Orc Paladin - How would you justify it?

[Cheapnecrolyte]

Orc paladins will never exist I hope. I doubt Blizzard would ever allow fel-green orc crusaders with a burning hatred for demons to exist. We are not going to roleplay a mini-version a disorder-aligned (fel) horde burning because of Durotar's heat.

[Syegfryed]

Orc paladins will never exist I hope. I doubt Blizzard would ever allow fel-green orc crusaders with a burning hatred for demons to exist. We are not going to roleplay a mini-version a disorder-aligned (fel) horde burning because of Durotar's heat.

the orcs are not "fel-green orcs" anymore, since Manoroth death, did you miss this?

[Cheapnecrolyte]

the orcs are not "fel-green orcs" anymore, since Manoroth death, did you miss this?

You're probably referring to AU orcs. There are still orcs with fel-green skin.

[derpkitteh]

You're probably referring to AU orcs. There are still orcs with fel-green skin.

the green skin is a simple mutation. no orc has fel within them unless they're a warlock.

it's no different from blood elven eyes.

[Syegfryed]

You're probably referring to AU orcs. There are still orcs with fel-green skin.

the green skin is not because of the fel anymore, it is just a genetic thing, theirs sons will have green skin unless another mutation happens like the gray ones from dragonmaw and blackrock

[MrPaladinGuy]

I wouldn't, kill it with fire.

[Friendlyimmolation]

the green skin is not because of the fel anymore, it is just a genetic thing, theirs sons will have green skin unless another mutation happens like the gray ones from dragonmaw and blackrock

Uh what ? When was this stated?


Their skin is still due to fel exposure, sure it passes on genetically but it's root is still fel.

[The5thVegetable]

The way the light functions, is that its power can be wielded by whomever has the willpower and faith to do so.

I imagine an Orc "paladin" would be only a paladin in how they fight- but their beliefs would be entirely different, rooted in self-belief, courage, and an unwavering will- instead of fueling the light with faith in what's good and just, they'd fuel the light with battle-spirit and a desire to fight for their people, standing as a paragon of warriordom, honor and the fighting spirit of the Orcs.

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the green skin is not because of the fel anymore, it is just a genetic thing, theirs sons will have green skin unless another mutation happens like the gray ones from dragonmaw and blackrock

It is due to Fel Corruption. Fel corruption is extremely hard to remove- it's similar to radiation in that sense. However, the quantities still present in Orcs is so miniscule that it has no effects on them, their envoirment, or how magic affects them- only their appearance. Their children will be green, and their children's children will be green, but over many generations as the fel is slowly diluted, they will gradually turn more brown until green skin is a thing almost if not entirely exclusive to Warlocks.

[Heladys]

What does an Orc gain from being a Paladin? Like, there's just no reason for him to do so...

Then he can express his cowardice through bubble-hearthing after he bombs civilians.

[Deleted]

I could only see Orc Paladins as nothing more but part of a massive army recruitment from the Army of Light.

Having Orcs suddenly embrace the gentle nature of the Light, when they are still primal and savage in their ways and culture, wouldn't really make any sense. A Pandaren or any Alliance race makes more sense for a paladin than Orcs in any way.

That being said, I could see Orcs, among others, becoming paladins if in a time of need and despair, a Naaru blessed all the races fighting for the Army of Light and allowed them to channel the power of the Light, essentially making them paladins and lifting the paladin race restriction. This would be similar to how M'uru willingly got captured and let the Blood Elves drain his energy, as a means to introduce them to the Light.

[Kaleredar]

Orc paladins are one of the few races that make less sense than tauren paladins.

In case you were wondering, the breakdown in most-to-least sense goes:

-"Every other race" (including trolls, forsaken, worgen) paladin
-Tauren paladin
-Goblin Paladin
-Orc paladin

All token BS to please the fans. Regardless, it doesn't fit the racial theme of the orcs. Also, the NE Paladin theme is covered by the Sisters of Elune. In short, the class doesn't fit the night elves anymore than druids fit the blood elves, but then again, neither did night elf mages.

Night elves worship a form of the light and have knights. That's just about all you need for a paladin in this day and age. Blood elves have zero association with nature.


And also, there's absolutely no reason there couldn't be a pandaren death knight. A few Pandaren roamed the eastern kingdoms and kalimdor before the events of MoP. It's entirely plausible that a couple (not very many) could have been caught by the scourge and converted into DKs.

[The Stormbringer]

As it's probably been said, with the one Orc who Tirion saved ages ago and sacrificed his standing, property, and ties to his friends and family to protect. Eitrigg, I think? He would take up the banner of Paladin in Tirion's honor, with other Orcs in the Argent Crusade, and they would in turn teach it to those in Orgrimmar and Durotar willing to learn, with aid of the Blood Elves. Converts to the Tauren religion could work too.

[McFuu]

Orc paladins are one of the few races that make less sense than tauren paladins.

In case you were wondering, the breakdown in most-to-least sense goes:

-"Every other race" (including trolls, forsaken, worgen) paladin
-Tauren paladin
-Goblin Paladin
-Orc paladin

Worgen Paladins: The issue with Worgen Paladins are there weren't really any Gilnean Paladins. No one to learn from when the walls went up, etc... etc...

The only Horde race which has a real claim to being Paladin would be the Forsaken, but for some reason Blizz won't give them to us. I sort of get BloodElf and Tauren, Bloodelf bend the light to their will much like all other magic, Tauren are granted the light by their God, who is greatly hinted at as being a Naaru. In the same sense NightElf Paladins should be in the game, because they share a god who is very closely related to the God which grants the Tauren access to the light.

[Kaleredar]

Worgen Paladins: The issue with Worgen Paladins are there weren't really any Gilnean Paladins. No one to learn from when the walls went up, etc... etc...

Sure, but there's no reason they can't learn now.

The only Horde race which has a real claim to being Paladin would be the Forsaken, but for some reason Blizz won't give them to us. I sort of get BloodElf and Tauren, Bloodelf bend the light to their will much like all other magic, Tauren are granted the light by their God, who is greatly hinted at as being a Naaru. In the same sense NightElf Paladins should be in the game, because they share a god who is very closely related to the God which grants the Tauren access to the light.

Paladins have a sort of... aesthetic... that Tauren don't meet (orcs either, for that matter.) Tauren armor is rough and crude. Paladin armor is supposed to be filigreed and fancy, or at least refined... which doesn't make too much sense on a giant cow-man.

[Syegfryed]

Uh what ? When was this stated?


Their skin is still due to fel exposure, sure it passes on genetically but it's root is still fel.

the change was made by the fel in the first place indeed, but the fel don't exist anymore

they are still green because the genes changed, fel works like radiation, even when the radiation is gone, and there is no signal for her anymore, the genes was already changed and will still be in that way

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It is due to Fel Corruption. Fel corruption is extremely hard to remove- it's similar to radiation in that sense. However, the quantities still present in Orcs is so miniscule that it has no effects on them, their envoirment, or how magic affects them- only their appearance. Their children will be green, and their children's children will be green, but over many generations as the fel is slowly diluted, they will gradually turn more brown until green skin is a thing almost if not entirely exclusive to Warlocks.

there is no more fel, manoroth is dead, but the genes will not change, they are already changed, they can't go back unless there are another mutation from something else.

thats way there are Yellow orcs right now, its not because the "fel is getting diluted" its because of the gene changes in the durotan Environment, like the genes changed with the dragonmawn and the blackrock orcs

thats way the thrall children's are not green, because Agra is brown, looks like the "brown gene" is a Dominant gene who surpass the green one


yet, this is meaningless, there are red fel orcs in outland who use the light

[mickybrighteyes]

the orcs are not "fel-green orcs" anymore, since Manoroth death, did you miss this?

the green orcs are still a thing and are green because of fel magic. They aren't blood rage junkies anymore though.

[Friendlyimmolation]

the change was made by the fel in the first place indeed, but the fel don't exist anymore

they are still green because the genes changed, fel works like radiation, even when the radiation is gone, and there is no signal for her anymore, the genes was already changed and will still be in that way

I understand what you were saying now, I thought you were saying Green orcs were always a thing and just a genetic mutation.

[The5thVegetable]

the change was made by the fel in the first place indeed, but the fel don't exist anymore

they are still green because the genes changed, fel works like radiation, even when the radiation is gone, and there is no signal for her anymore, the genes was already changed and will still be in that way

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there is no more fel, manoroth is dead, but the genes will not change, they are already changed, they can't go back unless there are another mutation from something else.

thats way there are Yellow orcs right now, its not because the "fel is getting diluted" its because of the gene changes in the durotan Environment, like the genes changed with the dragonmawn and the blackrock orcs

thats way the thrall children's are not green, because Agra is brown, looks like the "brown gene" is a Dominant gene who surpass the green one


yet, this is meaningless, there are red fel orcs in outland who use the light

If you have an official source stating this, I'd like to see it. Thrall's children could easily be brown simply because the corruption is so heavily diluted by getting children with an uncorrupted Orc that it's not potent enough to cause the green skin tone. And while the only example I can think of is from WC3, it's been shown that a red-skinned Orc will go back to green if cleansed, which I say supports green being caused by the taint, not genetics.

But, I'll also have to point out, that this thread isn't here for the purpose of discussing Orc skin-tones, it's for discussing Orc paladins! So let's stop derailing it and get back to the topic at hand!

And as a last note, I'll just point out that the fel corruption presumably present in Orcs is -not- sufficient to actually impact their interaction with any form for magic.

[Syegfryed]

If you have an official source stating this, I'd like to see it.

there is a old blue post talking about how fel magic work like radiation, and the genes changed, and all the corruption and fel magic is gone when manoroth die.

Thrall's children could easily be brown simply because the corruption is so heavily diluted by getting children with an uncorrupted Orc that it's not potent enough to cause the green skin tone.

thats can't be simple because the new orcs born in azeroth after manoroth dead are still born green, the frostwolf is a Incorrupted clan, far away fron everything and still they childrens are born green today, and even the heavy corrupted ones can spawn a gray orc from the blackrock or dragonmaw

And while the only example I can think of is from WC3, it's been shown that a red-skinned Orc will go back to green if cleansed, which I say supports green being caused by the taint, not genetics.

what? they turned red to green because of magic, if it was only fel, they could co back to brown if cleaned again

But, I'll also have to point out, that this thread isn't here for the purpose of discussing Orc skin-tones, it's for discussing Orc paladins! So let's stop derailing it and get back to the topic at hand!

this come up because people said the orcs are fel corrupted because they are still green and could not hold the light, and this is false in both aspects, they are no longer corrupted and don't have any more fel traces, and they can use the light if they want

yet orcs paladins are damn ugly and should not happens but not because they can't

[Zulkhan]

Fully fledged out? "They aren't really Paladins, they're sun druids" despite them being in the Paladin order hall and not the Druid one (which is obvious for gameplay reasons, but doesn't make sense lorewise) isn't fully fledged out.

They are in the Paladin Order Hall because, despite the different cultural and religious beliefs, the core teachings are the same. And seriously, what makes a Blood Elf more fitting as a Paladin compared to a Tauren? Hell, in TBC they pretty much "cheated" and built their own Paladin order by leeching on a goddamn Naaru. And I also disagree on the fact that they were interesting in the first place. Sure, better than what they are now but a bunch of pseudo-Paladins simply drawing power from a source did nothing but cheapen the whole concept, homogenizing it on the Blood Elf's usual habits (leeching power from any source, be it the Arcane, the Fel and eventually the Light as well).
If we want to talk of interesting Paladin concepts than the Scarlet Crusade and especially the Brotherhood of the Light have tons of potential, too bad the first got butchered and the second are ignored and forgotten.

On the other hand, Sunwalkers are and remain Light-wielding warriors. However, "Light-wielding warrior" does not mean you have to go for the human idea of it, the shining armor and "knighty" look. Tauren revere the Sun (An'she) and the main characteristic of the Sun from anyone on Earth is its light. And what you get is basically a bunch of tribal Light-wielding warriors.

The issue are not the Tauren wielding the Light, the issue is Blizzard either unable or too lazy to say "they are somewhat the same class yet they're different", instead they treat everything as a generic Paladin with generic Paladin named spells and Paladin looking armor. That's why Tauren look "bad" or why Blood Elves look "boring" as Paladins. They're just mere extentions of the human idea of Light-wielding warrior.

There's also even some minor setup for troll paladins in the lore, back in the days of Zul'Gurub, via the Freethinkers of Zandalar:

http://www.wowhead.com/quest=8053/pa...ers-armguardsc
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=8055/pa...rs-breastplate

The setup was further reinforced recently, with Zandalari Prelates roaming around the Throne of Thunder.

OT: Honestly speaking, there's nothing preventing Orcs to go for the holy way. However, unlike others, I utterly loathe the idea of giving every class to every race without maintaining a small degree of diversity. And Orcs are not really cut for the Paladin class in my opinion. Tauren were easier to justify, giving their overall moderate attitude and characteristic striving for balance in their culture, with the explored issue of how the Night Elf side of their spirituality (Druid stuff and shit) was not enough to fully define their beliefs. When it comes to Orcs, however, there's very little room for any considerable number of Orcs going for the holy way. Unlike Tauren, they remain a prominently warrior race with warrior beliefs and shamans pretty much cover every single one of their spiritual needs. There's just not a visible need of Priests and Paladins whatsoever.

Moreover, Orcs don't really fit thematically. Some could say the same about Tauren but if you ignore the trivialities of their physical looks, their attitude and culture fits the ideology of a warrior holding strong beliefs and convictions. Orcs on the other hand are entirely focused on the warrior prowess and a "might makes right" kind of mentality (which doesn't necessarily mean being like Garrosh, just that strength is what truly matters on the end of the day). Overall they hardly strike as a race holding or even looking for "higher" beliefs than that, the ones to build the sufficient willpower and conviction to call the Light on your service. It could be the case for rare individuals but nothing beyond that.

Rather than Orcs, I would see Trolls go for the Paladin way. The game has already proved that just like Night Elves can likely go Paladin through the faith on Elune, Trolls can do the same through their faith on the Loa.

Don't you need some kind of magical affinity? Look at Varian, he believed in the Light but was completely unmagical

There's different degrees of "belief". To call upon the Light such belief must be incredibly strong, and Varian's own faith, if we go by his little chat with Maraad in the Lords of War clips, wasn't really that adamant in the first place.

Blood elves have zero association with nature.

Rangers do have a small degree of that.