2016-2017 NBA Thread

[xskarma]

:/ (xskarma she's calling YOU the new people, lolololol.)

Well, I am. I only posted in this thread a few times just before Horford signed and then since the playoffs started, and I can't remember if I posted about basketball on these forums before that. I'm not that familiar yet with the posters in here and their quirks.

[Blueobelisk]

Well, I am. I only posted in this thread a few times just before Horford signed and then since the playoffs started, and I can't remember if I posted about basketball on these forums before that. I'm not that familiar yet with the posters in here and their quirks.

Well, I'm Blueobelisk. Clearly I live in New York and my two home teams (the Knicks and Nets) are garbage. I'm very realistic, so whenever I hear people act enthusiastic about them for the current season, I automatically assume they're dumb.

I also tend to post the most in the NBA thread.

(Also, me and Crissi are the best 2 on 2 basketball team in this thread. It feels extremely relevant.)

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Maybe AD and Towns and Giannis in the future. I would also not have Westbrook on that list. TO me he is like Iverson, great player but I dont think you can win with him.

Anthony Davis has been probably the best 2B. The best guy you'd want to have on your team to attempt to be a big franchise in the future. Giannis is probably that person now.

Westbrook...is talented and athletic enough to lead a team to a championship. Not while the really good Cleveland and the god-tier GSW team is alive, but maybe if it were a quieter NBA season. If you gave him some good role players, two top 10-20 range, and one top 30 range, I think he could do it.

Like, remove KD and Steph from GSW, but put Westbrook on the team. GSW keeps Steve Kerr as coach. Westbrook can tell everyone to fuck off and have a 50% ball usage rate, Klay and Green play good defense, and that team probably is a contender for winning a championship. They have a chance.

Btw the only real contenders this year were GSW, Cleveland, and Spurs. Even if Houston got past spurs, they'd have gotten handily destroyed by GSW or Cleveland. Being a "contender" really means you're already championship quality, it's just a matter of injuries and other teams.

[Blueobelisk]

? It really really depends on what kind of teams they get put on. The rest of the team is drafted in order so it's relatively balanced? God Lebron rapes everyone for the next 3 years. Kawhi can (and does) carry like that too.

I think guys like Curry and Durant look so shiny right now because they have other people on their teams to take pressure off of them. I wouldn't call them team leaders though, if they were alone with losers.

[xskarma]

Yep, just checked, I never posted about basketball on these forums before the Horford signing was about to happen and the KD hype was building in Boston.

Makes sense, cause I got SERIOUSLY salty after game 7 of the 2010 Finals when the Lakers (more accurately Pau Gasol and Ron fucking Artest) beat the Celtics (if only Perkins hadn't gotten hurt -_- ). I just felt the Celtics I'd watched the previous few years had had their peak and they were just going to get older and less able and I just had no interest in seeing them fade like that, as I had seen them fade in that game 7 down the stretch. So I basically gave up on basketball till recently.

I usually watched good Finals games even in those intervening years, but all very casually and without much rooting interest, just watching sports cause sports are fun. Basically only last off season did the fire really start rekindling, with the buzz about IT and Horford coming and even the minute chance that KD might come. And then the playoffs were like the last push I needed to embrace basketball again. Dried my salty tears, ready to see what the Celtics can do with their interesting roster and all their draft picks.

I'm in a better place now then I was back then so I'm also far less likely to ragequit the sport again.

[PhaelixWW]

Maybe AD and Towns and Giannis in the future. I would also not have Westbrook on that list. TO me he is like Iverson, great player but I dont think you can win with him.

I agree with this with the possible exception of AD.

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I think that the best teams can figure out how to guard Harden without drawing fouls, which makes him a very weak addition against an elite level team.

There's also been a lot of grumbling about the league doing something to curb the rampant shooting "fauxls" being called. Especially the screen-and-bump foul that Harden loves so much.

[Pendulous]

Post finals, who are your top 10 players if you're going for a championship in 2018?

Here's how I break mine down:

Tier 1: The King

1. LeBron

Tier 2: The triumvirate - rank these guys in any order, I'm ok with it. Largely depends on what you need.

2. Durant
3. Kawhi
4. Curry

Tier 3: The future

5. Giannis
6. Anthony Davis
7. Karl-Anthony Towns

Tier 4: The rest.

8. Paul George
9. Jimmy Butler
10. James Harden

I don't see a Rudy on that list.

Although. Do people even give a shit about legit centers anymore? He broke records this year, but it seems like nobody even cares.

[PhaelixWW]

I don't see a Rudy on that list.

Although. Do people even give a shit about legit centers anymore? He broke records this year, but it seems like nobody even cares.

To be fair, Rudy was second in win shares this year behind Harden. First in defensive win shares and 10th in offense win shares. That's pretty impressive.

I'm not sure I'd build a team around him, though.

[ItachiZaku]

All I want is for the Lakers to pass on Lonzo so I can laugh my ass at his asshole father.

100% this here.

[PhaelixWW]

That would be nice. Its one thing to pump fake and get a guy to foul you, its another to pump fake and then dive into them, that should not be called imo.

A pump-fake to get contact is like a 2 out of 10 on the flop-o-meter. A pump-fake followed by a lateral jump to initiate contact is like a 7 or 8 out of 10.

Skimming your screen and then stopping when your defender tries to go over the screen, just to force contact, is a 15 out of 10.

Have I mentioned that I hate flopping? :P

[jregz]

<Snip>

I still believe OKC would've been in the hunt. The only two opponents in the West that could take them out they compete extremely well against.

That's sort of the issue with the lineup that I mentioned previously - it's built as if KD is still there. It's hard to evaluate in this instance because it's impossible to replace a piece like KD at all let alone in one off-season. It shows too in the win shares and BPM - everyone but Westbrook dropped off the season after KD left.

LeBron leaving the Heat worked out for him and frankly, unless the team knew about Bosh's clotting issues that early on, he got lucky too. I still think he was taking a leap of faith with that move because Cleveland might've acquired a lot of talent in his return, there was no way to know how everything would gel with the new head coach, new teammates, and new system. This team was 19-20 at one point in their first year, and not necessarily favoured to get out of the East.

"Reap what you sow" doesn't necessarily have to mean someone did something wrong or bad. An example would be pro football. In the early days of football there was no passing, only running. So somebody was the first team to decide to start throwing a forward pass on some plays and were probably really successful. A few games later, another team might have copied their forward pass plays and used it to beat them in game. You could say you "reap what you sow" to that first team, but it doesn't mean they were wrong, they were incredibly innovative.

Fair enough. The logic still doesn't make a lot of sense to me but at this point, agree to disagree.

[Stommped]

So word is Boston #3 pick this year and Brooklyn unprotected 1st round pick next year (Hello Michael Porter) could be coming to the Bulls for JB, according to SAS. Apparently the hold up right now is the Bulls are also asking for Jae Crowder, and if that's what stops us from getting Porter and Jackson or Fox I'm going to be pretty upset. Fuck Jae Crowder

[Stommped]

It's always kind of felt like Butler is the guy the Celts wanted. That would make sense for them to do the trade then(to Philly). They drop two psorts pick up Butler and get another first round pick.

Yeah and Boston would sign Hayward to rollout a starting 5 of IT, JB, Hayward, and Horford which honestly I don't even think could beat the Cavs even assuming they don't approve at all, and not a chance in hell at competing with Dubs should they make it that far. I think Ainge would be making a huge mistake by not just using these picks and trying to hit a superstar instead of trying to win now because you have IT. It's pointless.

[SL1200]

I hate Jimmy Butler, but I think that's a bad trade for the Bulls. Better get more. I don't believe Paxson makes that trade anyway.

[Stommped]

I hate Jimmy Butler, but I think that's a bad trade for the Bulls. Better get more. I don't believe Paxson makes that trade anyway.

This year's #3 and next year's Brooklyn pick? Going to be hard to get more than that, plus we don't want to get any current talent so we can be really bad ourselves and potentially have two top 5 picks next year.

[SL1200]

This year's #3 and next year's Brooklyn pick? Going to be hard to get more than that, plus we don't want to get any current talent so we can be really bad ourselves and potentially have two top 5 picks next year.

The article that I read said Celtics would be keeping Brooklyn's pick.

[Stommped]

Now the Cavs are trying to trade for Jimmy...

[xskarma]

Now the Cavs are trying to trade for Jimmy...

And then the Cavs let go of their GM (per the 30th of June) and apparently the players don't even know yet.

What a shitshow in Cleveland.



In other news, I want Celtics to hold on to those picks too and not pick up Butler. I don't think he makes the Celtics better enough to compete with the Cavs and GSW and I'd rather not waste the assets in trying. I'd rather have 2 chances at the top guys next year and we pick Jason Tatum this year.

Celtics would be fun to watch, competitive to a certain degree AND have a great shot to bring in a superstar player next year, either through draft or trade. With the players currently available (Butler, George) it's just not worth it.

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"Dan Gilbert didn't consult with LeBron James prior to parting with David Griffin, sources said. James had advocated for Griffin extension"

https://twitter.com/WindhorstESPN/st...64830510551040


Do you think Lebron James will stay in Cleveland still @Blueobelisk or nah?

[Blueobelisk]

>When your team tanks hard to try and get a good pick, and they do get a #1 pick, but it goes to another fucking team.
>And the people in the NBA thread are arguing over what their team should do with the Nets pick.
>Meanwhile Nets continue to be garbage. Perpetual garbage.

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Uhhhh about Cleveland firing the GM, idk. As usual Cleveland is a shitty franchise that should be humbled that God Lebron graced his presence on them and gave them a championship. That doesn't mean they don't suck as an organization: there's more than just on-court basketball that goes on to make a team good.

I don't think Lebron particularly cares about this. As long as Cleveland brings someone in to negotiate for better role players, Lebron will be happy.

But as to whether Lebron leaves...I think it would take a real super team to be formed to for Lebron to leave. But realistically, no other team is gonna be formed that was better than this 2017 Cavs team (besides Warriors) for Lebron. Lebron's kids are like 3 years older now so he's probably fine leaving them and being on the road for a few years. (I think LBJ's kids being in Cleveland was critical for him wanting to go back to Cleveland.) I also think he's fine with leaving since he delivered on his championship promise.

Like, I feel like it'll look bad for him if he leaves again, but I think he's gentleman enough this time to do it so the 29 other teams are okay with it. So I think he is okay with leaving.

But without a super team, it doesn't happen. Not this off season at least.

[Blueobelisk]

I actually think that IT has to be like the third or fourth best guy if he's on a championship team. Not even 2nd best.

Weird to say, but regular season heroes are just that.

[xskarma]

In IT's defense he wasn't the same after game 6 against the Wizards. He played 2 more games and started in a 3rd but he was too banged up by that point.

And let's not pretend IT is the first scorer who needs to be schemed for on the defensive end. That kind of liability just get's THAT much more pronounced deep in the playoffs. It's like having a weak bullpen in Baseball. Can get through the season fine that way, but at some point in the playoffs you're going to have to get something from them or you get killed.

And, again in his defense, when he was against the Wizards it worked, kind of. He was usually defending the guy they switched him onto (often in the corner, often someone at the top of key that wasn't a threat to try to drive to the basket. He handled those duties like he should and wasn't awful.

Like most of the Celtics roster, he is what he is, guy with some obvious warts. They're pretty much all guys that got discarded or drafted outside the top 10 and had to work on their flaws to get where they are now. He's still talented enough to have dragged his team to a no. 1 seed and talented enough to get the team to a high seed again next season.


It feels weird though having to come to his defense when I'm not sold on him myself, at least not for the future. Love the guy and his spirit but giving a max deal to a small 29 year old who relies on quickness is a baaaaaaaad idea.

Have to trust in Danny and the frontoffice though, they'll do what's right, even if it's not obvious or even fun (as a fan).