How Americans afford college?

[Deleted]

I don't think you guys understand. I don't hate military, I'm actually pro-military. I don't call all of them mercenaries.
But when you go there, for the most part only because they pay for your education, you're technically a mercenary. You're getting paid for serving. I wouldn't call you a mercenary if you went there because you're a patriot or whatever.

Ah ok ok. I would only consider it like that if the person joined simply to get a chance to kill somebody. And honestly the benefits that you get for joining is what keeps our military in such great shape. If there weren't benefits, nobody would join, which would lead back to having a draft, which when people are forced to do something they don't want, they don't tend to do it well.

Either way it is a very good trade-off for not having debt after you graduate college. It's up to the person in the end, either take out a loan and spend 10 years paying it back, or put your life on hold for 4 years and finish w/o a debt to your name. There is a lot of pressure to get your life started very fast as an american though, but that's a culture thing and not part of this topic really.

[Fencers]

Loans, scholarships, family assistance and/or trust funds.

[Theinquisition]

You don't like that word? Too bad for you, because fighting for money means you're a mercenary.

That word doesn't mean what you think it means

[Deleted]

Join the military. Super easy way to get your schooling and housing paid for.

Easy is a terrible way to put it.

The military is a job, a highly stressful job, and a job that you work for as many hours as your unit requires (there's no limit to how much you will have to work). Let's not forget the 1 week to 1 month field exercises that you'll have to do on a regular basis (you're not going to get to do your classes in the field)... Oh, and the 6 month to 18 month long deployments you will have to endure.

And let's face it, kiddos, the military ain't no four hour a day part time job. You're going to be busting your ass off every day that you're in it, and when you finally get back to the barracks (or home if you have a family), you're going to be exhausted. It's going to be extremely difficult to get any college work done. Is it possible? Sure. Can you get a bachelors degree in four years while you're in? 99% chance you will not. It'll more than likely take you up to 8 years before you earn your degree (meaning you have to reenlist).

Maybe someone might plan to use their GI bill and start college once they get out after four years. That's possible. But you will more than likely be 22, and you'll basically be four years behind the rest of your peers. Not a very good look, and if you so happen to start a family while you're in, it's highly irresponsible. Either way you're still going to have to work and earn money to survive, or try to leech off of mommy and daddy some more.

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You don't like that word? Too bad for you, because fighting for money means you're a mercenary.

Ah huh. I guess that means every soldier ever was a mercenary. K.

[Deletedaccount1]

I'm just waiting for someone to file a US federal racial discrimination lawsuit that will force employers to not ask if you have a college degree.

In general, employers cannot ask for something that (1) shows statistical differences between racial groups, and (2) is not directly needed for the job. Arguably most undergrad degrees do not represent job-specific skills.

Should such a lawsuit go through, employers will stop asking for degrees, and start asking for specific skills. Traditional college degrees will become near worthless, replaced by portfolios of training in much more specific areas.

The day this happens, the higher education system in the US will begin to collapse.

There is a statistical difference in occupational skills between races. Also not asking for a college degree and instead on other qualifications just punishes people who went to college since no one coming out of one is going to have any experience. The BA is a poor form of vocational training but passing a law pretending that it doesn't exist by masquerading it as a racist institution is just asinine.

[Osmeric]

There is a statistical difference in occupational skills between races.

Yes, but specific skills that are needed for a job can be asked for, even if there is a racial disparity.

[Deletedaccount1]

Yes, but specific skills that are needed for a job can be asked for, even if there is a racial disparity.

Why is race the factor you consider important when you are only willing to apply it to the BA? There are obviously plenty of jobs where a college degree would make you a better employee than someone without one just for the simple fact that college graduates tend to be smarter on average than high school ones.

[Osmeric]

Why is race the factor you consider important when you are only willing to apply it to the BA? There are obviously plenty of jobs where a college degree would make you a better employee than someone without one just for the simple fact that college graduates tend to be smarter on average than high school ones.

Because that's how I understand US law is written.

[Deletedaccount1]

Because that's how I understand US law is written.

What? It is an awful idea to create a sweeping law that employers can't ask if you have a college degree. It would cripple the workforce and the educational system and the justification you give for it is a masquerade as you are willing to admit.

That is not how US law is written. This would definitely go to the Supreme Court (if it even made it that far) and they would almost certainly not pass it because a statistical difference between races doesn't make something legally discriminatory and it is impossible for the government to oversee when a college degree is needed and not needed for a given job.

[Osmeric]

What? It is an awful idea to create a sweeping law that employers can't ask if you have a college degree. It would cripple the workforce and the educational system and the justification you give for it is a masquerade as you are willing to admit.

That is not how US law is written. This would definitely go to the Supreme Court (if it even made it that far) and they would almost certainly not pass it because a statistical difference between races doesn't make something legally discriminatory and it is impossible for the government to oversee when a college degree is needed and not needed for a given job.

It is my understanding that employers cannot use a criterion that is racially discriminatory unless they can show a direct connection to job requirements. Simply being correlated with job performance is not legal, as I understand it. This is to prevent proxy attrbutes from being used to create covert racial discrimination.

[Spectral]

It is my understanding that employers cannot use a criterion that is racially discriminatory unless they can show a direct connection to job requirements. Simply being correlated with job performance is not legal, as I understand it. This is to prevent proxy attrbutes from being used to create covert racial discrimination.

You're correct; this was ruled in Griggs v. Duke Power. It's a batshit insane decision, but SCOTUS has a lot of batshit insane decisions in the Warren and post-Warren era.

Hilariously, it turns out to be perfectly legal to discriminate against people with high IQs.

[Rasulis]

The cost of higher education can vary quite a bit in the US.

If you are a CA residence and your family makes less than 80k, and you get accepted into the University of California system, you don’t have to pay any tuition fee. Getting in should not be a problem. UC Berkeley and UCLA are the hardest to get in with 1 in 6 acceptance rate. Although for CA residence UC Berkeley acceptance rate jumped up to almost 70%. You are competing with the upper 1/6th of the US high school graduates.

Cost of living, if you are not living with your parents, can be an issue. College towns tend to be expensive. Still, you can do like my daughter. She shared a one bedroom apartment in Berkeley with 3 other girls. Three girls in the bedroom (bunk bed) and the other one in the living room with a foldaway sofa bed. Not a good option if you are antisocial. Like she said, bathroom time in the morning can be tight.

You also have all the various military academies which are free. Contrary to popular belief, just because you went to a military academy, it does not mean that you have to serve combat duty. The military is not going to risk losing a computer analyst that they spent four years training in combat duty. I have nieces/nephews, and also friends of my children that graduated from military academies. Not one of them ever had to use their firearms outside of the firing range.

My sister received her MD from Loma Linda University (a Seventh-day Adventist school). After graduation, she did 3 years of missionary work, and when she came back, they wiped out her student debt. Those 3 years also count toward her residency requirement.

In summary, higher education in the US is expensive, but there are ways to make it cheaper.

[vindicatorx]

In other countries students get government loans to pay all over their college and living costs ... so those students don't pay up front and can go to college ... in America , how does this work ? Do you also get loans or do your parents have to pay ? What anout the really elite colleges like Harvard ? Can a poor person go there if they're smart, or can't they afford it?

They have these funny things called grants and scholarships. Yes, poor people can go to Harvard more easily than middle class people can. My cousin went to an expensive private college for free due to his mother being classified as low income. He got grants and scholarships to pay for his housing and other expenses while I had to take out student loans and work to pay for mine.

[mizeri]

be very very smart or be very very rich for the ivy league schools, for the rest you can get federal loans, some do it through military service, some take federal loans then dont pay them off, i think some loans gets forgiven after so many years of paying into them.

[Raunchy]

Although going to a big fancy school for 50k a year is easier to get a degree im takin the long road through distance learning through a community college, although i dont get all the bendits of being handed the chance of graduate school from merely going to a 4 year school i get to stay away from all those coddled bubbled 20somethings, i actually get some real world perspective

[Rasulis]

Both my wife and I have very strong feelings about student loan. We both think that it is atrocious for a new graduate to be saddled with mortgage size debt. We made sure that our children graduated debt free. I doubt my daughter would have had the nerve to quit her job after only one year and started her own business if she had to worry about repaying a 20 – 30k debt.

[Zephyr Storm]

You had a decent situation then going into it. Not everyone is capable of living at home if they end up going to school for several reasons. I imagine you had at most a 40/hr a week job, if that, as well. A lot of the poorest people are working 60 hours+ to help their families as soon as they're able to work or if they get kicked out of their home, they're trying to afford to live on their own or with roommates. That's typically what can make starting your academic career difficult.

I started planning for all of that when I was a freshman in high school. Most people could pull it off the same way I did if they started then as well. The problem is, most people don't even start caring until it's too late. And then it's no one's fault but their own.

[Jeezy911]

Step 1 get a Federal Loan
Step 2 "finish a degree in something useful" This is where people get wrecked, not finishing means you still have to pay the loan back and gender studies is not in high demand in the job market.

Step 3 give the loan company their 10 dollars per month for the rest of your life after you defer it for 10 years.

Well that's my story anyway. A better option is to join the service and sign up for the GI bill and suck it up for 4 years then reap the benefits.

[Zython]

Easy. They don't.

[Logwyn]

Well here's the thing about these Ivy League schools. They are private which means they can do whatever the hell they want.

Only if they don't want any federal money.