Guilty verdict in teen suicide trial

[AeneasBK]

It really isn't. It's just a go-to for drones and propagandists with next to no idea of how free speech works in the US.
Popehat to the rescue, trope 2:

Thankyou. I learned something.

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You know what, I'm being a dick. I'm in a bad way today, and I'm letting my mood effect what I say.

I'm really sorry to you, @Freighter, and everyone else in the thread. Please disregard my posts.

Sounds like you need some pizza too *offers slice*. Its some spicy Italian meats thing... not too bad

[cubby]

Just because I don't physically create the situation where someone could die due to my negligence doesn't negate my negligence.

It could in the eyes of the law, and it is negated in previous case law. I'm not saying I agree morally, just legally the case is there to be made.

[Orange Joe]

You make a very valid point. This is the slippery slope I was referring to earlier, how mean to "mean words" have to be to meet the definition of manslaughter. I still see this case being overturned on appeal. The precedent is too squishy, and the Justices can find reasons to put it aside.

She is still despicable, of course.

It's not that anything said was mean. It's that she deliberately enabled and encouraged someone to harm themselves.

[cubby]

It's not that anything said was mean. It's that she deliberately enabled and encouraged someone to harm themselves.

Enabled? Maybe. Encouraged? Definitely. And that, imo, is where the issue resides. Did she physically enable him? Or was it all words. And do those words alone meet the standard of manslaughter. The judge obviously thought so.

I wonder if the appellate court will.

[moveth]

Follow. The. Case.

Jesus christ. She was a MONSTER in this case. She literally said (from the article)

Carter: "I thought you wanted to do this. The time is right and you're ready, you just need to do it! You can't keep living this way. You just need to do it like you did last time and not think about it and just do it babe. You can't keep doing this every day."

She is a fucking monster of a person. Period.

[Cruor]

Insane. what kind of weak willed loser kills themselves because an ex girlfriend texted them to do so? Hes not even a beta male, that's like Zeta male.

[NYC17]

Do you know anything at all about the story? It goes a lot further than someone saying, "go kill yourself."

I doubt anyone walking down the street telling some random person to go kill themselves would ever be convicted of a crime.

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I would compare it to a situation in which you saw someone dying and just watched them die rather than call 911. She could have done so and he wouldn't have killed himself. You could definitely be convicted with a crime in the first scenario so why not this one?

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The psychiatrist testified that she texted his phone for works? Wouldn't they have proof of that? You also seem to forget what manslaughter means anyway. Intent isn't needed.

He wasn't dying though. He seemed to constantly be talking about doing it. Again, I'm extremely uncomfortable that encouraging someone to commit suicide makes that person culpable. The kid wanted to die enough to actually go through with it with some encouragement. Facing up to 20 years in prison for that situation...?

Nah.

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Follow. The. Case.

Jesus christ. She was a MONSTER in this case. She literally said (from the article)

Carter: "I thought you wanted to do this. The time is right and you're ready, you just need to do it! You can't keep living this way. You just need to do it like you did last time and not think about it and just do it babe. You can't keep doing this every day."

She is a fucking monster of a person. Period.

There's a difference between being an awful human being and being criminally responsible.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

There's a difference between being an awful human being and being criminally responsible.

In this case she is both.

[NYC17]

In this case she is both.

We'll see how the appeal goes. I'm uncomfortable with the verdict. Encouraging someone to commit suicide, he clearly wanted to commit suicide, and that person facing a punishment of up to 20 years in prison for is...uncomfortable.

[elaina]

I agree manslaughter is kind of weird, but this was way worse than merely telling him to kill himself. She basically psychologically mindfucked a mentally-ill vulnerable person who loved her into thinking he should do it. When the person who should love you most is just matter-of-factly telling you that you need to do it, what else do you even have left? And this wasn't just a one off thing... it was over multiple days, so she clearly knew what she was doing and was even on the phone with him as it happened and did nothing to stop it.

Yes it's true her actions did not physically kill the guy, the supposed "method" was more psychological / emotional, but again... vulnerable depressed guy who thinks this person should care about him. An interesting difference between this and other intentional manslaughter cases (such as killing someone with your car, or accidentally shooting somebody), there was actual foreknowledge and intent with her actions. It wasn't mere reckless happenstance causing a chain reaction. She knew what she was doing, which makes it more sinister/heinous that most over cases like this.

IMO this girl is probably borderline personality at least if not slightly psychotic and was doing it for the attention she'd receive from everyone for her boyfriend dying.

[The One Percent]

[Collegeguy]

There's a difference between being an awful human being and being criminally responsible.

She was a mini Dr. Kevorkian with the number of text messages that were shown of her coaching to his end.

And that guy went to prison too.

[NYC17]

She was a mini Dr. Kevorkian with the number of text messages that were shown of her coaching to his end.

And that guy went to prison too.

And he shouldn't have. She also did not physically assist him. it's nowhere near synonymous.

[NatePsy]

Disturbing amount of people in this thread with no clue or even a shred of an idea of what depression/mental illness is and how much affect you can have on someone that looks to you for support in a partnership where they unconditionally love you. It's not as simple as words, it's much more than that when you're dealing with somebody that has severe depression. Constantly encouraging a person with such an illness over a couple of years or more is pretty damn reckless and can easily be stamped as involuntary manslaughter.

Some of these posters need to educate themselves on depression and related mental illnesses because they have absolutely no clue how susceptible they are to suggestion when help is not given for this individual to improve their issues. Which it seems apparent she had no care in the world to do.

Psychology is a powerful thing, even more so when you have the right person and circumstance to take advantage of.

[NYC17]

Disturbing amount of people in this thread with no clue or even a shred of an idea of what depression/mental illness is and how much affect you can have on someone that looks to you for support in a partnership where they unconditionally love you. It's not as simple as words, it's much more than that when you're dealing with somebody that has severe depression. Constantly encouraging a person with such an illness over a couple of years or more is pretty damn reckless and can easily be stamped as involuntary manslaughter.

Some of these posters need to educate themselves on depression and related mental illnesses because they have absolutely no clue how susceptible they are to suggestion when help is not given for this individual to improve their issues. Which it seems apparent she had no care in the world to do.

Psychology is a powerful thing, even more so when you have the right person and circumstance to take advantage of.

Yes, it is a powerful thing. But criminal liability is a different level. Declaring people need to educate themselves on whatever you think they aren't informed enough about is pretty ridiculous. One can be educated on the matter and still feel as if criminality is a bridge too far.

[NatePsy]

Yes, it is a powerful thing. But criminal liability is a different level. Declaring people need to educate themselves on whatever you think they aren't informed enough about is pretty ridiculous. One can be educated on the matter and still feel as if criminality is a bridge too far.

It is involuntary manslaughter mate, you can deny it all you like but the jury have spoken pretty clearly. The meaning of those words pretty much puts her in that category, therefore she's regarded a criminal. Go look it up for me too, I'd like to see if you can prove me wrong. She is liable.

[NYC17]

It is involuntary manslaughter mate, you can deny it all you like but the jury have spoken pretty clearly. The meaning of those words pretty much puts her in that category, therefore she's regarded a criminal. Go look it up for me too, I'd like to see if you can prove me wrong. She is liable.

It wasn't a jury...mate.


And we're talking about the overall concept here, not the judge's decision in and of itself.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

We'll see how the appeal goes. I'm uncomfortable with the verdict. Encouraging someone to commit suicide, he clearly wanted to commit suicide, and that person facing a punishment of up to 20 years in prison for is...uncomfortable.

She could face up to 20 years in prison, though experts say such a lengthy sentence is unlikely.

She's not going to be sentenced for 20 years. 20 years is just the maximum penalty.

Bottom line is that it was within her power to at least make an attempt to stop him..and not only did she not do anything...she actively pushed him to do it. She wanted the attention of being the girl whose boyfriend committed suicide...well...She got it. Be careful what you wish for.

[NYC17]

She's not going to be sentenced for 20 years. 20 years is just the maximum penalty.

Bottom line is that it was within her power to at least make an attempt to stop him..and not only did she not do anything...she actively pushed him to do it. She wanted the attention of being the girl whose boyfriend committed suicide...well...She got it. Be careful what you wish for.

Experts also thought a guilty verdict was unlikely so that's not a compelling argument.

It's well known what she did. You can repeat it and call it the "bottom line" as much as you like but it doesn't change the fact that she was found guilty for expressing a thought. That's the basic premise.

It's also not the final word. It will be interesting to see if the conviction is overturned on appeal.

[Jofe]

From my point of view the sentence is well earned. Is was not a simple "Kill yourself". She constantly pushed him, she knew he had issues and still pushed him, she knew he needed help and still pushed him. You don't tell a person in that situation "kill yourself" and not expect something like this to happen. If it she had told him just once and then he proceeded to do it I would be more lenient, but no, it was way too many times. Hell she even was disappointed at times when she found out that he still hadn't kill himself. In the article it even says that at one point he was so broken that he was fucking apologizing to her for still being alive.

And she still pushed him to do it...