What can be done about self segregation in the US education system?

[Endus]

I believe that I can disprove you by simply pointing out the stunning success of the welfare system in the United States. Clearly all you need to do is pump more money/resources/government into the problem to make everything better.

It's like having an airplane that has had its wings fall off, all you need to do is add more jet fuel to get it to fly.

The welfare system in the USA is not meant to reduce poverty, or even eliminate it. It's meant to minimize the hardship those in poverty suffer, not help them get out of poverty.

[Alexeht]

First the afro-american society detached themselves from the crowd and formed their own community. Now, Caucasian-Americans are doing the same.

MLK is rolling in his tomb.

Well saying to blacks to not detach themselves from others would be racist right? But when white people unite then that is racist! Well this is what happens if they listen only to one side (like BLM) while silencing people that would like to unite, rather than divide (just like BLM does, and lately also ANTIFA).

[Venant]

The welfare system in the USA is not meant to reduce poverty, or even eliminate it. It's meant to minimize the hardship those in poverty suffer, not help them get out of poverty.

Sounds like a perpetual misery machine, something of diabolic design masquerading as kindness.

[Alexeht]

Sweeden. Study was done where 10,000 job applications were submitted some with traditional Swedish names others with "Muslim" names. Every single other item was identical. Traditional names got call back 50-60% rates higher than their identical Muslim counterparts. The same holds for blacks and most minoritoes in America with asians getting a bump in tech indiestroes.


But no you're right no one looks down at non-euro ethnicities

Source? Besides names have little or none to do with race. Also I could say similar thing with applying for job in UK since my last name isn't British.

[Theinquisition]

As far as colleges go, if they actually give in to minority student groups and start segregating dorms by race, they should lose federal funding (if they receive any).

As far as fixing our k-12, well that's a bigger challenge.

Here's a list of things i would do.

1. Eliminate property tax in favor of a .5% state wide sales tax that would be used to fund schools state wide.

2. Set a minimum state budget for education, if the sales tax fails to generate the required income, make up for the shortfall by a addition to the state income tax on a yearly basis.

3. Redraw districts using a non bias, geometrical symmetric system (city blocks).

Many school districts are drawn oddly due to a number of reasons.

4. Set a statewide universal income for teachers that scales with seniority, make it competitive with other occupations with 4 year degrees.

5. Disband teachers unions.

They protect shitty teachers and make it damn near impossible to fire bad ones.

6. Yearly teacher evaluations that focus on observing teachers in the classroom and measure knowledge retention and communication skills. If they fail they get a probation period to fix it and if they don't they get fired.

7. Zero tolerance policy for drugs, and violence committed outside of self defense.

You bully someone, your out.


Thats just a very simple list.

[Travis B]

As far as colleges go, if they actually give in to minority student groups and start segregating dorms by race, they should lose federal funding (if they receive any).

As far as fixing our k-12, well that's a bigger challenge.

Here's a list of things i would do.

1. Eliminate property tax in favor of a .5% state wide sales tax that would be used to fund schools state wide.

2. Set a minimum state budget for education, if the sales tax fails to generate the required income, make up for the shortfall by a addition to the state income tax on a yearly basis.

3. Redraw districts using a non bias, geometrical symmetric system (city blocks).

Many school districts are drawn oddly due to a number of reasons.

4. Set a statewide universal income for teachers that scales with seniority, make it competitive with other occupations with 4 year degrees.

5. Disband teachers unions.

They protect shitty teachers and make it damn near impossible to fire bad ones.

6. Yearly teacher evaluations that focus on observing teachers in the classroom and measure knowledge retention and communication skills. If they fail they get a probation period to fix it and if they don't they get fired.

7. Zero tolerance policy for drugs, and violence committed outside of self defense.

You bully someone, your out.


Thats just a very simple list.

Have you ever considered running for political office?

[Astalnar]

Been tried with forced bussing before, but people just seem to naturally gravitate to live with other people like them. I am afraid the school would soon become a battleground. There is a reason ghetto schools are now build by the same companies that build prisons and on disturbingly similar blueprints.

You were saying?

On a more serious note, it's not the money that is the problem. It's the kids. Here is the report, if you don't want to read the whole thing, just read the summary at the page 1, and postscript at page 27.
https://object.cato.org/sites/cato.o...pdf/pa-298.pdf

[Deleted]

Step 1: School boards should be composed of professionals, not elected officials. Their purpose should be administrative, and forming a new board should only happen if the administrative needs suggest it's needed, not because some people want one.

Step 2: Pool public school funding across the municipality/region, distribute to schools based on student body size. A school of 500 students serving a poor inner city neighbourhood should get exactly the same funding as the 500 student school in the wealthiest suburb in the city.
Step 2A: Donations to the school would be added to that pool, not kept by the individual school.

Step 3: Work to homogenize curriculum standards as broadly as possible. At the State level, bare minimum, ideally at the national level. Some regional variations should be allowed with some flexibility in the optional sections; schools in Spanish-heavy areas may offer more Spanish education than a school elsewhere (which would replace that with other language training, as regionally appropriate or based on available teachers). And before anyone goes nuts, "curriculum standards" are bare minimum standards; teachers would be expected to be exceeding these, not just meeting. Said curriculum standards would apply to private schools as well, as well as homeschooling.

Increased spending does not correlate with better education automatically. There are many prerequisites that must be met before extra funding has a result. A huge prerequisite is the culture in these poor neighborhoods and households. I think something people tend to forget is that education is not all up to the school. Much of it comes down to the students willingness to learn, which is often affected by their home environment. How likely am I to go to school when I see my buddy across the street making money by being apart of a drug operation on the corner? How likely am I to do well in school when my parents are drugs addicts, alcoholics, in prison, dead, or just not around? A huge reason middle class kids do better is because their at home environment is better.

If I get taxed more for living in a specific area my money should not go to a school in a different municipality. Its like California taxing me to build roads in Texas.

Other than that I can find common ground with you on the issue administration, that it's flawed in many places, though I don't think we'd be better off if all of our voices were disregarded. Elected officials are more accountable than bureaucrats when you have an engaged population (which is something you don't have in these at risk school districts). What needs to happen in these bad districts is more engagement, and more opportunities for engagement.

I can't agree with you on standardization. To some extent it's necessary, with core courses such as science, mathematics, and English comprehension. Those are universally essential skills in life. But whether I should be reading 1984 or Huckleberry Finn should be at discretion of the teacher. How something is taught and explained should also be up to the teacher.

Standards have another huge problem: teaching to the test. If we emphasis standards we oftentimes see an increased amount of testing, which does not always paint an accurate picture of the quality of education students are receiving. I believe that testing does help us gauge where students are, but too much of it leads to stagnation, and that leads to bored students who go through their schooling mindlessly.

And, another problem with standardization, it doesn't help people with unique disadvantages such as: English not being their first language, no support at home, and alternatives to education that include crime. You might even end up punishing districts, or wasting money on districts, simply because they're not meeting the "standard". You have to let people in unique situations find unique solutions to their unique problems. Standardization prevents this in many cases. Let's not forget, America is not Finland. We are not homogenized like they are.

As far as "non-core" classes go, I think region should play a huge factor. Not just on the extra languages that you can learn. Local cultural studies and skills training that are specifically valuable in your region should have much more emphasis. With skills it would tend to be more universal (healthcare, carperntry, metal working, computing, etc).

I think you have the right intentions on these things, I just think your solutions will do more harm (or nothing) rather than good.

http://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2016/...ericas-schools

https://www.cato.org/blog/public-sch...g-theres-chart

[Freighter]

1. Eliminate property tax in favor of a .5% state wide sales tax that would be used to fund schools state wide.

... Why exactly?

5. Disband teachers unions.

Unions often protect people from abuse by the employers, no?

[Venant]

On a more serious note, it's not the money that is the problem. It's the kids. Here is the report, if you don't want to read the whole thing, just read the summary at the page 1, and postscript at page 27.
https://object.cato.org/sites/cato.o...pdf/pa-298.pdf

I think that the problem with the conclusions drawn here is that 'achievement' is a racist concept.

- - - Updated - - -

Unions often protect people from abuse by the employers, no?

There wouldn't be so many people who oppose unions if they actually did in reality what they are theoretically supposed to do. In reality, unions are often engines of corruption that engage in legally sanctioned racketeering. They aren't concerned with actually performing the function of their associated profession, they are just concerned with propagating the union.

[Masark]

There wouldn't be so many people who oppose unions if they actually did in reality what they are theoretically supposed to do. In reality, unions are often engines of corruption that engage in legally sanctioned racketeering.

You are talking about the world portrayed in corporate propaganda, not reality.

[Imbalanced]

7. Zero tolerance policy for drugs, and violence committed outside of self defense.

You bully someone, your out.

Except for this your list is fine. By just throwing them out you are doing the same thing current schools do, failing to educate and sending unprepared students out into the world.

[truckboattruck]

a war on freedom of association now?

[Tierbook]

The school district I grew up in was thinking about doing this. The community in general that was thinking about breaking off from the county-wide school district has a 2010 population of 84k about 24k of which were students (Since 2010 the areas population has risen to probably around 110k if census estimates and being cautious hold true). That area which is easily the wealthiest part of Charleston County has a single HS fit to hold 3.7k after a recent large expansion and it's got over 4k enrolled atm. Conversely you look at the poorer areas and it's not uncommon to see HS's with around 1k enrollment. They are building a new highschool in the area with room for 1.2k but by the time its completed enough new people are expected to have moved into the area that both schools will immediately be at capacity.

[sheggaro]

Diversity according to liberals is great, until they start moving away from the people 'of color'.

To answer your question OP: Nothing, the simple truth is people want to be surrounded by those who share their culture and values.

[Theinquisition]

... Why exactly?



Unions often protect people from abuse by the employers, no?

1. Property taxes create disproportionately funded schools.

Rich areas have well funded schools while poor areas lack the tax base to properly fund their schools.

State sales tax also takes the ability of snowbirds to avoid paying property taxes while using infrastructure.

Teachers unions...like all public sector unions are garbage for a multitude of reasons.

[Venant]

You are talking about the world portrayed in corporate propaganda, not reality.

No, actually big unions tend to become pretty corrupt, although maybe its different up in Canada, my experience is with unions in the US.

[Tierbook]

No, actually big unions tend to become pretty corrupt, although maybe its different up in Canada, my experience is with unions in the US.

*cough cough* Chicago's school district *cough cough*

[Theinquisition]

Except for this your list is fine. By just throwing them out you are doing the same thing current schools do, failing to educate and sending unprepared students out into the world.

Fair enough.

Id make bullying punitive on the parents.

Your kid is a bully, we fine you 1000 per proven incident, or if parents lack the funds, make them attend a mandatory anger managment class with their kids...say...40 your block.

[Deleted]

you know, the article talks about performance gaps between white students and "students of colour", i'd like to see the stats on that, because i'm relatively certain that they are taking about a certain group of "people of colour".