What can be done about self segregation in the US education system?

[Zoranon]

I actually do think it's important why their behavior is so awful.

To me a big part of the solution is to improve the social supports low income families receive. These kids have so many problems outside of school that the idea of them being successful in school is silly.

Well yes and no, but that is a question for social services and has absolutely nothing to do with school funding.

[Endus]

Ok enough of this crap. Your claim that bad schools are bad partly because they have much less money is nonsense. It is pure ignorance to claim so. The reason the schools are bad is because the students in them behave awfully and it is not really important why. Bad schools cannot be fixed by taking money from good schools as you proposed.

This a ridiculous assertion that plenty of hard evidence directly contradicts;
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/...14218100900108
https://muse.jhu.edu/article/222871/summary
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3090259?...n_tab_contents
https://www.researchgate.net/profile...ool-matter.pdf

Worse, it isn't even internally consistent. If the money doesn't matter, why should it matter that it's taken away from the "good schools"?

Oh and after you have calmed down, try to read my previous post again and actually come with an intelligent reply.

To what? You blatantly misrepresented my views in a deliberately insulting manner, you made oddly racist arguments against minority students, and then attacked "ghetto culture", as if socioeconomic status wasn't a fundamentally major component of cultural groups.\

There's nothing in that mess that requires an "intelligent reply", because it's nonsense.

[Zoranon]

This a ridiculous assertion that plenty of hard evidence directly contradicts;
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/...14218100900108
https://muse.jhu.edu/article/222871/summary
http://www.jstor.org/stable/3090259?...n_tab_contents
https://www.researchgate.net/profile...ool-matter.pdf

Worse, it isn't even internally consistent. If the money doesn't matter, why should it matter that it's taken away from the "good schools"?



To what? You blatantly misrepresented my views in a deliberately insulting manner, you made oddly racist arguments against minority students, and then attacked "ghetto culture", as if socioeconomic status wasn't a fundamentally major component of cultural groups.\

There's nothing in that mess that requires an "intelligent reply", because it's nonsense.

I wonder why I ever expected you to discuss anything in good faith. In this case it indeed was optimism to the point of foolishness.

And stop lying I never said there is no correlation between school funding and achievement, I said you cannot fix terrible schools by throwing money at them.

Yeah yeah everybody who does not agree with your extreme left views is a racist. You progressives are so depressingly predictable.

[Sorrior]

Wait . . . there ARE schools like that?

Yeah went to one for a bit in Alaska and it was WEIRD a friend who was in California for ages considered it normal..I consider it sick and twisted

[Tiwack]

I never said there is no correlation between school funding and achievement, I said you cannot fix terrible schools by throwing money at them.

English. Do you speak it motherfucker?

(Infracted) - Minor Flaming

[Deleted]

Don't do anything, let them segregate and undo everything that Civil Rights fought for.

The irony is incredible.

[Slybak]

Yeah yeah everybody who does not agree with your extreme left views is a racist. You progressives are so depressingly predictable.

Czech Republic, Euro-Atlantic civilisation

[fatgunn]

Yeah went to one for a bit in Alaska and it was WEIRD a friend who was in California for ages considered it normal..I consider it sick and twisted

I was on the quiz team in high school. Our school was average for our region so we would sometimes go to these other schools and be amazed at all the fancy tech stuff they got to have and it made us feel pretty envious. But then the next week we'd invariably end up at some school with metal detectors and graffiti on the halls, broken lockers and the like. It was clear that noone there cared for the condition of the place. It made us real grateful our school was at least ok.

[Rennadrel]

I actually do think it's important why their behavior is so awful.

To me a big part of the solution is to improve the social supports low income families receive. These kids have so many problems outside of school that the idea of them being successful in school is silly.

- - - Updated - - -



The whole point here is no one does that. It's socioeconomic.

The schools try to integrate and the minorities are lower income and underprepared, so they bring down the white and asian students who are higher income and whose parents have prepared them for school. So the white and asian parents get frustrated and move to a district that has a better school, mostly because it doesn't include the low income minorities.

The segregation is a byproduct of parents working very hard to get their students a better education. Moving to the better districts is expensive. Preparing your student for class with a lot of one on one time outside of school is hard.

It's more of an issue of anyone can get into a university because of student loans. So long as you have decent grades, it doesn't matter how much your parents make if you are going into debt for several years after graduating in order to pay for the education.

[dextersmith]

Educating and including them didn't work. Abolishing black history month would raise hell. Many of those who shout racism desperately cling to segregation, ghetto culture and identity because they revel in it. Playing the victim gives you free stuff, opportunities you don't have to work for (affirmative action), and attention via something to complain about.

Every minority has had minority issues but no one else wanted safe spaces or exclusive schools. Even when you weren't there, they tell you it's your fault. When was the last time you heard someone tout You trippin' boi! I'm more Aztec than you'll ever be!

[Deleted]

The issue is that the quality of the students is so bad at a lot of schools that you're never going to get a good education if you go there, regardless of how much money they sink into them, because even advanced students are going to be grouped with students who are very low achieving at least until high school.

My district is relatively poor and diverse but the schools have a lot of money from corporations located in town. We spend over 15k per student, which is a lot of money. There are a lot of support systems, particularly in math where the district really wants to get scores up because they end up on statewide reports. Students who fall behind on math are required to take a second math as an elective in eighth grade and during freshman year in an attempt to get them caught up. Students who are still behind are then shuffled into SAT prep classes and "Advanced Algebra" classes where the entire focus is on getting them ready for the SAT.

Even so, less than 10% of African Americans who graduate meet the "college ready" benchmark on the SAT (and a lot don't graduate). For white students the number is 50%.

If you're a parent sending your kids to a school in our district, you will get a substantially worse education than you will get in the town next door, where spending per student is basically the same, there are not even enough African Americans to report statistics on, and over 85% of students meet the "college ready" benchmark. The course material is far more advanced and the teachers have to spend a lot less time dealing with behavior issues and students who are miles behind the rest of the class on the material.

If the schools segregated kids by level of accomplishment, the higher achieving kids wouldn't be as penalized for going to school in the poorer districts and they might stay. And then the existence of these higher level classes would give the students from traditionally underperforming groups access to the high level classes if they work hard, so they could potentially get a good education themselves.

This is why I think the Grammar Schools system that we had in the UK is probably the best education system we had. Kids are given an exam at 11, if they pass, they are sent to the grammar school, where the focus is on academic studies, if they fail they go to regular secondary school, where there is still the possibility to go to higher education, but there is a greater focus on trade skills and the like.

Ofcourse there is the potential for it reinforcing class divides (which is why the practice was cut back drastically in the UK, wrongly imo) but as things stand at the moment, kids are being dragged down by the lowest common denominators, instead of being allowed to push ahead.

The idea that potential should be curtailed so that other people can feel equal is absurd in the extreme.

[Theinquisition]

Wait . . . there ARE schools like that?

Sure.

When i was a young teen, i lived in downtown baltimore.

The schools looked very much like this, and if you were white, it was hell on earth.

[Venant]

I wonder why I ever expected you to discuss anything in good faith. In this case it indeed was optimism to the point of foolishness.

And stop lying I never said there is no correlation between school funding and achievement, I said you cannot fix terrible schools by throwing money at them.

Yeah yeah everybody who does not agree with your extreme left views is a racist. You progressives are so depressingly predictable.

I believe that I can disprove you by simply pointing out the stunning success of the welfare system in the United States. Clearly all you need to do is pump more money/resources/government into the problem to make everything better.

It's like having an airplane that has had its wings fall off, all you need to do is add more jet fuel to get it to fly.

[Alexeht]

Would you want to send your kids to a public school when it looks like this?



There is a reason at least here in Florida where most parents who live in cities send their kids to private schools. At least that's what my school was like back in 2007 but hey we had police officers and metal detectors to keep us somewhat safe. Friend of mine told me his school had a swat team on the last day of school as the last day is where people are the most violent.

This explain everything. If someone would resolve problem of public schools like that, no one would need to make private schools. But I admit it is quite discriminatory if this private school is only white because they refuse to take anyone else, but I think it is more of a money problem than colour.

[Venant]

The schools looked very much like this, and if you were white, it was hell on earth.

I think we all know from CNN that white people suffering is a myth... though it must be nice having that white privilege pass to get by all the cops who spend all their time hunting black people like they are on safari.

[Alexeht]

Sure.

When i was a young teen, i lived in downtown baltimore.

The schools looked very much like this, and if you were white, it was hell on earth.

Just horrible. And some idiots are saying that only white people can be racist ...

[Zandalarian Paladin]

First the afro-american society detached themselves from the crowd and formed their own community. Now, Caucasian-Americans are doing the same.

MLK is rolling in his tomb.

[Alexeht]

I think we all know from CNN that white people suffering is a myth... though it must be nice having that white privilege pass to get by all the cops who spend all their time hunting black people like they are on safari.

White privilege is also a myth. I'm white european, and I do not have any advantage.

[Endus]

I wonder why I ever expected you to discuss anything in good faith. In this case it indeed was optimism to the point of foolishness.

Right, me linking you to multiple reputable academic sources that refute your claim is somehow not "in good faith", especially when you have provided nothing to back up your assertions.

And stop lying I never said there is no correlation between school funding and achievement, I said you cannot fix terrible schools by throwing money at them.

Either school funding helps, or it doesn't. The above sentence contradicts itself. If school funding does correlate to student achievement, then it is a tool for fixing what you call "terrible schools". So either you are denying there's such a correlation (in which case, see above links to academic studies), or you're not, and you're admitting that your conclusion is baseless and wrong.

Yeah yeah everybody who does not agree with your extreme left views is a racist. You progressives are so depressingly predictable.

You cast aspersions on minority students and "ghetto culture". Those are integrally prejudicial in nature, particularly if you're refusing to acknowledge socioeconomic factors.

[shimerra]

I think we all know from CNN that white people suffering is a myth... though it must be nice having that white privilege pass to get by all the cops who spend all their time hunting black people like they are on safari.

You heard it here folks. Someone was racist to a white person so Any and all evidence of racial discrimination towards minorities is disproven!

White privilege is also a myth. I'm white european, and I do not have any advantage.

Sweeden. Study was done where 10,000 job applications were submitted some with traditional Swedish names others with "Muslim" names. Every single other item was identical. Traditional names got call back 50-60% rates higher than their identical Muslim counterparts. The same holds for blacks and most minoritoes in America with asians getting a bump in tech indiestroes.


But no you're right no one looks down at non-euro ethnicities