7.3 spoilers!

[Friendlyimmolation]

I don't know...a piece of plywood is still three dimensional. Don't give her that much credit

A thinly shaved wood scrap then.

[Evilmoo]

Unmaker.
maybe he or it is meant to Un-make the error made by Sargeras - killing the pantheon.

[Mazeari]

Just the typical stuff. But the art team man. Fuck, they did a good job

[DeicideUH]

Because shes arguably the dumbest of all the shitty characters knaak invented for starters?

That's a reason to not like her, but the hate I usually see towards her focus on she fighting the Horde, which is the only thing interesting about her IMO.

Genn, Jaina, Rogers, all actual interesting characters.

Check discussions about them. Horde pretty much wants all of them killed as raid bosses.

If you painted a peice of plywood blue, and called it the ranger general of the silver covenant the story would probably be the same, and if Rhonin managed to have sex with that plank of wood the story would all be the more similar.

I don't disagree with that. But exactly because she's such a "tabula rasa", I think she has a lot of potential for character growth.

she delighted in killing Sunreavers and blood elves in general, Jaina was sthe one who wanted to imprison them.

As if the blood elves never delighted in killing Alliance before, right? They did pretty bad things back in the days before the Sunwell re-ignited.

Probably stemming from the Purge of Dalaran, Rommath portaled in and saved quite a number of Blood Elves that Vereesa seemed to relish in the thought of killing - it didn't read as personal hatred to me but more as wanting to settle that vendetta established back in MoP.

I see it differently. Rommath was the one responsible for bringing Kael'thas' teachings to the blood elves. He was the one to bring that imprisoned naaru (the name escapes me right now) and was a fierce advocate of the blood elves' new ways. He's also the ruling blood elf that has always been more vocal against the Alliance. And, finally, he's the head of the magisters, and magisters and farstriders always had some (light) rivalry as defenders of Quel'thalas. I'd theorize that Rommath was the prime supporter of the forced exile of high elves that were against the new blood elf ideology. I think all that explains why Vereesa hates Rommath so much.

Compare Vereesa's reactions to Halduron. There's respect there. She does not hate all blood elves, she even helped them defend against the Amani. But she sure hates blood elf ideology and the main figure that supported it (Rommath and Halduron).

[DesoPL]

Something comes to my mind.

Eonar and Aggramar apperance in raid may be connected to words what tribunal of ages durning WOTLK said.

Brann Bronzebeard yells: Ha! The old magic fingers finally won through! Now let's get down to--
Abedneum yells: Alert: security fail-safes deactivated. Beginning memory purge and...
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Purge? No no no no no.. Where did I-- Aha, this should do the trick...
Abedneum yells: System online. Life form pattern recognized. Welcome, Branbronzan. Query?
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Query? What do you think I'm here for, tea and biscuits? Spill the beans already!
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Tell me how the dwarves came to be, and start at the beginning!
Abedneum yells: Accessing prehistoric data... retrieved. In the beginning the earthen were created to--
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Right, right... I know the earthen were made from stone to shape the deep regions o' the world. But what about the anomalies? Matrix non-stabilizin' and what-not?
Abedneum yells: Accessing... In the early stages of it's development cycle, Azeroth suffered infection by parasitic necrophotic symbiotes.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Necrowhatinthe-- Speak bloody Common, will ye?
Abedneum yells: Designation: Old Gods. Old Gods rendered all systems, including earthen, defenseless in order to facilitate assimilation. This matrix destabilization has been termed "the Curse of Flesh". Effects of destabilization increased over time.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Old Gods, huh? So they zapped the earthen with this Curse of Flesh... and then what?
Kaddrak yells: Accessing... Creators arrived to extirpate symbiotic infection. Assessment revealed that Old God infestation had grown malignant. Excising parasites would result in loss of host--
Brann Bronzebeard yells: If they killed the Old Gods, Azeroth would've been destroyed...
Kaddrak yells: Correct. Creators neutralized parasitic threat and contained it within the host. Forge of Wills and other systems were instituted to create new earthen. Safeguards were implemented, and protectors were appointed.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: What protectors?
Kaddrak yells: Designations: Aesir and Vanir. Or in common nomenclator, storm and earth giants. Sentinel Loken designated supreme. Dragon Aspects appointed to monitor evolution of Azeroth.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Aesir and Vanir... Okay, so the Forge o' Wills started makin' new earthen... but what happened to the old ones?
Marnak yells: Additional background is relevant to your query. Following global combat between Aesir and Vanir-
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Hold everything! The Aesir and Vanir went to war? Why?
Marnak yells: Unknown. Data suggests that impetus for global combat originated with prime designate Loken who neutralized all remaining Aesir and Vanir affecting termination of conflict. Prime designate Loken then initiated stasis of several seed races including Earthen, Giants and Vrykul at designated holding facilities.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: This "Loken" sounds like a nasty character. Glad we don't have to worry about the likes o' him anymore. So... if I'm understandin' ye right, the original earthen eventually woke up from this stasis, and by that time the destabili-whatever had turned 'em into proper dwarves. Or at least... dwarf ancestors.
Marnak yells: Essentially that is correct.
Brann Bronzebeard yells: Well, now... that's a lot to digest. I'm gonna need some time to take all this in. Thank ye.
Abedneum yells: Acknowledged, Branbronzan. Session terminated.

Both Eonar and Aggramar are Vanir titans, this may prove might be easier to corrupt by Sargeras, than Aesir titans for which they are Aman'Thul, Norgannon and Golganeth. But also this may prove wrong, since Khaz'Goroth is Vanir titan, but there is no encounter in upcoming raid.

[Belisaurio]

Both Eonar and Aggramar are Vanir titans, this may prove might be easier to corrupt by Sargeras, than Aesir titans for which they are Aman'Thul, Norgannon and Golganeth. But also this may prove wrong, since Khaz'Goroth is Vanir titan, but there is no encounter in upcoming raid.

And Eonar encounter seems to be something like the green dragon in WTLK: Helping her, and not killing her (from the journal description).

[Friendlyimmolation]

That's a reason to not like her, but the hate I usually see towards her focus on she fighting the Horde, which is the only thing interesting about her IMO.

if you can read any book shes in and not want her spiked in the back then wow is all I have to say. Even christie golden the better of the WoW authors couldn't make her a good character.

Check discussions about them. Horde pretty much wants all of them killed as raid bosses.

people have been shrieking about Sylvanas for years, everyone wants everyone dead.

I don't disagree with that. But exactly because she's such a "tabula rasa", I think she has a lot of potential for character growth.

hopefully as arcane dust right alongside Rhonin.

As if the blood elves never delighted in killing Alliance before, right? They did pretty bad things back in the days before the Sunwell re-ignited.

The blood elves actually on the large never did, they took pride in killing Alliance spies for obvious reason in the starting zone, they enjoyed desroying the primitive night elf mages because it showed their superiority, but they never hunted high elves like Vereesa wants to hunt them.

I see it differently. Rommath was the one responsible for bringing Kael'thas' teachings to the blood elves. He was the one to bring that imprisoned naaru (the name escapes me right now) and was a fierce advocate of the blood elves' new ways. He's also the ruling blood elf that has always been more vocal against the Alliance. And, finally, he's the head of the magisters, and magisters and farstriders always had some (light) rivalry as defenders of Quel'thalas. I'd theorize that Rommath was the prime supporter of the forced exile of high elves that were against the new blood elf ideology. I think all that explains why Vereesa hates Rommath so much.

Vereesa was already living in Dalaran making sweet sweet cliched abominations with Rhonin when the high elves were given the boot.

Compare Vereesa's reactions to Halduron. There's respect there. She does not hate all blood elves, she even helped them defend against the Amani. But she sure hates blood elf ideology and the main figure that supported it (Rommath and Halduron).

which is simply hilarious because the only reason her people are alive in general is because of Rommath and Lorthemar. You can't have every elf live in a human city subservient to them.

- - - Updated - - -

And Eonar encounter seems to be something like the green dragon in WTLK: Helping her, and not killing her (from the journal description).

I'm still confused on how the titan souls went from Azeroth to Argus.

[DeicideUH]

But for the Alliance it are often characters like Vereesa.
Remember that Vereesa started to kill innocent people as revenge for something those people didn't have anything to do with.

Are you talking about the Purge of Dalaran?
Her orders were to imprison the blood elves. The only ones killed were the ones that resisted.
She did revel in fighting them, but never murdered anyone in cold blood.

1. No, the Horde did not act first. Those people didn't act first.

Yes, the Horde did. Both were reactions to Horde attacks. You may say those were overreactions, sure. But you can't say there was no prior Horde action.

Jaina is just as bad.
Can the Alliance, please, for once, get a character that is anti-Horde and doesn't go full psycho?

I don't see Jaina murdering people in cold blood.
Except for the Purge of Dalaran, which involved the Horde stealing a weapon of mass destruction, both Jaina and Vereesa have been defensive while cooperating with the Horde, but never started agression.

[pateuvasiliu]

oh Hey Vereesa, you've been killing my people ? Cool. Where's the human mage that was 90% of your character?

They aren't her people. The blood elves accepted Fel/draining living beings and allied with the orcs/trolls that Alleria hates with a passion, as well as the Undead that torture, kill and raise innocent living beings.

[Belisaurio]

I'm still confused on how the titan souls went from Azeroth to Argus.

Maybe they are not in Argus. The journal talks about "Eonar Essence".

[Friendlyimmolation]

Are you talking about the Purge of Dalaran?
Her orders were to imprison the blood elves. The only ones killed were the ones that resisted.
She did revel in fighting them, but never murdered anyone in cold blood.

"slaughter those rats" Yes totally.

Yes, the Horde did. Both were reactions to Horde attacks. You may say those were overreactions, sure. But you can't say there was no prior Horde action.

She literally came out of the woodwork upset about blood elves in Wotlk.

I don't see Jaina murdering people in cold blood.

well she killed Aethas's guards.

Unlike Jaina who has actual characterizations Vereesa has always been a sloppy character who's soul purpose is seemingly to make anyone who likes elves upset.

They aren't her people. The blood elves accepted Fel/draining living beings and allied with the orcs/trolls that Alleria hates with a passion, as well as the Undead that torture, kill and raise innocent living beings.

She flat out admitted she would be a blood elf if not for knaak sue. The overwhelming majority of the elves never accepted fel, and drained simple vermin for their magic. Thats been the lore for 10 years now. Also lul the overwhelming majority of the people the Forsaken fight are not innocent by the very defition. Unless fighting undead now makes you innocent of everything now.

[Zulkhan]

Compare Vereesa's reactions to Halduron. There's respect there. She does not hate all blood elves, she even helped them defend against the Amani. But she sure hates blood elf ideology and the main figure that supported it (Rommath and Halduron).

Which is quite laughable to be honest. Halduron may have been a more sympathetic figure towards High Elves and never genuinely liked Rommath but even he was able to embrace the "Blood Elf ideology" because it was simply the necessary thing to do. Same could be surely said for other Farstriders if not Blood Elves in general.

And here lies the issue with Vereesa. Her hatred was never focused on a clear target. She didn't show direct and exclusive hate for Rommath, the Magisters or even the Blood Knights. She simply shrieked at the word "Blood Elf" most of the times, trying to convince her Alliance and Kirin Tor friends that Blood Elves were assholes and couldn't be trusted. If she somehow got along with Halduron is because Halduron has a way too soft spot for the likes of Vereesa and ready to offer more forgiveness and understanding than Vereesa herself deserves.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Maybe they are not in Argus. The journal talks about "Eonar Essence".

Maybe he siphoned her out of Ulduar or something.

[Ilir]

Well guess we'll need shadowpriests to see what's going on with the void. Their dagger should know

[Dispraise]

My current hypothesis is that "Argus the Unmaker" is a new Titan construct, created by either the previously mentioned Titan-creation machinery on Argus or created by Sargeras to contain his essence, or simply as a body for him to inhabit to deal with us. It is not Fel or flaming because, in the screenshots at least, it is both unfinished and uninhabited - it is, for the time being at least, a pure Titan avatar.

I'd say it looks more like a zombie than unfinished. Blue skin, sunken cheeks, exposed teeth, skeletal nose. The fact he's missing the top of his head also seems to me more like he lost it, rather than it hasn't developed yet. Maybe Argus the titan having a bits blown out of his dome is related to Argus the planet having bits blown out of it's surface.

That's my guess. Undead zombie titan.

[Zulkhan]

They aren't her people. The blood elves accepted Fel/draining living beings and allied with the orcs/trolls that Alleria hates with a passion

You mean the Jungle Trolls that did as much (and more, actually) than Vereesa herself in assaulting Zul'Aman and defending Quel'Thalas against the Zandalari/Amani alliance, the trolls Alleria actually knows and hate?

[Aucald]

No, I am talking about the purge of Dalaran where she started to kill Blood Elves for random reasons.

That wasn't really genocide - she was only killing the Sunreavers, who she believed had been complicit in the death of her husband at Theramore. Despite her bloodthirstiness her anger was focused at a pretty narrow range of people - not *all* Blood Elves as it were. I also think she went a bit beyond the pale, personally - but Alleria's rage at the Orcs was a sight to behold in "Beyond the Dark Portal."

[Lord Pebbleton]

WTF is this shit?

The hat is so damn Bloodborne. I want it.

[Aucald]

I'd say it looks more like a zombie than unfinished. Blue skin, sunken cheeks, exposed teeth, skeletal nose. The fact he's missing the top of his head also seems to me more like he lost it, rather than it hasn't developed yet. Maybe Argus the titan having a bits blown out of his dome is related to Argus the planet having bits blown out of it's surface.

That's my guess. Undead zombie titan.

"Undead zombie Titan" is pretty horrific as well, all in all. It's all very strange regardless of how you look at it - I'm quite eager to find out exactly what its deal is.

[Skolens]

I'm digging the Fel Broken model. But can anyone explain how? I thought Broken existed only in Outland.

I don't know if it's confirmed or not, but I always thought that the broken are draenei who were too much in contact with fel "toxic". Like... they smell too much and their body change slowly.

So pretty certain that broken are legit in Argus.