UK general election 2017

[Deleted]

Nope, not in 16 months, that is nov 2018. When is Great Repeal Bill on schedule; it should be a breaking point in the process, no ?

in practice, the EU will need 6 months to ratify any deal, so the negotiations have to be done by then, and once they get a deal, that's it - at that point the EU wont let them untrigger art 50.

[dribbles]

in practice, the EU will need 6 months to ratify any deal, so the negotiations have to be done by then, and once they get a deal, that's it - at that point the EU wont let them untrigger art 50.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Months you say? More like decades. Look at Ceta the only comparable example. Almost a decade a go, little Canada with an economy half the size of the UK and thousands of miles away from Europe in their dreams thought it might be a good idea to try for a trade agreement with the EU. Oh how I bet they wished they hadn't bothered.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...s-party-u-turn

Most of the people who instigated this folly in Canada with the EU, though quite reasonable intelligent people in the beginning, have either died or retired waiting for ratification.

There will never be any Brexit deal with the EU, just fine by me and the vast majority of the UK population. Hard Brexit? Thanks very much, bring it on.

[Deleted]

Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Months you say? More like decades. Look at Ceta the only comparable example. Almost a decade a go, little Canada with an economy half the size of the UK and thousands of miles away from Europe in their dreams thought it might be a good idea to try for a trade agreement with the EU. Oh how I bet they wished they hadn't bothered.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...s-party-u-turn

Most of the people who instigated this folly in Canada with the EU, though quite reasonable intelligent people in the beginning, have either died or retired waiting for ratification.

There will never be any Brexit deal with the EU, just fine by me and the vast majority of the UK population. Hard Brexit? Thanks very much, bring it on.

Except it's a retard move by Pedro Sánchez to regain some of the old PSOE voters from Podemos and wont change anything because the PSOE abstained. The treaty was approved yesterday by the Spanish parliament.

Meanwhile, Pedro Sánchez now has to defend his position from the other PSOE leaders.

[Kallisto]

Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Months you say? More like decades. Look at Ceta the only comparable example. Almost a decade a go, little Canada with an economy half the size of the UK and thousands of miles away from Europe in their dreams thought it might be a good idea to try for a trade agreement with the EU. Oh how I bet they wished they hadn't bothered.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...s-party-u-turn

Most of the people who instigated this folly in Canada with the EU, though quite reasonable intelligent people in the beginning, have either died or retired waiting for ratification.

There will never be any Brexit deal with the EU, just fine by me and the vast majority of the UK population. Hard Brexit? Thanks very much, bring it on.

Express again. Do you have any sources that isn't far right nationalist bullshit?

[Mayhem]

Hard Brexit? Thanks very much, bring it on.

Somehow your strong and stable government seems to disagree with you/the vast majority of the UK population, funny that.

[ranzino]

Somehow your strong and stable government seems to disagree with you/the vast majority of the UK population, funny that.

but, but those 52 % were august prophets. how dare you to question them ?

[dribbles]

Express again. Do you have any sources that isn't far right nationalist bullshit?

Presumably you are a citizen of the EU and from what you say are not a far right nationalist bullshitter. You should be as good a source as any. Enlighten us then citizen, which part of that express article is fake news? Has CETA taken almost a decade to negotiate and yet is still not agreed? Yes or no?

Believe me Buck Rogers in the 25th Century stands more chance of seeing an EU/UK agreement re Brexit than you or I. Wonderful, just let the sands of time countdown and give the people their so desired hard brexit. Isn't democracy beautiful?

[Noradin]

But you could cut wages, it would just be terribly unpopular?
Which is really the problem, Inflation makes people's wages decrease in real terms, but most people won't notice.

And that is the real crux of the problem and why politicans always rail against austerity:
Austerity means politicans have to take responsibility for unpopular decisions, inflation means they can pretend there was nothing they could do.

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Again that's not how it works. Whether they are now competitive or not is irrelevant. It is a self-reinforcing debt liquidation cycle that requires reflation to end. We've had these things in the past, the great depression being the most prominent example. Heck, the reason we had all the stimulus post 2008 was because the powers that be were trying to circumvent another such global deflationary event. We know how they work, we know the drivers, we know how to get out of them. I'm not sure why you are arguing this.

And stimulus will happen--after Greece made the necessary reforms for that stimulus to do anything for anyone but corrupt politicans trying to buy some more votes with handouts.
Greece is a sovereign nation, there is literallynothing to force them to reform but to keep the debt pressing but survivable.
And yes, the current situation is sustainable, Germany could pay just enough money to keep Greek citizens from starving for however long it takes for them to find some politicans willing to solve their underlying problems.

[Mittens]

I would've never imagined leftists defend austerity. This truly is the weirdest timeline. As a sidenote: I'm unsure why the EU doesn't cut Greece's debt, it should be by now obvious that unless they do that, Greece is fucked. Even the IMF agrees and that is saying something.

[Noradin]

I would've never imagined leftists defend austerity. This truly is the weirdest timeline. As a sidenote: I'm unsure why the EU doesn't cut Greece's debt, it should be by now obvious that unless they do that, Greece is fucked. Even the IMF agrees and that is saying something.

Simple, as soon as they cut the dept the politicans in sovereign Greece will turn around and proceed just as they did in the past, publicly proclaiming how they alone saved the country by beating those evil Germans. Ten years later, when the US export their next financuial crisis we would be at it yet again with the only difference being that Greece will be even more fucked up.

[Mittens]

Simple, as soon as they cut the dept the politicans in sovereign Greece will turn around and proceed just as they did in the past, publicly proclaiming how they alone saved the country by beating those evil Germans. Ten years later, when the US export their next financuial crisis we would be at it yet again with the only difference being that Greece will be even more fucked up.

Greece's situation has already far surpasses whatever moral/incentive concerns you might have. Their debt situation is unsustainable and they have stupidly high ubemployment. And their debt deters whatever investment they might have, so no chance on recovery.

[Mayhem]

Greece's situation has already far surpasses whatever moral/incentive concerns you might have. Their debt situation is unsustainable and they have stupidly high ubemployment. And their debt deters whatever investment they might have, so no chance on recovery.

And it's in greeces hand to do the much needed reforms before anyone will forgive them any debt because simply forgiving the debt would send the wrongest of all signals not only for greece but every other EU member.

[Noradin]

Greece's situation has already far surpasses whatever moral/incentive concerns you might have. Their debt situation is unsustainable and they have stupidly high ubemployment. And their debt deters whatever investment they might have, so no chance on recovery.

It has proven perfectly sustainable for the EU.
I do not, however, see enough reforms from their politicans to drop the preassure, yet.
We have nothing but those debts to incentive their politicans and we do not want to wait for them to crash in the next crisis to get some more incentives--mainly because we do not want them to have another crisis if we can help it.
Maybe you didn't notice, but most people in the EU are against making others starve.
That is why we give money to Greece instead of kicking them out, letting them crash and burn and have inflation kill off all the elderly and everyone without a job by starvation. That would certaily "solve" their problems for another two or three generations of politicans.

[Deleted]

Ha ha ha ha ha ha. Months you say?

Presumably you are a citizen of the EU and from what you say are not a far right nationalist bullshitter. You should be as good a source as any. Enlighten us then citizen, which part of that express article is fake news? Has CETA taken almost a decade to negotiate and yet is still not agreed? Yes or no?

You are conflating things, CETA has not taken a decade to approve, it took that to negotiate.

Believe me Buck Rogers in the 25th Century stands more chance of seeing an EU/UK agreement re Brexit than you or I. Wonderful, just let the sands of time countdown and give the people their so desired hard brexit. Isn't democracy beautiful?

A no deal scenario would knock off 3-4% of the UK GDP, and then tack on the numerous secondary problems -
The EU would have a drop in the 0.5-1 range - and virtually no secondary problems (as a whole).
Go for no deal if you like.
personally I think the impossibility of reaching a deal, the inability of UK politicians to own up to the mess they created will lead to a long term "Temporary" EEA membership for the UK.

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I would've never imagined leftists defend austerity.

Not all leftists believe there is an ever growing money tree, some are trying to be what is know as 'electable'.

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Greece's situation has already far surpasses whatever moral/incentive concerns you might have. .

But not what the EU has - For better or worse, Greece was made an example of, (because monetarily, the EU could have written the money of as lost with no issue) because it was necessary to have something to point to when the Spaniards and the Italians started complaining.
This has never been about money - Total Greek debt is 220 Billion Euros or something - EU GDP is 17 TRILLION.'

[Mittens]

You are conflating things, CETA has not taken a decade to approve, it took that to negotiate.


A no deal scenario would knock off 3-4% of the UK GDP, and then tack on the numerous secondary problems -
The EU would have a drop in the 0.5-1 range - and virtually no secondary problems (as a whole).
Go for no deal if you like.
personally I think the impossibility of reaching a deal, the inability of UK politicians to own up to the mess they created will lead to a long term "Temporary" EEA membership for the UK.

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Not all leftists believe there is an ever growing money tree, some are trying to be what is know as 'electable'.

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But not what the EU has - For better or worse, Greece was made an example of, (because monetarily, the EU could have written the money of as lost with no issue) because it was necessary to have something to point to when the Spaniards and the Italians started complaining.
This has never been about money - Total Greek debt is 220 Billion Euros or something - EU GDP is 17 TRILLION.'

Well at least I know the reasons to keep Greek poor are not rooted in economics.

[Deleted]

Well at least I know the reasons to keep Greek poor are not rooted in economics.

the Greeks are poor because they have a poorly functioning economy, judiciary and political system.
The problem for Greece is as long as one is in a free trade area with northern Europe, and shares its currency, one cannot have worse social systems in the aggregate then northern Europe, and the same living standard.
In Greece there are about 400 lawyers per 100 000 if memory serves me right - In northern Europe its in the 100 range - Correspondingly enforcement of a contract is usually faster in the north, rather than the south - For some strange reason, about 4 times as long on average - Wonder why.

[Mittens]

the Greeks are poor because they have a poorly functioning economy, judiciary and political system.
The problem for Greece is as long as one is in a free trade area with northern Europe, and shares its currency, one cannot have worse social systems in the aggregate then northern Europe, and the same living standard.
In Greece there are about 400 lawyers per 100 000 if memory serves me right - In northern Europe its in the 100 range - Correspondingly enforcement of a contract is usually faster in the north, rather than the south - For some strange reason, about 4 times as long on average - Wonder why.

Cutting debt has nothing to do with ramping up public spending.

[ati87]

Hard Brexit? Thanks very much, bring it on.

Given the constant never ending fraud cases that the City of London seems to encouraging I think it's for everybody best if you lot just gtfo

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40199259

[Deleted]

Cutting debt has nothing to do with ramping up public spending.

Well the greek state can spends as much money as the greek economy can support, no more.

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Given the constant never ending fraud cases that the City of London seems to encouraging I think it's for everybody best if you lot just gtfo

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-40199259

Yeah i don't think the City is going to like the post-brexit regulatory regime - It's bound to be more stringent.
(and before some Brexiteers show up and say that's a good thing, Remmber that tower that burned, with no sprinklers, and only one staircase, who cares about such pesky regulatory safety concerns)

[Mittens]

Well the greek state can spends as much money as the greek economy can support, no more.

I insist, the purpose of cutting debt is so that there aren't fears of not being able to pay interest, has funding to start necessary reform and attract investors.

The situation there is unsustainable and as you have pointed out the EU is politically motivated to make sure the situation remains like that.