentially just confirmation bias on your part.

[Protean]

The pitbull people are gonna be pissed at me. Imagine that, a dog that was bred to be a violent fighting dog actually contributes to far more fatalities per year than other dog breeds. It's almost like genetic science and selective breeding work, and no matter how well you "raise your dog to be nonviolent" it is not going to change the dogs physical genetics. Accept the science of genetics and spare me your "cute" pictures of pitbulls with children because I believe in statistics and science not propaganda.

http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-sta...ities-2016.php
http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-sta...ities-2015.php
http://www.dreamindemon.com/communit...ite-org.82564/

You're just linking data and not explaining the data. Is this just violence? Or is the socio-economic layer of the owners taken into account?

Is it a perfect example of violent people getting dogs with a reputation for being violent and raising them to be violent?


You believe in statistics and science, so please explain your presented science.


The fact that I have so many questions so early means you should have invested more time into your post.

[Ghazan Julio]

Try raising it with love as a puppy and when a dog gets violent or does something really dumb, you kick the shit out of them or stop. Pitbulls are big enough to stand up on their hind legs and fucking wrestle you like a bear. This kind of dog isn't for everyone.

[Vanyali]

I don't think it's just fear-mongering. As said, some breeds are just more prone to aggression than others. Add in size, irresponsible owners, bad breeding and in-breeding, and you get a major problem.

APBT are actually breed to be *less* aggressive, given that their handlers had to be able to break up dog fights without being mauled.

Poorly bred shit-mutts may or may not be aggressive because there's zero screening. And that happens with every "breed" that gets popular. Shit, even dalmatians were on the banned list shortly after 101 came out - they're high strung, require high exercise, and with an owner that wants it because my kid saw the movie they do a lot of damage.

[frogger237]

Ignore statistics and science and preach your "sweetest most submissive dogs" anecdotal evidence to someone else.

The problem is you cant account for all the factors that go into those numbers. Most "tough guys" don't buy standard poodles because they aren't seen as tough/cool dogs. I used to rescue dogs and like 70-85% of the dogs we rescued were pitbull/pitbull mixes because most trash people want a "badass" dog.

[Alvito]

#notallpits

Said almost everybody up until the attacked or killed somebody. Hey I get oeople like ir love the breed. If you have a family love them more though.

[Miyagie]

The issue is still not with the dog, but with the owners. Pit bulls unfortunately appeal to a certain kind of person who either has no idea how to fucking raise and handle a dog or who intentionally wants a vicious "badass" dog. If we ban Pit bull ownership, you know what will happen?

They'll jump on another breed like a Rottweiler or German Shepherd and do the same fucking thing all over again with those breeds. End result? Same fucking thing.

In most parts of europe the german shepherd is already the nr. 1 on biting people. If you watch some K9 police videos with german shepherds you know why, they are fucking flying murder machines and a poor or bad training leads to that when you hold one at home.

[Collegeguy]

It's not about the dogs but about their owners if they become violent.

What is it about owners that makes them violent? Is it ignorance, irresponsibility ect? You can tell with Mark Kelly for example that their bulldog had no respect for its owners.

[Swalload]

The pitbull people are gonna be pissed at me. Imagine that, a dog that was bred to be a violent fighting dog actually contributes to far more fatalities per year than other dog breeds. It's almost like genetic science and selective breeding work, and no matter how well you "raise your dog to be nonviolent" it is not going to change the dogs physical genetics. Accept the science of genetics and spare me your "cute" pictures of pitbulls with children because I believe in statistics and science not propaganda.

http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-sta...ities-2016.php
http://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-sta...ities-2015.php
http://www.dreamindemon.com/communit...ite-org.82564/

You forgot to post the statistic about the amount of pitbulls actually attacking people vs the amount not attacking people.

For happy fun times and absolutely very respectful and not sarcastic at all, do the same research with human races.

[Mehrunes]

What is it with putbulls that this topic appears again and again like a weed? Even tipping threads are less common.

Which is why Id be ok with restrictions on who can breed, and make sure mandatory training for all pitbull owners. A breed ban does nothing to help the long term problem of bad inbreeding and bad ownership. It just shifts the problem to other breeds.

Then you ban them too \o/ Or go all out from the get go and ban all dogs. We could sent them to space to colonize the alpha centauri region for us. And then the world will be cat only! I.e. pure.

[Altrec]

I don't think it's just fear-mongering. As said, some breeds are just more prone to aggression than others. Add in size, irresponsible owners, bad breeding and in-breeding, and you get a major problem.

Define a major problem? 22 people out of 320,000,000 is not a major problem its barely relevant.