Arthas' fate in the Void

[AwkwardSquirtle]

Val'kyr were only designed to retrieve fallen vrykul from the Shadowlands. This is something made evident in Silverpine Forest, from the use of strictly non-human troops in Pyrewood Village to the offering of the worgen curse to Hillsbrad refugees, although it's directly contradicted by gameplay mechanics like val'kyr raising death knights that die in their starting area. Presumably, their pact with Sylvanas was the only way to bring her back, and involves taking her place to do so.

I agree that Blizzard has been vague on the deaths of Arthas and Syvlanas, however. They seem to suffer a worse fate than should be normal, but outside of one short story we're told nothing.

Well you say it's worse than normal, but afaik they're the only ones we've actually seen die. Our experience of shadowlands in-game is fairly limited and we aren't stuck there because gameplay.
But why would they have to take her place? Why should such a pact have to be made? Are you suggesting it's lack of Vrykul descent? If so, why would such a system exist?
"Val'kyr, you can resurrect Vrykul, but if there's a non-vrykul soul there, you can take its place to bring it back if you want to I guess."
What's their motive?

[Hctaz]

Ah, I thought it was a playable quest, how unfortunate. :P

Thanks for the link, I'll definitely give it a read. But since it's a short story, it's non-canon I guess; we may not be able to connect it to current lore.
The story has evolved through the Chronicles, and as you said, Void Lords were not even mentioned back then.

Short stories and books are considered to be canon. It is canon but it wasn't the void. The "hell" visited is definitely part of the shadowlands or something akin to it. It isn't the void.

[AwkwardSquirtle]

Fair enough regarding the Shadowlands. There certainly isn't enough evidence to verify my theory, but I'm not seeing enough to squash it either. As for Blizzard doing a "poor job of communicating" that Sylvanas/Arthas' Hell was the void, I beg to differ ^_^:



I immediately associated the line "nothing so terrible could exist in the world of the living" with the Void Lords, who can't manifest in the physical realm without an immense source of power ^_^

It's entirely possible, but it's telling that Chronicle described Shadowlands as the realm of the dead, but gave no indication of the Void having any such links, as far as I remember.
It is possible that Arthas ended up om the Void due to the lingering presence of Yogg Saron, self-proclaimed God of Death. I'm still inclined to think that the forces of Death return to its own realm.

[Clone]

Jeeeeeeesuuuuuuuus chriiiiiiiiiiist. When are people gonna shut up about this.
Arthas is long gone, he is dead. Get this in your head:

His-Story-Is-Over
It ended with the best expansion we've ever had / ever will have for this game.
It was a fitting end.

So was Illidan's and look how that turned out.

[Mormolyce]

It is unclear in the text of Sylvanas' leader story whether the vision she had of Arthas in torment in the afterlife was actually him or just an illusion to demonstrate the futility of her crusade of vengeance and the horrors that await her in the next world.

- - - Updated - - -

So was Illidan's and look how that turned out.

Yeah but Illidan's death was a nadir in Warcraft's lore, whereas Arthas' was a zenith.

[StationaryHawk]

Well you say it's worse than normal, but afaik they're the only ones we've actually seen die. Our experience of shadowlands in-game is fairly limited and we aren't stuck there because gameplay.
But why would they have to take her place? Why should such a pact have to be made? Are you suggesting it's lack of Vrykul descent? If so, why would such a system exist?
"Val'kyr, you can resurrect Vrykul, but if there's a non-vrykul soul there, you can take its place to bring it back if you want to I guess."
What's their motive?

Legion gave us their origin as Odyn's creation. They are born from vrykul and deal exclusively in vrykul (and humans as a result of heritage). I couldn't tell you why they have such a limitation other than speculation, but it was one that was enforced at least in Cataclysm with enough contradictions since to make it somewhat dubious. Their motive with Sylvanas was finding a new vessel such that they could be free from the Lich King.

"Worse than normal" was just my opinion that I wouldn't think -everyone- who dies in Warcraft is subjected to eternal torment.

[Rustedsaint]

Arthas is in the shadowlands not the void,(until retcon) garrosh I can see him being dragged into the void since he did have a large chunk of old God grafted into him.

[MrSaggins]

But why would they have to take her place? Why should such a pact have to be made? Are you suggesting it's lack of Vrykul descent? If so, why would such a system exist?
"Val'kyr, you can resurrect Vrykul, but if there's a non-vrykul soul there, you can take its place to bring it back if you want to I guess."
What's their motive?

It might be worth noting here that Odyn is a creation of the Titans, Vrykul are creations of the Titans, Val'kyr are creations of the Titans by proxy + whoever Odyn got his knowledge from in the Shadowlands. I think it stands to reason that Val'kyr may only have power over Vrykul and their human descendants.

It's also interesting to consider that Blood Elves are only creations of the Titans by accident; descended from Dark Trolls mutated by the Well of Eternity, and then the Sunwell. In the afterlife could the souls of elves be bound somehow to Bwonsamedi? Haha!

It is possible that Arthas ended up om the Void due to the lingering presence of Yogg Saron, self-proclaimed God of Death. I'm still inclined to think that the forces of Death return to its own realm.

Good point about Yogg. Another reason I concluded that the Void Lords feed on souls and negativity was his line in the King Llane vision of his fight: "A thousand deaths, or one murder. Your petty quarrels only make me stronger." And it's worth noting Sylvanas threw herself on a Saronite spike, which could be a bridge to the Void. Perhaps that was the point of the sacrifices when the Old Gods ruled Azeroth?

[Charge me Doctor]

The Dark Lady confirmed she met him in what was presumably the Void, and the Void Lords seem to be tormenting him.

or it was her personal hell where she had to realize that she and arthas are the same and will get same punishment. Basically, she've seen what she (didn't)wanted to see, or someone else wanted her to see

[Dellis0991]

They would kill Arthas on sight! He could never lead them in any way. Arthas is done hopefully.

[darkoms]

Dead men never go to the Void (with the exception of Natalie Celine). Thoras Trollboy said that villains do not like in the Dark Lands. So Sylvanas got there exactly.

[MechaCThun]

Arthas is dead.

His story told what it needed to tell.

Now, Blizzard is known to bring back popular characters from the death to satisfy some lore angle...

...but Arthas is DEAD... right?

He can't come back... RIGHT?

[Fincayra]

Jeeeeeeesuuuuuuuus chriiiiiiiiiiist. When are people gonna shut up about this.
Arthas is long gone, he is dead. Get this in your head:

His-Story-Is-Over
It ended with the best expansion we've ever had / ever will have for this game.
It was a fitting end.

Wait, he didn't die in MoP....

[MechaCThun]

Wait, he didn't die in MoP....

Tell them only the Lich King is dead... and that WORLD OF WARCRAFT... DIED with him...

[Dellis0991]

Wait, he didn't die in MoP....

He talking about wrath....

[Arrashi]

Just no. Please just leave him alone. We don't need another "Hey guys im back" story. Not after illidan.

[Deleted]

I doubt he's in the Void. But rather in the Shadowlands, the realm of Undeath..

Why would a guy dealing in necromantic energies go to the Void upon death?

[Aucald]

I doubt he's in the Void. But rather in the Shadowlands, the realm of Undeath..

Why would a guy dealing in necromantic energies go to the Void upon death?

I also assume he is lodged quite uncomfortably in the Shadowlands, but Arthas did build and dwell in a citadel composed mostly of an Old God's blood and according to some sources dabbled closely with the power of the Old Gods (especially nearby Yogg-Saron).

[Deleted]

I also assume he is lodged quite uncomfortably in the Shadowlands, but Arthas did build and dwell in a citadel composed mostly of an Old God's blood and according to some sources dabbled closely with the power of the Old Gods (especially nearby Yogg-Saron).

The question that remains is really how different is 'Undeath shadow magic' from just Shadow magic.

The void has even been used to raise Undead on Draenor, by Ner'zhul the guy who became the LK in the main timeline. Ever since the Shadowlands became a thing that's really confusing.

[Arrashi]

The question that remains is really how different is 'Undeath shadow magic' from just Shadow magic.

The void has even been used to raise Undead on Draenor, by Ner'zhul the guy who became the LK in the main timeline. Ever since the Shadowlands became a thing that's really confusing.

Not to mention that legion as well has its own take on necromancy. I would guess that shadow is just element, that all interesting parties draw from and then shape it in their own way.