UK general election 2017

[Kallisto]

Hey guys want a dose of strong and sable?

The Democratic Unionist Party broke off talks with Theresa May this week as it told her to spend £2billion in Northern Ireland if she wants the party to prop up her minority Conservative Government.

The DUP demanded the cash – which works out as £1,100 per person in the Province - as talks veered dangerously close to breaking down altogether.

The talks became so strained in the past few days that the DUP negotiators in Belfast refused to pick up the phone to the Prime Minister’s team for 36 hours, The Daily Telegraph can disclose.

Westminster sources said they now hoped a “confidence and supply” deal could be agreed next week, days before Thursday’s key vote on the Queen’s Speech.

The talks have been held together personally by Gavin Williamson, the chief whip, and Damian Green, Mrs May’s right hand man in the Government.

Speaking yesterday Mr Green admitted that a deal might not be done ,saying it was “possible we won't be able to agree" on a formal arrangement which would see the DUP's 10 MPs back the Conservatives in the Commons.

Mr Green added: “Clearly two political parties, we have some differences but we have a lot in common.”


The £2billion demand – with £1billion spent on the National Health Service and £1billion on infrastructure - was made by the DUP this week.

That came as the DUP team decided not to answer their telephones for 36 hours to the Conservative team .

A source said: “They stopped answering their phones. It went on for 36 hours. Number 10 is putting in calls and they are not answering their phones.”

The concern is that these hard demands for cash will make it harder for the Tories and DUP to work together over the next five years.

The demand could cost the UK taxpayer billions more if any of the cash is judged to trigger spending elsewhere in the UK through the Barnett formula.

Typically £1 spent in the Province would require an additional £35 to be found for Scotland, England and Wales.

The DUP is prepared to walk away from a formal deal with the Government and decide whether to back the Tories on a “case by case” basis.

Earlier this week A DUP source said: "The Conservatives need to give greater focus to discussions. DUP can't be taken for granted.

“Negotiations haven't proceeded in the way that we would have expected."


The delay is a significant blow to the authority of Mrs May who said hours after the election that she would seek a deal with the DUP’s 10 Westminster MPs.

Number 10 then announced that a deal had been done 48 hours after the election, only to retract the statement the following day. A Number 10 spokesman said yesterday: "Talks are ongoing."

In the House of Commons a DUP MP Jeffrey Donaldson angrily complained after his party were branded ‘dinosaurs’ in the Queen’s Speech debate.

Green MP Caroline Lucas questioned whether they had influenced the environment apparently being ignored in the Queen's Speech.

Ms Lucas asked whether she had been “influenced by the DUP dinosaurs who sit beside me and who don’t want to take that kind of leadership in the future”.

John Bercow, the Speaker, ruled that the term “dinosaurs” was not unparliamentary, and its use was a “matter of taste.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...mand-2billion/

This woman wants to lead the Brexit talks. Yet she can't make a deal with a small party within the UK political system. Who is she trying to fool thinking she can convince leaders of 27 countries to listen to her and treat her as an equal?

Strong and Stable? Or Chaos?

[Shadowmelded]

Hey guys want a dose of strong and sable?



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...mand-2billion/

This woman wants to lead the Brexit talks. Yet she can't make a deal with a small party within the UK political system. Who is she trying to fool thinking she can convince leaders of 27 countries to listen to her and treat her as an equal?

Strong and Stable? Or Chaos?

My favourite part of this whole ordeal is people assuming the DUP won't vote down the Queen's Speech because they don't like Corbyn. They could easily vote down the Queens Speech, starting the 14 day time limit to try again which just increases the pressure May is under.

Oh and also election related; https://www.theguardian.com/politics...n-election-law While under investigation for breaking electoral rules in the 2015 election they skirt (and possibly break) the law again???

[Huehuecoyotl]

My favourite part of this whole ordeal is people assuming the DUP won't vote down the Queen's Speech because they don't like Corbyn. They could easily vote down the Queens Speech, starting the 14 day time limit to try again which just increases the pressure May is under.

Oh and also election related; https://www.theguardian.com/politics...n-election-law While under investigation for breaking electoral rules in the 2015 election they skirt (and possibly break) the law again???

If you were the DUP, you would almost be forced to vote against it. To send the message to May that if she doesn't comply with their *ahem* requests, that she doesn't just have an effective minority, she has an actual minority.

If the DUP were to abstain, May would be in a much stronger position in any future negotiations.

[Mayhem]

This becomes stranger than fiction.

[ranzino]

Brexit talk started monday and AFAIK they will meet every 4 weeks. but if the british part has no mandate because May is not able to lead, it falls flat on its face ?

[ati87]

Brexit talk started monday and AFAIK they will meet every 4 weeks. but if the british part has no mandate because May is not able to lead, it falls flat on its face ?

Well mandate was always a joke, at best she got a british mandate and not a EU mandate (people confuse that)

But if it seems the coalition with that other party fails then her position becomes even a bigger joke

All in all the whole Brexit thing is a joke, non of the cheerleaders ever took responsibility after the referendum and I read today that Boris Johnson promised not to challenge leadership till after Brexit. In other words he doesn't want to the promotion of captain on a sinking ship...

Sure the trolls will disagree about how this is becoming a joke but that's like admitting that they where wrong and the whole destiny crap is just crap.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Brexit talk started monday and AFAIK they will meet every 4 weeks. but if the british part has no mandate because May is not able to lead, it falls flat on its face ?

Since the role of the UK in this is to say "I don't think we can accept that" followed by the EU telling us that's what we're getting, followed by us saying "Okay then", I don't think it really matters whether the UK side have a mandate or not. The end result will be a deal that is either unworkable in the sense it will do too much damage to the UK, or unacceptable to the small minded idiots that were at the heart of the Leave campaign. Not the people that voted for it, I hasten to add. There were all sorts of reasons behind people getting behind the notion of Brexit. But the people that were pushing it, they were small minded idiots, I stand by that.

I have the strongest suspicion that we are going to end up putting the final deal to a referendum again. Because the parties will be too terrified of imposing it, for fear of taking all the blame when it buggers the country up six ways from Sunday. If they can put it to another vote, knowing that it will be so awful that they can guarantee a rejection of it, then they can end up staying in the EU without being seen to backtrack from the original referendum result.

Otherwise I can only see this being the end for whichever political party is in charge when this stuff starts to have an impact. I don't see how they will ever be able to distance themselves from the toxic legacy.

[draykorinee]

I swear there was some guy saying our system is the best because you don't have all this bullshit like Holland? Jokes on him I guess.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Theresa's offer on the rights of EU citizens in the UK post-brexit:

EU nationals resident in the UK for longer than 5 years, as well as those legally resident in the UK before a cut-off date (presumably the day that the UK leaves the EU) will retain citizen-equal rights to residency, healthcare, education, benefits and pensions.

EU nationals who were legally resident in the UK prior to the cut-off will be allowed to remain in the country to complete the 5 year residency requirement for permanent residency and the other rights mentioned.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40375761

[Kallisto]

I swear there was some guy saying our system is the best because you don't have all this bullshit like Holland? Jokes on him I guess.

Dribbles will spin this into something on how great Britain is and superior. Last year the guy was bitching about how the EU failed to protect British steel. When he was told the EU actually had a near flawless plan that would have protected British steeland the reason it wasn't put through was Cameron's veto he turned around to praise Cameron's veto because UK steel should die cause free market.

[Deleted]

Theresa's offer on the rights of EU citizens in the UK post-brexit:

EU nationals resident in the UK for longer than 5 years, as well as those legally resident in the UK before a cut-off date (presumably the day that the UK leaves the EU) will retain citizen-equal rights to residency, healthcare, education, benefits and pensions.

EU nationals who were legally resident in the UK prior to the cut-off will be allowed to remain in the country to complete the 5 year residency requirement for permanent residency and the other rights mentioned.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40375761

So, basically, those that moved to Britain the past 2 years are fucked.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

So, basically, those that moved to Britain the past 2 years are fucked.

No, they will be granted leave to complete the 5 year residency requirement post-brexit. So for example somebody that moved to the UK on the 30th March 2015 will be able to stay the 1 year they need after 29th March 2019 to gain resident status.

[Deleted]

No, they will be granted leave to complete the 5 year residency requirement post-brexit.

It depends how deep "legally resident" goes. I have former colleage friends that moved to Britain to other friends' houses, still are trying to settle down and getting all the paperwork together.

[Dhrizzle]

I swear there was some guy saying our system is the best because you don't have all this bullshit like Holland? Jokes on him I guess.

These are new and exciting times in British politics.

First Past The Post is finally fucking up which hopefully means we'll move to something better representative of vote-share. As an idea of how unbalanced the system is, the DUP got their 10 seats from 292,316 votes. The Green Party got 524,604 votes which translated into 1 seat. With PR some sort of deal between Labour, SNP and Lib Dems (the left-leaning parties) could have put Corbyn in number 10 with 50.4% of the vote (52% if they throw in the greens.) Then it's just a matter of how well they can play together to actually govern.

[Deleted]

These are new and exciting times in British politics.

First Past The Post is finally fucking up which hopefully means we'll move to something better representative of vote-share. As an idea of how unbalanced the system is, the DUP got their 10 seats from 292,316 votes. The Green Party got 524,604 votes which translated into 1 seat. With PR some sort of deal between Labour, SNP and Lib Dems (the left-leaning parties) could have put Corbyn in number 10 with 50.4% of the vote (52% if they throw in the greens.) Then it's just a matter of how well they can play together to actually govern.

But UK democracy, is best kind of democracy!
Actually only real democracy in the EU!

And it is. The Dutch still, months after their election, don't have a working effective coalition.
Not that that matters as in reality they are ruled by Brussels.

And i was being sarcastic.

[Kallisto]

These are new and exciting times in British politics.

First Past The Post is finally fucking up which hopefully means we'll move to something better representative of vote-share. As an idea of how unbalanced the system is, the DUP got their 10 seats from 292,316 votes. The Green Party got 524,604 votes which translated into 1 seat. With PR some sort of deal between Labour, SNP and Lib Dems (the left-leaning parties) could have put Corbyn in number 10 with 50.4% of the vote (52% if they throw in the greens.) Then it's just a matter of how well they can play together to actually govern.

Yeah but the Tories can't have that. PR would essentially while likely be the largest party would also make them completely irrelevant since all other parties are left of centre.

[dribbles]

I swear there was some guy saying our system is the best because you don't have all this bullshit like Holland? Jokes on him I guess.

And it is. The Dutch still, months after their election, don't have a working effective coalition. Not that that matters as in reality they are ruled by Brussels.

The UK on the other hand has a strong and stable government days after the election. You do realise the conservatives don't need the DUP for the Queens speech to pass?

[Deleted]

Yeah but the Tories can't have that. PR would essentially while likely be the largest party would also make them completely irrelevant since all other parties are left of centre.

it would also tear their coalition apart, it would be like the UKIP to the max, but worse.

[dribbles]

These are new and exciting times in British politics.

First Past The Post is finally fucking up which hopefully means we'll move to something better representative of vote-share. As an idea of how unbalanced the system is, the DUP got their 10 seats from 292,316 votes. The Green Party got 524,604 votes which translated into 1 seat. With PR some sort of deal between Labour, SNP and Lib Dems (the left-leaning parties) could have put Corbyn in number 10 with 50.4% of the vote (52% if they throw in the greens.) Then it's just a matter of how well they can play together to actually govern.

Fptp is perfectly fine and always superior, it doesn't reward losers and fringe fruitcakes, what is wrong with that? Would you really want UKIP with almost 100 seats? Even progressive people like me would not wish that on the country....

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2015-32601281

[rogueMatthias]

These are new and exciting times in British politics.

First Past The Post is finally fucking up which hopefully means we'll move to something better representative of vote-share. As an idea of how unbalanced the system is, the DUP got their 10 seats from 292,316 votes. The Green Party got 524,604 votes which translated into 1 seat. With PR some sort of deal between Labour, SNP and Lib Dems (the left-leaning parties) could have put Corbyn in number 10 with 50.4% of the vote (52% if they throw in the greens.) Then it's just a matter of how well they can play together to actually govern.

So what you're saying is - Even WITHOUT First Past the Post, May would have still beat Corbyn pretty easily?

If ALL of the losing parties teamed up together to get more votes than the "winning" party and make their own government we'd be the laughing stock of the world. I find it hilarious when people suggest this.

Could we call them "The Legion of Losers"?