Page 13 of 27 FirstFirst ...
3
11
12
13
14
15
23
... LastLast
  1. #241
    the free MSs from T20 in Bladestorm benefit from EP? Translating, should we use BS in execute phase with 2 EP stacks?
    There is some kind of strange Interaction that would benefit do the oposite (BS without any EP stacks becouse BS COULD consume EP buff but dont get the benefit?)

  2. #242
    Quick question :

    In the FoB rotation, it is said that ring execute proc are always higher priority than MS. Is it true even if you have 2 stacks of EP already ?

    In the execute rotation, do you also prioritise a new Execute over MS if you sit at 2 stacks of EP but with no SD debuff ?
    Last edited by Ezyah; 2017-06-23 at 10:19 AM.

  3. #243
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezyah View Post
    Quick question :

    In the FoB rotation, it is said that ring execute proc are always higher priority than MS. Is it true even if you have 2 stacks of EP already ?

    In the execute rotation, do you also prioritise a new Execute over MS if you sit at 2 stacks of EP but with no SD debuff ?
    Yes, though the likelihood of that is very unlikely to ever happen.

    Yes, to trigger Tactician.

  4. #244
    Quote Originally Posted by orgonutil View Post
    the free MSs from T20 in Bladestorm benefit from EP? Translating, should we use BS in execute phase with 2 EP stacks?
    There is some kind of strange Interaction that would benefit do the oposite (BS without any EP stacks becouse BS COULD consume EP buff but dont get the benefit?)
    I'm also wondering if you use bladestorm during execute, but in addition to 4p tier 20 I have the legendary helm. I want to say yes for the free stacking damage buff, but just want to verify.

  5. #245
    Quote Originally Posted by Deemerbob View Post
    I'm also wondering if you use bladestorm during execute, but in addition to 4p tier 20 I have the legendary helm. I want to say yes for the free stacking damage buff, but just want to verify.
    Why are you wondering this, it's point-blank in the guide.

  6. #246
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    Ravager performs well with T19 because of Helm, but much poorer without Helm, or with T20. The guide is written for T20, not T19, so while Ravager is a decent choice, it's quite simply not going to get a lot of attention in the guide. The expectation of T20 is to get T20, and within a week it'll be trivial information in an already bloated document.

    Ravager is still strong on multi-target, especially in conjunction with CoF and Pants, which the guide mentions, though that section could be better fleshed out.
    Actualy Ravager +T20 works quite well if you also use CoF trinket , CoF reduce CD of BC by almost same as T20 reduce Ravager CD
    But if you dont have good CoF ravager with T20 is kinda poor

  7. #247
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    Why are you wondering this, it's point-blank in the guide.
    The only thing I see regarding usage is to always using it with battle cry, unless I just missed it, but there's nothing specifying usage during execute. Im assuming that Includes during execute, but don't want to miss anything making said assumption, hense me asking the question.

    I'm guessing 2 stacks of ep -> Cs -> bc + bladestorm, continue execute rotation.

  8. #248
    Quote Originally Posted by kubuntu View Post
    Actualy Ravager +T20 works quite well if you also use CoF trinket , CoF reduce CD of BC by almost same as T20 reduce Ravager CD
    But if you dont have good CoF ravager with T20 is kinda poor
    It works out well in terms of timing, but you're using a sub-optimal trinket to make a sub-optimal talent work. It's still not as good as the traditional setups for single target.

  9. #249
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    It works out well in terms of timing, but you're using a sub-optimal trinket to make a sub-optimal talent work. It's still not as good as the traditional setups for single target.
    Thing is that atlest atm acording to logs that 'suboptimal "talent is working realy good even on singletarget fights

  10. #250
    Quote Originally Posted by kubuntu View Post
    Thing is that atlest atm acording to logs that 'suboptimal "talent is working realy good even on singletarget fights
    Of course it is.

    Yall talk about optimal/suboptimal choices like they're 20% deltas... but they're not. The differences between best and worst talents are often as little as 1-2%, or as much as 5% differences. That can easily be made up by good play, lucky procs, fast kills, or simply well-formulated strategies.

    Ranking in WoW is a game of inches, and when you're competing against 20,000 other people, those 0.1% optimizations matter, but this early in the tier it's more often being measured by miles. Right now, you'll see all sorts of things on logs because few people have killed the bosses, and fewer still are actually competing on said bosses. Early gear is going to have a huge impact, as well as whether or not you're doing splits, carrying extra players on N/H, or just have experience with the fight ahead of time.

    I'd also point out that we're talking about T20, which very few people have at the moment. We've already established that Ravager works quite well with T19, due to activating the Helm without the use of Bladestorm.

  11. #251
    Something is well off in the sims though with Ravager, I simmed 880k with the build (Rend, Ravager, TM)... That's a sim of full consumables, Bloodlust and Execute phase... Meanwhile in game, over 415mil damage I finished on 915k with no consumables, no Bloodlust and no Execute phase, I did another test over 250mil damage and I ended on 950k, and was able to repeat this over and over. Posted about it in the Arms thread.

    It may be true that Ravager is behind, but Simcraft is so far from reliable when it comes to that build right now. I don't put a lot of time into WoW atm, I'm not raiding and haven't for months so I won't pretend to be an expert, or that I've looked into it in detail.. The on the surface results though are pretty clear, maybe the APL is fucked? I don't have the time to look into it.
    Probably running on a Pentium 4

  12. #252
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbazz View Post
    Something is well off in the sims though with Ravager, I simmed 880k with the build (Rend, Ravager, TM)... That's a sim of full consumables, Bloodlust and Execute phase... Meanwhile in game, over 415mil damage I finished on 915k with no consumables, no Bloodlust and no Execute phase, I did another test over 250mil damage and I ended on 950k, and was able to repeat this over and over. Posted about it in the Arms thread.

    It may be true that Ravager is behind, but Simcraft is so far from reliable when it comes to that build right now. I don't put a lot of time into WoW atm, I'm not raiding and haven't for months so I won't pretend to be an expert, or that I've looked into it in detail.. The on the surface results though are pretty clear, maybe the APL is fucked? I don't have the time to look into it.
    The only issue that I've found lately is a minor unintended interaction between Rend and Ravager, which should be fixed in an upcoming build. This will pushe Ravager up another 4% or so, but it's still about 5% behind OpS (using T20), reduced to ~3% when using CoF (over the default stat stick, which isn't technically as strong as some other trinkets that could be be used). Also be aware that the simulation does not use Heroic Charge by default, as it's classified an unrealistic gain, so if you're doing that, you're already playing ahead of the simulation.

    The Rend interaction is very likely the culprit of the damage difference you're seeing, though I'll keep an eye out for anything else.

  13. #253
    Spoke to Ryzoh and found another bug between Ravager and Haste, which should be fixed in an upcoming build. Guide will be updated if/as necessary once the change has been properly implemented and evaluated.

  14. #254
    Okay, I have a rotational question for opener/CD burst and Ayala.

    With 4p t20, Ayala and BS helm:

    What do I do if I get an Ayala procc directly before I wanted to pull my CD rotation (this happens to me very often directly at the pull where Ayala proccs during my charge), would I:

    1a. Cast that execute first, then CS/BC/BS to buff the first MS cast by 4set and have a chance for Ayala to procc again (Ayala -> CS -> BC/BS -> WB -> MS -> ...)
    1b. If I hold, would I "gamble" a tactitian to buff the execute with a CS and hope for a reset (like CS -> Ayala -> WB -> BC/BS -> (hope for tactitian) -> ...)
    2a. Hold Ayala for first CD after Bladestorm to benefit from the helm buff and further improve the following MS with executioners precision and helm (CS -> BC/BS -> Ayala -> WB -> MS -> ...)
    2b. If I hold, would I "gamble" a tactitian to buff the execute with a CS and hope for a reset (like CS -> BC/BS -> WB -> Ayala -> (hope for tactitian) -> ...)

    My gut feeling and common sense says 2a to not take any chances and have everything at max buff possible, even if that means "wasting" potential proccs. But since we all know that gut feeling is mostly worthless, I will ask the experts

    Additionally (i know the compendium is more or less clear about that): even with BS helm I will cast BC before the bladestorm to buff the BS and the 3 MSes rather than pulling BC after the BS to line it up with the max stack helm buff?

    Thank you!

  15. #255
    Deleted
    No mention of Lego Gloves affecting rotation? Would be nice to even say "does not change rotation", I am sure many people are wondering about this.

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by Bebbl89 View Post
    No mention of Lego Gloves affecting rotation? Would be nice to even say "does not change rotation", I am sure many people are wondering about this.
    It's kind of obvious, if the base rotation is using MS on CD already.

  17. #257
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Carmion View Post

    Additionally (i know the compendium is more or less clear about that): even with BS helm I will cast BC before the bladestorm to buff the BS and the 3 MSes rather than pulling BC after the BS to line it up with the max stack helm buff?
    I am interested in this as well!
    Have SD/EP-buffed MS and Execute crits with +24% dmg the potential to outweigh the 3 MS+BS combo. My guess is also that in this scenario the BiS relics would change, favoring ETW over MWF/PS as "fishing" for tactician proccs becomes more important and the actual high dps-phase is after the bladestorm.

  18. #258
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Archimtiros View Post
    It's kind of obvious, if the base rotation is using MS on CD already.
    No, it's not using it on CD. If you have a EP stack, but no SD and no CS then you delay MS and use WW instead to fish for a proc.

    Same for Execute, you use execute until you have 2 EP stacks and SD up to go with MS, so you delay sometimes as well.
    Last edited by mmoc566a9abf7a; 2017-06-28 at 03:20 PM.

  19. #259
    Pit Lord
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Unites States
    Posts
    2,471
    Quote Originally Posted by Bebbl89 View Post
    No, it's not using it on CD. If you have a EP stack, but no SD and no CS then you delay MS and use WW instead to fish for a proc.

    Same for Execute, you use execute until you have 2 EP stacks and SD up to go with MS, so you delay sometimes as well.
    The only time you hold MS is if you have EP stacks in which case you would hold MS until SD is up. You don't delay CS if it proc's, but you don't have to delay MS just because SD isn't up if no EP stacks are present.. The guide not mentioning the rotation changing with gloves implies that nothing changes whether you have them or not.
    | Fractal Design Define R5 White | Intel i7-4790K CPU | Corsair H100i Cooler | 16GB G.Skill Ripsaws X 1600Mhz |
    | MSI Gaming 6G GTX 980ti | Samsung 850 Pro 256GB SSD | Seagate Barracuda 1TB HDD | Seagate Barracuda 3TB HDD |

  20. #260
    Quote Originally Posted by Bebbl89 View Post
    No, it's not using it on CD. If you have a EP stack, but no SD and no CS then you delay MS and use WW instead to fish for a proc.

    Same for Execute, you use execute until you have 2 EP stacks and SD up to go with MS, so you delay sometimes as well.
    Which has nothing to do with rage efficiency.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbiter View Post
    The guide not mentioning the rotation changing with gloves implies that nothing changes whether you have them or not.
    This.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •