Tomb of Sargeras Progression Thread

[sjuk]

Limit 3/9 in 20 min? xD

[tonic316]

I would absolutely do this if I were in their guild. Take 1 day off work and get a couple of World Firsts. Even though they are easy bosses, it's still fun to say you got a World First.

i tell all the ladies at the bar this when i try to pick them up, makes their panties wet.

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I personally know people from 3 of the top 20 guilds (several in a real life) and most of the people in those guilds have a job. They go to work at 7am, get home at 3pm and eat, start the raid when everyone is there (usually around 3-5pm) and raid to late night, depending on how willing people are. Weekends they go hard as fuck

that's around 40-50 hours + weekends, which overall often clocks to around 80 hours. Europe certainly has an advantage though thanks to the welfare system and more forgiving jobs (you can actually decide your holidays etc), but saying majority of them are neets is just wrong. From experience most of them have jobs, second biggest group are students. I think the working culture of America has a bigger impact since you can't slack off at work as easily

so they have no friends outside of wow or a significant other and barely see their family. Got it! Sounds amazing!

[Deleted]

I would absolutely do this if I were in their guild. Take 1 day off work and get a couple of World Firsts. Even though they are easy bosses, it's still fun to say you got a World First.

Didn't say I wouldn't do the same if I had the opportunity. Sounds like a good deal to me.

Yeah, all those semi-casual world top 50 guilds.

Well yeah, in wf-race context they are semi-casual. Compared to your average HC guild they are bleeding edge. Taking things in context helps

[BiggestNoob]

idk what you're on about but "tactics" include knowing the timings of abilities that will happen and how you would deal with it; and is 75% of what you actually end up progressing on.

?? That is all known in advance. You know what's going to happen, and the timers, and what you're going to do to deal with it. And even if you didn't, it takes a handful of pulls at most to figure that out. You're not going to bash your head against a wall for 50 pulls not understanding how shit works then suddenly say "oh we just need to deal with mechanic X this way" and then kill the boss.

Unless you've never actually played with non-retarded players?

Dps checks/random execution failures slow down your progress on a boss but it's all about getting further then repeating till you are confident you can deal with everything long enough for the boss to die.

You get further by executing, not by watching what another guild did. I don't care how good you think you are, if you watched Method's kill video for Archimonde then went in there with no rings at 719 ilvl you weren't going to kill that boss in under 150 pulls. If you think you can, you're too retarded to be allowed to procreate.

Give a world first guild a killvideo and they'll kill it in 1/4 of the time.

This is hilariously false, and it's trivially verifiable by looking at actual evidence. Everyone in the top 5 knows how to do every mythic boss already sans minor changes, and whatever wasn't included on PTR or in the journal. When kill videos get posted after the first 5 are done, the next 5 don't just knock over the last boss instantly, even with more gear.

You think the reason they're sub 10 pulling half of the raid is because they've all read a guide or watched a video? You do realize most of these bosses are nearly identical to heroic but require a much higher level of execution, right?

I love it when these people who are absolute shit at this game pretend like knowing what happens in a fight like watching a video magically makes you capable of killing it. The unreal level of stupidity and arrogance on MMO-C is unmatched except perhaps on /r/politics. Just try applying that logic to literally anything else. Let's just completely ignore the data that shows that even very good guilds were wiping on bosses in heroic that have near perfect execution videos available, clearly it never happens. They saw a video so they 1-shot everything the first time. Actually learning the fight and executing on it didn't matter at all, and surely those 7 heroic splits on shitty alts has no impact whatsoever on mythic progression. These guilds just formulated a strategy in their head and the strategy is the key. That's the ticket! They're all basically Invective, they're just using superior strategies.

[Deleted]

?? That is all known in advance. You know what's going to happen, and the timers, and what you're going to do to deal with it. And even if you didn't, it takes a handful of pulls at most to figure that out. You're not going to bash your head against a wall for 50 pulls not understanding how shit works then suddenly say "oh we just need to deal with mechanic X this way" and then kill the boss.

Unless you've never actually played with non-retarded players?



You get further by executing, not by watching what another guild did. I don't care how good you think you are, if you watched Method's kill video for Archimonde then went in there with no rings at 719 ilvl you weren't going to kill that boss in under 150 pulls. If you think you can, you're too retarded to be allowed to procreate.



This is hilariously false, and it's trivially verifiable by looking at actual evidence. Everyone in the top 5 knows how to do every mythic boss already sans minor changes, and whatever wasn't included on PTR or in the journal. When kill videos get posted after the first 5 are done, the next 5 don't just knock over the last boss instantly, even with more gear.

You think the reason they're sub 10 pulling half of the raid is because they've all read a guide or watched a video? You do realize most of these bosses are nearly identical to heroic but require a much higher level of execution, right?

I love it when these people who are absolute shit at this game pretend like knowing what happens in a fight like watching a video magically makes you capable of killing it. The unreal level of stupidity and arrogance on MMO-C is unmatched except perhaps on /r/politics. Just try applying that logic to literally anything else. Let's just completely ignore the data that shows that even very good guilds were wiping on bosses in heroic that have near perfect execution videos available, clearly it never happens. They saw a video so they 1-shot everything the first time. Actually learning the fight and executing on it didn't matter at all, and surely those 7 heroic splits on shitty alts has no impact whatsoever on mythic progression. These guilds just formulated a strategy in their head and the strategy is the key. That's the ticket! They're all basically Invective, they're just using superior strategies.

It's funny how you mention Method's WF on Archimonde considering you're talking to a guy that was in it

[Eggroll]

Invective must be the new covfefe

[Jastall]

Just a semi-casual guild (world~50) who decided to dayraid for the lulz to grab the meme boss first kills.

People who day raid on day 1 of Mythic and down bosses fairly rapidly are ''semi-casual''?

Jeez, who are the hardcores, those who fuse with their PC, only play this game literally 24/7 and are sustained by injecting Mountain Dew directly into their veins?

[Reisar]

You get further by executing, not by watching what another guild did. I don't care how good you think you are, if you watched Method's kill video for Archimonde then went in there with no rings at 719 ilvl you weren't going to kill that boss in under 150 pulls. If you think you can, you're too retarded to be allowed to procreate.

u saying this to a guy who was actually on the WF

[Ipsissimus]

Plastkin, I suggest you go watch Method's said kill video of Archimonde and pay attention to the names of the Mages in the raid.

In my opinion, strategies matter plenty. WoW's mechanical limitations on execution/throughput mean that what differentiates two groups with similar degree of dedication and natural aptitude is the specific ways they choose to deal with each individual mechanic or combination of mechanics at individual points in the fights. Even as a relatively light schedule guild we benefit immensely from any extra video that turns up of a boss before we kill it, even ones which just show the same strategy from a different PoV because the other one didn't directly show something random we were interested in knowing.

[Deleted]

so they have no friends outside of wow or a significant other and barely see their family. Got it! Sounds amazing!

You sound like a teenager whose entire life revolves around looking cool in the eyes of others. No, dedicating couple of weeks to your hobby doesn't mean you don't have friends, an SO or a family

[Woobels]

?? That is all known in advance. You know what's going to happen, and the timers, and what you're going to do to deal with it. And even if you didn't, it takes a handful of pulls at most to figure that out. You're not going to bash your head against a wall for 50 pulls not understanding how shit works then suddenly say "oh we just need to deal with mechanic X this way" and then kill the boss.

Unless you've never actually played with non-retarded players?



You get further by executing, not by watching what another guild did. I don't care how good you think you are, if you watched Method's kill video for Archimonde then went in there with no rings at 719 ilvl you weren't going to kill that boss in under 150 pulls. If you think you can, you're too retarded to be allowed to procreate.



This is hilariously false, and it's trivially verifiable by looking at actual evidence. Everyone in the top 5 knows how to do every mythic boss already sans minor changes, and whatever wasn't included on PTR or in the journal. When kill videos get posted after the first 5 are done, the next 5 don't just knock over the last boss instantly, even with more gear.

You think the reason they're sub 10 pulling half of the raid is because they've all read a guide or watched a video? You do realize most of these bosses are nearly identical to heroic but require a much higher level of execution, right?

I love it when these people who are absolute shit at this game pretend like knowing what happens in a fight like watching a video magically makes you capable of killing it. The unreal level of stupidity and arrogance on MMO-C is unmatched except perhaps on /r/politics. Just try applying that logic to literally anything else. Let's just completely ignore the data that shows that even very good guilds were wiping on bosses in heroic that have near perfect execution videos available, clearly it never happens. They saw a video so they 1-shot everything the first time. Actually learning the fight and executing on it didn't matter at all, and surely those 7 heroic splits on shitty alts has no impact whatsoever on mythic progression. These guilds just formulated a strategy in their head and the strategy is the key. That's the ticket! They're all basically Invective, they're just using superior strategies.

You really never stop regurgitating garbage don't you.

Check who Abujan is exactly before you post, infact just start thinking before you post in general.

[InstantPoM]

It's funny how you mention Method's WF on Archimonde considering you're talking to a guy that was in it

Clearly, he "never actually played with non-retarded players"

[Toastyame]

Why do you think guilds like Encore can get such a strong world ranking? Great players but they have guides/resources available afterwards. Plus potential nerfs to bosses.

Having a video and mimicking it is much different than developing your own weakauras, strats and going into bosses more or less blind.

[Tiorda]

Plastkin telling Abujan how raiding works on the bleeding edge is better than the Invective trolling.

[Deleted]

*Bunch of idiotic rambling*

That must've hurt. How sore are you on a scale from 1-10?

[Abujan]

@Plastkin I'm not going to dismiss all your points as there is a sliver of truth in certain cases. A boss like Star Augur week 1 where you have to vantus rune + stack fury warriors/shadow priests to beat the execute timer do exist. But for the vast majority of bosses, if something works for someone else; it'll nearly always work for you. Unless they've class stacked some class that you're unable to replicate.

For the first 4/5 bosses, sure you'll see some timers on ptr and you'll probably go in well prepared; but they're trivial enough not to matter much. But when you reach the later bosses; they dont typically get tested far enough into the fight to get something concrete to work with. You'll have an idea of how you're going to approach elements of the fight, but timers of abilities and abilites themselves change a lot from ptr-live; the info you get from ptr is nothing compared to a video with exact timers, and an already working tactic to deal with them.

And yes I've been involved in a few world firsts myself, on not-so insignificant bosses.

[BiggestNoob]

It's funny how you mention Method's WF on Archimonde considering you're talking to a guy that was in it

u saying this to a guy who was actually on the WF

Plastkin, I suggest you go watch Method's said kill video of Archimonde and pay attention to the names of the Mages in the raid.

Check who Abujan is exactly before you post, infact just start thinking before you post in general.

Plastkin telling Abujan how raiding works on the bleeding edge is better than the Invective trolling.

Hilariously he completely ignored what his own guild members were saying about the kill in interviews after. Clearly it was just the strategy. I mean separating infernals, stacking for meteors, picking up fire, spreading for beams, interrupting, stacking up adds and killing them. Those mechanics don't mandate you doing the fight in a specific way or anything, and the top 5 kills without videos aren't almost identical or anything. It definitely had 0 to do with execution. Nobody with 730 gear did the boss with more than 50 pulls because videos. Let's just ignore facts that must be true if we assume this argument, because reasoning about the contraposition is too difficult for you retards. And another question: if the strategy is that important, why would any guild ever kill it any other way? Wouldn't they be at an enormous disadvantage? Come on, you should have great answers to these questions. It can't be 75% of a fight if it doesn't seem to matter in any measurable way!

And this yet again isn't an argument. It's an appeal to authority. The data completely contradicts this claim, and being in for a kill doesn't change that fact. At what pull number did Method know how to kill the boss after the fire was nerfed? Was it 200 or was it much lower than that? :thinking:

Inb4 you ignore actual data and evidence that strategy is completely irrelevant and appeal to authority.

I love it how everyone does exactly what I said. Nobody here actually looks at data. Feelcrafting 1000%. Keep it up though.

[Deleted]

http://prntscr.com/foya87

okay..

[Abujan]

Hilariously he completely ignored what his own guild members were saying about the kill in interviews after. Clearly it was just the strategy. I mean separating infernals, stacking for meteors, picking up fire, spreading for beams, interrupting, stacking up adds and killing them. Those mechanics don't mandate you doing the fight in a specific way or anything, and the top 5 kills without videos aren't almost identical or anything. It definitely had 0 to do with execution. Nobody with 730 gear did the boss with more than 50 pulls because videos. Let's just ignore facts that must be true if we assume this argument, because reasoning about the contrapositive is too difficult for you retards.

And this yet again isn't an argument. It's an appeal to authority. The data completely contradicts this claim, and being in for a kill doesn't change that fact. At what pull number did Method know how to kill the boss after the fire was nerfed? Was it 200 or was it much lower than that? :thinking:



I love it how everyone does exactly what I said. Nobody here actually looks at data. Feelcrafting 1000%. Keep it up though.

The thing is though, if theres a video, the kill is possible. It's a prerequisite that eliminates a lot of factors that hinder progression. Unless, say, the video was a bunch of devs coming in full mythic gear.

[Deleted]

Hilariously he completely ignored what his own guild members were saying about the kill in interviews after. Clearly it was just the strategy. I mean separating infernals, stacking for meteors, picking up fire, spreading for beams, interrupting, stacking up adds and killing them. Those mechanics don't mandate you doing the fight in a specific way or anything, and the top 5 kills without videos aren't almost identical or anything. It definitely had 0 to do with execution. Nobody with 730 gear did the boss with more than 50 pulls because videos. Let's just ignore facts that must be true if we assume this argument, because reasoning about the contrapositive is too difficult for you retards.

And this yet again isn't an argument. It's an appeal to authority. The data completely contradicts this claim, and being in for a kill doesn't change that fact. At what pull number did Method know how to kill the boss after the fire was nerfed? Was it 200 or was it much lower than that? :thinking:



I love it how everyone does exactly what I said. Nobody here actually looks at data. Feelcrafting 1000%. Keep it up though.

Keep mentioning Archimonde and making a fool out of yourself. Did you look at the "data"? Did you watch the paragon kill video? Cos if you did you'd know they used a completely different strategy to handle the beams in p2 compared to Method. Members of Paragon themselves came out after the race was over and said that Method's strat in p2 was vastly superior and they thought it probably cost them the WF since their P2 wasn't reliable at all and wiped there several times.

But by all means, keep going, it's really funny to read.