Civilians shouldn't have access to weapons

[mickybrighteyes]

America is quantifiably the only developed nation with backwards conservative thinking. You basically proved it.

I see the goal post shifted to make your previous statement more accurate.

edit:

I was going to go further about other first world countries doing fucked up things, but then I saw the underlined portion again.

Cause there's a lot of backwards thinking from non-conservative sources that makes people go WTF... like the time the Korean President believed they could contact their dead relative and basically fell in line with radical thinking of a cult to push shit through... or canada putting forth the steps to set up legal rammifications against those who don't use someone's preferred pronouns ^.~

So again... I think your contrary opinion of xir Mary may need a few tweaks.

[Flatspriest]

It's called the United States because whilst every different state might have slightly different variations of their structure and law, they still abide to roughly the same principle.
The same cannot be said about the whole of Europe, which is a continent with many different types of countries in them.

Feel free to share your findings about what the crime rates of the first world countries in Europe actually count up to compared to the US.

They are called the EU (European Union) because they decided to band together. See, two can play that game. Each state still has their own rules of law that the other states cannot control, much the same as the EU.

[Mifuyne]

They are called the EU (European Union) because they decided to band together. See, two can play that game. Each state still has their own rules of law that the other states cannot control, much the same as the EU.

And what is the outcome, can you link it to me?

Take all of Europe

So are you comparing the EU states or the entirety of Europe.

[Flatspriest]

And what is the outcome, can you link it to me?

The outcome is that if you take each states laws and gun violence into account, that the ones with the most of each has the harshest gun control laws are the ones with the highest rates of gun crimes. The criminals are terrorizing and preying on the weak much like they do in every country.

[Taso]

I think the solution is not to limit who gets guns. The solution is to stop making any kind of weapon. They are not needed for any reason.

See that would be very logical except for psychology. We create weapons in order to defend ourselves and this has been going on since we were hunter gatherers. If I don't know you I'm not going to the take the chance to trust you if you have the opportunity to kill me. While it may seem silly now we still have the reptilian part our brain.
Secondly killing is essentially a natural instinct. Why do think black widows get their name hint they kill the male spider. What does an animal do in the forest when it's hungry, it kills. So it's hard to rewrite a primitive instinct. What we have to do is promote education and set up systems that help those who are mentally disturbed and help detect signs of trouble.
For me unfortunately because I live in a free society and one with amendments I can't punish those who do wrong with those who do right. I have to work within the parameters to tweak these laws so everyone feels safe and not oppressed.

[Deleted]

THIS IS A SCENARIO
Ok, now what will you do when this happens.

A trespasser walks into your property and then got into the house. You have a wife, 2 daughter. You don't know whether he is armed, or alone. Now, he ties your wife and kids up, turns out the guy is a rapist and murderer. What would you do? Call Police? Wait for Police to get here, and by the time they get here, your wife, kids, raped and murdered. And he lets you live.

What would you do if THAT happens? Since you said no guns, you cannot have self defence either. What do you do?

There is where you need a birds eye view of what happens outside of a single scenario.
You can prevent many more times that atrocity happening in your scenario if guns were almost impossible to come by.
You cant prevent every criminal act, car accident (yet) or thunder striking right into the skull of a 4 year old kid. Is that sad? Yea sure, but shit happens, and you want less shit to happen right? Less guns = Less easy accessible killing power = less deaths from homicides.

But really, the problem in the big picture aint homicide anyway. Its lifestyle choices leading to heart diseases, smoking and what not.

I mean heart diseases kill at least 166 times as many people as guns do. And that is excluding cancer and smoking which kills an extreme amount too.
Guns are just easier to rage about because they seem more direct, but its the slow death that especially the Americans are afraid to change.

source: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr65/nvsr65_04.pdf

[Mifuyne]

The outcome is that if you take each states laws and gun violence into account, that the ones with the most of each has the harshest gun control laws are the ones with the highest rates of gun crimes.

By just comparing American states against eachother or comparing American states vs EU states.
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-...d-States/Crime

Looking on the website to compare the US with EU nations.

http://www.nationmaster.com/country-...d-States/Crime
There we go, enjoy.

[dextersmith]

Knives, bottles, bats, are all weapons. You can't baby proof everything.

[Mifuyne]

Knives, bottles, bats, are all weapons. You can't baby proof everything.

Except bottles were invented to store items in them.
The bat to play sports.
Every single thing can be weaponized, doesn't mean they were created for that purpose.

[Flatspriest]

By just comparing American states against eachother or comparing American states vs EU states.
http://www.nationmaster.com/country-...d-States/Crime

Looking on the website to compare the US with EU nations.

http://www.nationmaster.com/country-...d-States/Crime
There we go, enjoy.

That's like comparing The Netherlands against the whole of the EU. Each European country is around the same size as individual states. Compare those countries to states, not the whole US. You will also see that most gun violence is in states run by Liberals as opposed to Conservatives. That is mainly because conservatives believe in teaching people more about fire arm safety, rather than not teaching them and simply making it almost impossible to get them.

[Jingoism]

Look up 1 punch kills. Military grade assault hands NEED to be BANNED. Almost ALL killing tools are used by HANDS. This needs to be stopped!

[Taso]

Guns CONSIDERABLY raise human killing power. In a fistfight, you can take dozens of punches and have loads of opportunities to escape. A gunfight places everyone in a situation where 1 shot = 1 kill. When was the last time you saw in the headlines "Man goes on a punching massacre, kills 50"? Oh right. Never, because that just doesn't happen. Guns are a shitty self defense solution because they force you into a situation where you can't use force without killing. Knives don't even compare because at least they have some purpose other than killing people. Selling specialized killing tools to civilians is just dumb as hell.

Guns don't kill people, but they make killing someone way too easy. We don't sell nukes, drones and tanks for self defense. Why do we sell guns?

It reminds me of two quotes. I can't tell which one is real and which one is my own or some random person quote.
"A armed society is a dangerous society"
"A armed society is a safe society"
We sell arms because:
1.it's a business.
2. We live in a free society so everyone has the right to buy arms and excercise free will.
3. Self defense you can see my other post on this thread where I explain human nature and nature instinct.
4. Don't punish those who do right with those who do wrong. I personally don't like collective judgement and rather take a case by case scenario. To insure the good aren't mixed with the bad.

[mickybrighteyes]

Except bottles were invented to store items in them.
The bat to play sports.
Every single thing can be weaponized, doesn't mean they were created for that purpose.

pretty sure bats were just modified clubs rather than a tool made for sports first.

[Mifuyne]

That's like comparing The Netherlands against the whole of the EU. Each European country is around the same size as individual states. Compare those countries to states, not the whole US. You will also see that most gun violence is in states run by Liberals as opposed to Conservatives. That is mainly because conservatives believe in teaching people more about fire arm safety, rather than not teaching them and simply making it almost impossible to get them.

2nd link compares the EU and the US.

- - - Updated - - -

pretty sure bats were just modified clubs rather than a tool made for sports first.

Mhm, you are probably right.

1.it's a business.

This is just basically "it".
Aslong as a lot of money can be made, humans still sell stuff that are "unhealthy" (just like cigarettes) and just like with cigarettes, it takes a long time to even take things people took for granted or view as a positive to change their thoughts about the item in question.

[LaserChild9]

I've said it before and I'll say it again: Gun laws and regulations keep honest people honest.

If guns were completely outlawed, even owning one punishable by death if found, the people who do the shootings and such would still find ways to get them and use them. They always have, and they always will.

Arguing about this shit is pointless and shows how truly ignorant some people are to how shit works.

We outlawed guns in my country in 1996 after a school shooting, how many school shootings do you think we have had since then? Funnily enough, none. Between 2002 and 2015 firearm related crime dropped from 24000 per year to 7800, that's about a 60% decrease. So evidently your logic is flawed because between 2002 and 2015, 16200 of the people that were doing the shooting, no longer were. Gun control works and you are ignorant to pretend otherwise.

[Doctor Funkenstein]

Human with bigger gun always wins.
unless we remove all emotions including greed from humanity civilian disarmament is not a option and only exists to further dictatorships.

True story, y'all.

I mean, if say the United States did decide to turn into a dictatorship, all those civilians with their relative peashooters are gonna be able to take on the full might of the U.S. Military! It's true! Missiles? Bombing runs? Military drones? Attack helicopters? Shoooooot, my jury-rigged AK-47'll handle that shit!

[PosPosPos]

I see the goal post shifted to make your previous statement more accurate.

edit:

I was going to go further about other first world countries doing fucked up things, but then I saw the underlined portion again.

Cause there's a lot of backwards thinking from non-conservative sources that makes people go WTF... like the time the Korean President believed they could contact their dead relative and basically fell in line with radical thinking of a cult to push shit through... or canada putting forth the steps to set up legal rammifications against those who don't use someone's preferred pronouns ^.~

So again... I think your contrary opinion of xir Mary may need a few tweaks.

Good job, once again proving my statement - Trumpets are using developing nations as a benchmark for America's prosperity. Or just outright pulling "events" that only exist in their make believe alternative reality.

[Mifuyne]

True story, y'all.
I mean, if say the United States did decide to turn into a dictatorship, all those civilians with their relative peashooters are gonna be able to take on the full might of the U.S. Military! It's true! Missiles? Bombing runs? Military drones? Attack helicopters? Shoooooot, my jury-rigged AK-47'll handle that shit!

Aren't there like whole sects of people that are arming themselves incase the government goes apeshit?

[Aggrophobic]

Then again, countries such as Finland and Sweden has lots of guns but we still don't kill eachother all over the place.
If you simply make sure that the wrong people don't have easy access to guns it's not that big of a deal.
Oh, and mandatory education befor you get to own one also seems like a pretty good idea.

[Mifuyne]

Then again, countries such as Finland and Sweden has lots of guns but we still don't kill eachother all over the place.
If you simply make sure that the wrong people don't have easy access to guns it's not that big of a deal.
Oh, and mandatory education befor you get to own one also seems like a pretty good idea.

One reason is due to healthcare being available to almost everyone and the current "happiness" of these countries people.
The happier the people are, the less likely they will lash out and commit crimes.
With the state the US is in with it's disparity between it's classes, it's no real wonder why so many crimes are done.

Sorry but South Korea and Canada are first world developed countries. As I understand, Canada is even in the top 10 GDP 2016... South Korea was 11.. Both ahead of Australia and Russia. I think that puts them as a bit more than 'developed'

Crazy people do what crazy people do, no matter where they come from or how much power they possess.