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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    You can - only - game with no FPS problems without K series. Actually, I find it rather retarded to suggest overclocking series for someone who - only - games.
    ....

    .......

    .........

    wut?

    that wasn't even proper english.

  2. #42
    Since you got the new cooler, do yourself a favor and get a third party thermal paste as well. Someone in here will have a good recommendation. shouldnt cost more than 10$ and should show a 3-5C differnce in temps over the generic.
    In the mean time, if your case has poor ventilation, you really need to be on top of your cleaning at least once a year. If dust gets into the heatsink of the CPU and bakes in, the heatsink's ability to dissipate heat will drop significantly. Just cleaning the heatsink, you should see a drastic reduction in temps.
    Last edited by teamkiller; 2017-06-20 at 07:32 PM.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    It was. You are just unable to think.
    uh, no.

    Try making sense. Or using english properly. Or just quit being an ignorant troll.

    Pick one.

    User was infracted
    Last edited by noteworthynerd; 2017-06-20 at 11:35 PM.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    You can - only - game with no FPS problems without K series. Actually, I find it rather retarded to suggest overclocking series for someone who - only - games.
    The reason for getting a K processor even if you don't want to overclock is the K CPUs are clocked higher out of the box than the non Ks, which gives a non trivial performance boost in CPU bound games.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by teamkiller View Post
    Since you got the new cooler, do yourself a favor and get a third party thermal paste as well. Someone in here will have a good recommendation. shouldnt cost more than 10$ and should show a 3-5C differnce in temps over the generic.
    In the mean time, if your case has poor ventilation, you really need to be on top of your cleaning at least once a year. If dust gets into the heatsink of the CPU and bakes in, the heatsink's ability to dissipate heat will drop significantly. Just cleaning the heatsink, you should see a drastic reduction in temps.
    Well, the cooler is on the way, but it won't come in til the end of the week. I've read a lot of good things about Arctic Silver thermal paste while researching heatsinks and the 212 installation process, so I'll probably pick some of it up when I decide to build a new computer or if I'm not seeing the temps that I want.
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  6. #46
    Moderator chazus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truhan View Post
    Well, the cooler is on the way, but it won't come in til the end of the week. I've read a lot of good things about Arctic Silver thermal paste while researching heatsinks and the 212 installation process, so I'll probably pick some of it up when I decide to build a new computer or if I'm not seeing the temps that I want.
    Don't bother with it. Arctic Silver is nice, but not nice enough to bother over the standard stuff the 212 comes with. You'll see a difference of a few degrees. Your issue isn't that things are 'too hot' so much as 'theres a problem'
    Gaming: Dual Intel Pentium III Coppermine @ 1400mhz + Blue Orb | Asus CUV266-D | GeForce 2 Ti + ZF700-Cu | 1024mb Crucial PC-133 | Whistler Build 2267
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  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by chazus View Post
    Don't bother with it. Arctic Silver is nice, but not nice enough to bother over the standard stuff the 212 comes with. You'll see a difference of a few degrees. Your issue isn't that things are 'too hot' so much as 'theres a problem'
    If the 212 comes with the Cooler Master IC Essential E1 it's actually ever so slighty better than Arctic Silver 5. If it comes with the Cooler Master IC Value V1 then it's a bit worse than the Arctic Silver. But I agree with your sentiment. People make a big deal out of what paste to use, but really, just use paste. Even from the best liquid metals to the worst stuff available we're talking about a 10C difference. It's not much. I use the Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra myself, but honestly do not feel it was worth itf or maybe 5 degrees cooler when I don't even get close to thermal limits as it is.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Lathais View Post
    If the 212 comes with the Cooler Master IC Essential E1 it's actually ever so slighty better than Arctic Silver 5. If it comes with the Cooler Master IC Value V1 then it's a bit worse than the Arctic Silver. But I agree with your sentiment. People make a big deal out of what paste to use, but really, just use paste. Even from the best liquid metals to the worst stuff available we're talking about a 10C difference. It's not much. I use the Coolaboratory Liquid Ultra myself, but honestly do not feel it was worth itf or maybe 5 degrees cooler when I don't even get close to thermal limits as it is.
    I'm sure that's a big deal to overclockers, but I'm most certainly not doing that on this board/processor.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    0.6 ghz is rather trivial performance boost as you will not notice it with your eyes. Its different when your brain tells you "Benchmarks show better results so it must be better!!!" I am quite sure 60 FPS is same 60 FPS on non K cpus. Not to mention that i7 is often not needed for gaming only.

    - - - Updated - - -



    /sigh if moderators of mmo-champion would have a fairness-deliver hammer, they would swing it to one side only.
    An extra 0.6 GHz on a 3.5 GHz processor is 17% more clock speed. That's not really all that trivial.

  10. #50
    Whelp, I installed it. Time for a postmortem.

    Just about everything I thought COULD go wrong DID go wrong. The directions were completely pictorial with no written instructions. I had to resort to youtube videos to do shit.

    My case has a fractal design, so it should've been easy to do the back mount, right? Wrong. The top screws of the back mount are inside of a part of the case. I spent no insignificant amount of time figuring out I HAD to take the mobo out if I wanted to safely remove the stock back mount. Putting the new back mount in, with its nuts, while the mobo was still in was completely out of the question.

    The mount that connects the cooler to the back mount had a screw stuck. It's hard to explain, but in an effort to make it a one-size-fits-all, the screws can move out or in. For AM3+, all screws must be in their outwardmost position. One of them was completely stuck in the innermost position. I spent probably 20 minutes screwing, unscrewing, and desperately trying to move the screw without damaging the bracket. I did manage it, but still.

    A cable connecting my power supply to the mobo is waaaaaay too short. In its original position, the cord was getting caught in the heatsink's fan. NOT GOOD. I immediately hard shut down my PC, flipped the power supply switch, and spent at least 10 more minutes trying to find a new position where the cord could both reach and not touch the heatsink.

    Finally, the heatsink is way too fucking big. I had to take out one of my side intake fans just to get the side back on.

    The only thing that didn't go wrong was I seem to have to used the right amount of thermal paste. The fact that I'm typing this without 100 degree temps should tell you that, but it's not like I ended up having to wipe and reapply any paste.

    About one hour and forty-five minutes is what it took in total. If I had to make the choice again, I would've gone with the H60. But it's done now. It was much like going to the dentist. It hurt way worse than everyone insisted it would, there was a lot of pushing, pulling, pain, a hell of a lot of sweat, and by the time it was over, my teeth were still fucked up and I still have no girlfriend. I also never want to do it again if I can help it.

    Was it worth it though? Well, my idle temp is now 14 (!!!!!) degrees to about 22. Youtube runs it up to about 21 to 25. To put that into perspective, as I said in another post, my old heatsink had my CPU running anywhere from 55 to 63 idling (occasionally, it'd get as low as 49). I'm tired and have to run tomorrow morning (and I barely slept last night as-is), so I won't be testing any load temps just yet. But those idle temperatures sure as shit seem worth it.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Alright, I lied. I did a VERY quick and dirty load test by simply running Wildstar. Temps are now 25 to 30, but it actually seems to stay at 28 or 29 (which I guess is the fan adjusting its speed to keep the processor at that temperature). The stock heatsink had it hitting 80 nonstop. Speed Fan used to have my CPU usage listed at at least 77% with the stock heatsink. It's now at 40% usage. My CPU is now the coolest component in my case.

    Thanks for your help everybody! I won't call this thread closed yet, though, because I need to do some REAL load testing at some point.
    Last edited by Truhan; 2017-06-23 at 05:12 AM.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  11. #51
    The more times you do it, the easier it gets. You learn what problems to look for and avoid and it gets easier. It is actually fun for me. I'll help friends pick out components, have them ship them to my work and put them together here after hours and not charge my friends because I enjoy it. Sometimes they insist on paying me at least $20-50 since they know if they went to a shop it would have cost closer to $100. If it's a referral from a friend though I almost always charge, $60-80.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Lathais View Post
    The more times you do it, the easier it gets. You learn what problems to look for and avoid and it gets easier. It is actually fun for me. I'll help friends pick out components, have them ship them to my work and put them together here after hours and not charge my friends because I enjoy it. Sometimes they insist on paying me at least $20-50 since they know if they went to a shop it would have cost closer to $100. If it's a referral from a friend though I almost always charge, $60-80.
    Certainly, but it probably also would have been better to start with the heatsink that used the stock mount instead of having to mess with the motherboard. Honestly, I don't blame the 212 for it at all. It's all the fucking case's fault. Seriously, why would you have a fractal design where you CAN'T REACH THE STUFF THE FRACTAL DESIGN IS SUPPOSED TO LET YOU GET TO. Obviously, if I were building from scratch, it would have gone far smoother since I would've only had to put the motherboard in instead of out and then back in (oh, and that required me to unscrew one of my top exhaust fans too). When I have the money to do a new build, first thing I'm getting is that fuckoff huge Corsair case used in the Unicorn build. Their fractal design actually WORKS.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Alright, so I just did a Prime95 stress test. CPU capped out at 39 (!!!) degrees. I'm considering a VERY MODEST overclock because of this (3.6 to 3.8 GHz) using my mobo's built-in overclocking. I'll report back on how that goes soon.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Well, this is annoying. I changed the BIOS settings, but I can't seem to get Prime95 to use more than 3.6 GHz. I guess my built-in overclocking doesn't work, and I'm far from willing to push my luck with manual overclocking. I guess I'll just leave it at that then.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  13. #53
    Pretty much any third party aftermarket cooler - air or water is going to typically require the installation of a custom backplate/retention module. Outside of finding a used stock AMD cooler on EBay or something, you would have had to do the motherboard removal/backplate installation thing anyway.

    The 212 Evo is an excellent cooler, and there's no real reason to spend more on it for any current CPU (possibly the new 10 and 12 core Intel ones are exceptions) unless you're trying to push the absolute thermal limits of overclocking. I think water cooling systems in general are a huge waste of money for 99% of people.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiberria View Post
    Pretty much any third party aftermarket cooler - air or water is going to typically require the installation of a custom backplate/retention module. Outside of finding a used stock AMD cooler on EBay or something, you would have had to do the motherboard removal/backplate installation thing anyway.
    The H60 uses the stock backplate for AMD boards.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  15. #55
    Field Marshal therealslayer's Avatar
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    Just wanted to throw my 2 cents in about the 212 Evo, good cooler, it's what I used in my setup for awhile.
    The only issue I had with it was the fan; 1 was the fan seized up after about 6 months of use and required some maintenance; and 2 the plastic clip that mounts the fan to the heatsink is extremely fragile and will probably break on regular cleaning, but I think they include a spare or two if I remember correctly.

    Other than that, it's a solid cooler that's very widely used for startup builds.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by therealslayer View Post
    Just wanted to throw my 2 cents in about the 212 Evo, good cooler, it's what I used in my setup for awhile.
    The only issue I had with it was the fan; 1 was the fan seized up after about 6 months of use and required some maintenance; and 2 the plastic clip that mounts the fan to the heatsink is extremely fragile and will probably break on regular cleaning, but I think they include a spare or two if I remember correctly.

    Other than that, it's a solid cooler that's very widely used for startup builds.
    Yeah, I've heard the fan is a real piece of crap. Reviews all say that their fan lasted only 2 to 6 months. Which means I'll have to get a Noctua fan soon enough. It'll still be cheaper than the H60 with that added cost though.

    The extra clips included are supposed to be for mounting a second fan for a push/pull setup. No point in adding a push to my heatsink, it's directly below a top exhaust anyways.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  17. #57
    My previous PC build that I just replaced a month ago used a 212 Evo in 24/7 operation for 2.5 years with no issue at all with the fan. I went with a Noctua D15 for my new build, more because the Corsair 540 Air case had plenty of room for it and I wanted slightly quieter fan noise.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiberria View Post
    My previous PC build that I just replaced a month ago used a 212 Evo in 24/7 operation for 2.5 years with no issue at all with the fan. I went with a Noctua D15 for my new build, more because the Corsair 540 Air case had plenty of room for it and I wanted slightly quieter fan noise.
    Sounds more like an example of varying mileage. Almost every review that wasn't "it works" or "cheapest cooler for performance!" that mentioned over a year of use mentioned the fan going out. Most of those reviews give the cooler a 5/5 anyways because of the price and the fact that replacing a fan is ridiculously easy anyways. A quick side note I forgot to mention (speaking of fans), I seriously think the problem may have been my stock heatsink all along. About two days after I said fuck it and ordered the 212 EVO, the stock heatsink started making these horrific grinding sounds. The same sounds the 80mm front intake fan started making before it stopped working. The stock heatsink fan may have just been on its way to hell. The old heatsink is also microscopic compared to the 212.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Another "real world performance" test. Running GW2 with my regular settings was giving me a pretty low FPS (around 30 I guess) before. New heatsink wasn't breaking 35 degrees, so I upped a number of the settings. It's almost completely maxed out with some things off (reflections and shadows, because idgaf about them in an MMO) and I still get 50 FPS with the CPU staying around 35 to 38 degrees. Core Temp shows the load at around 70 to 80% though, so I kinda wish I could overclock to 4 GHz, but what can you do.
    Last edited by Truhan; 2017-06-23 at 11:12 PM.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Truhan View Post
    Sounds more like an example of varying mileage. Almost every review that wasn't "it works" or "cheapest cooler for performance!" that mentioned over a year of use mentioned the fan going out. Most of those reviews give the cooler a 5/5 anyways because of the price and the fact that replacing a fan is ridiculously easy anyways. A quick side note I forgot to mention (speaking of fans), I seriously think the problem may have been my stock heatsink all along. About two days after I said fuck it and ordered the 212 EVO, the stock heatsink started making these horrific grinding sounds. The same sounds the 80mm front intake fan started making before it stopped working. The stock heatsink fan may have just been on its way to hell. The old heatsink is also microscopic compared to the 212.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Another "real world performance" test. Running GW2 with my regular settings was giving me a pretty low FPS (around 30 I guess) before. New heatsink wasn't breaking 35 degrees, so I upped a number of the settings. It's almost completely maxed out with some things off (reflections and shadows, because idgaf about them in an MMO) and I still get 50 FPS with the CPU staying around 35 to 38 degrees. Core Temp shows the load at around 70 to 80% though, so I kinda wish I could overclock to 4 GHz, but what can you do.
    Definitely varying milage. I have had my 212+ for almost 4 years now and it's still going strong. The only pain was the initial installation which was the same with my previous setup. You will get better at planning and doing the installation each time. It's a really large cooler so that always makes it a pain but it's a brilliant performer.

  20. #60
    Just had another Wildstar performance check. I went to an area with high particle effects that, without fail, caused my computer to shut down with the stock fan. With a livestream running in a browser tab, staring directly at the particle effects only used about 60% load and the CPU never broke 35 degrees. The game is very poorly optimized though, I still get wonky FPS. I just wish I'd bought and installed the cooler sooner.
    Girls are a hoax created by the Japanese anime industry to scam otaku out of their money.

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