[Spoilers] 7.3 Blood elf discussion.

[derpkitteh]

Thanks for the screenshots :3

Are there any other Belves around there? Or just the cool guards? (We need those shoulders made available already Blizz!!!)

sylgrin the nightborne guard, liadrin, cuckthas, and vindicator boros are on the ship. you speak to liadrin to do the quest to sail to azuremyst.

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its called magic.

that would actually be pretty fucking cool, if a bit superfluous.

[Friendlyimmolation]

that would actually be pretty fucking cool, if a bit superfluous.

Do you think Rommath the MAGNIFICENT would allow his boat to touch WATER?

/you feel uncomfortable as Rommath's arcane constructs points at the water and laughs.


based off of the Rommath's personal Arcane guardian, Arcanis Mechanica, amusingly refers to its master as "HIS HIGH AND POWERFULNESS" when speaking to the player in the quest H [90] What's in the Box?. Perhaps Rommath programmed this himself in a moment of good humor, or Arcanis has the ability to articulate its own feelings.


kinda want that old humor back into wow, now its just Khadgar puns.

[Theoris]

Alleria will probably be in the middle, she'll meddle with Belf stuff and Sylvanas but not be locked to it, kinda Similar to a reverse Khadgar to compare. I do find it interesting that it seems like she's been fused with Void in some way, and I'm curious if it will be relevant to be more sympathetic to Sylvanas or it's just temporary.

Makes me wonder how Turalyon will react when he finds out his homeland was destroyed by his own prince. He has probably, for the lack of a better term, seen some shit over the years he has fought the Legion, but I'll be pretty disappointed if hearing about Lordaeron doesn't make an impact on him.

More OT:
If War Crimes is any indication Sylvanas's reaction to Alleria will probably be "Oh, you're still alive. K.", but while heavily repressing joy.

[Shampro]

Makes me wonder how Turalyon will react when he finds out his homeland was destroyed by his own prince. He has probably, for the lack of a better term, seen some shit over the years he has fought the Legion, but I'll be pretty disappointed if hearing about Lordaeron doesn't make an impact on him.

More OT:
If War Crimes is any indication Sylvanas's reaction to Alleria will probably be "Oh, you're still alive. K.", but while heavily repressing joy.

She clearly cares for some people and tries to show it in her own wicked way (most recently as seen in the nathanos story). Undead not even once. The neckless is something she still wears to this day afterall.

[DeicideUH]

TO Horde players: does Silgryn says anything/interact with anything, or is he just... there?

[Maxilian]

Hating the Horde = batshit crazy.

Being female LK 2.0 = fine. Good to know.

And in case you forgot, Veressa hates the Horde, but not her sister. She DID almost choose to join Sylvie in the UC. So if it comes down to Sylvie alone I don't think she'll be too salty when explaining it to Alleria. The Belves joining the Horde...that's up in the air though I can see her exaggerating.

You know she is called batshit crazy because of the Purge of Dalaran, right?

[DeicideUH]

You know she is called batshit crazy because of the Purge of Dalaran, right?

You know that, canonicaly, most of the Sunreavers were imprisoned, only a few were killed, right? It's not the genocide that people make it out to be.

[Combatbutler]

TO Horde players: does Silgryn says anything/interact with anything, or is he just... there?

He has no dialogue so far and stands always close to Liadrin and Aethas.

[Sigxy]

You know that, canonicaly, most of the Sunreavers were imprisoned, only a few were killed, right? It's not the genocide that people make it out to be.

You know that, people are just going to ignore this and just keep writing that it was a genocide (which makes no sense at all), right? ;_:

[Friendlyimmolation]

You know that, canonicaly, most of the Sunreavers were imprisoned, only a few were killed, right? It's not the genocide that people make it out to be.

Most sunreavers Jaina ran into. The SC and Vereesa wanted everyone dead.

[DeicideUH]

Most sunreavers Jaina ran into. The SC and Vereesa wanted everyone dead.

Not true at all. There's a lot of exageration about that, and even during the Horde quests the SC is primarily capturing Sunreavers rather than executing them.

You know that, people are just going to ignore this and just keep writing that it was a genocide (which makes no sense at all), right? ;_:

Yeah, I know.

He has no dialogue so far and stands always close to Liadrin and Aethas.

Hoping that they add something to his presence there. Feels random. While I do think the nightborne (or some of them) may "join" the blood elves, Silgryn going alone to a demon planet without explanation feels forced.

[Friendlyimmolation]

Not true at all. There's a lot of exageration about that, and even during the Horde quests the SC is primarily capturing Sunreavers rather than executing them.

the questgiver in question tells you to "slaughter those rats" surely a person who wanted to imprison people.

[DeicideUH]

the questgiver in question tells you to "slaughter those rats" surely a person who wanted to imprison people.

"Jaina's doing a good job taking care of Sunreavers above ground, but there's still plenty rooting around in the sewers.
Go find those lying rats and exterminate them!"

She's calling them rats to be exterminated because they are, like rats, resisting in the sewers.

You like to quote quest texts, so here are other two texts from said questgiver:

The Sunreaver's Sanctuary is still crawling with those Horde-loving Sunreavers.
Jaina will have sent the reasonable ones to the Violet Hold. The rest refuse to leave, raising their weapons against us.
Show them the cost of their defiance. They now face the judgment of the Alliance, the Silver Covenant, and the Kirin Tor!

Plus:

Compliant Sunreavers will be sent to the Violet Hold. Defiant ones are put to the sword.
NONE are to escape.
The Sunreavers keep their dragonhawk mounts on Krasus' Landing. Take this dust, and use it to render them incapable of flying.
Or kill them. I don't care.

The quests are always putting emphasis on the fact that those who do not fight are being sent to prison. The quests send you to deal with the ones that are fighting back.

In the Horde version, in the very first quest in the sewers, you get Silver Covenant capturing Sunreavers. Rommath says:

Compared to the rest of the city, this part of the sewers is relatively calm. This is good - we can extract more Sunreavers in peace than we can in war.
Find as many citizens as you can. Tell them that it is not safe here, that they must leave the city at once.
And try to stay clear of the Silver Covenant. We don't want to cause a scene if we can avoid it. Not yet, anyhow.

You, as Horde, can even talk to the SC mobs because they are neutral towards you. It's only when you start helping the Sunreavers escape that they turn hostile. (Yes, sometimes a SC mob will slap a compliant blood elf, and that's wrong and dickish, but very far from genocide).

The following quest, Rommath says:
As I suspected, it gets worse up ahead. The Silver Covenant is outright attacking innocent Sunreavers!
This cannot stand. While our prime directive is to rescue Aethas Sunreaver, we must also protect as many blood elves as we can.
I will continue to scout ahead. Fight well, <class>!

You push further into the sewers, and there is now a battle between SR and SC. The key point here is battle: you have Sunreaver fighters, not citizens.

The entire quest chain reinforces that the orders are to just imprison SR that do not fight back. After the quest chain, we are constantly reminded that there are lots of Sunreaver prisoners in Dalaran. It's even brought again during the Isle of Thunder encounter between Jaina and Lorthemar.

There was no genocide. You may point other war crimes (yes, there were crimes, I agree with that), but genocide is a big exageration.

[Friendlyimmolation]

There was no genocide. You may point other war crimes (yes, there were crimes, I agree with that), but genocide is a big exageration.

I never said there was genocide, Vereesa couldn't do it if she tried, she'd get ground into the dirt. What I am arguing against is that anyone trying to say the SC and Jaina made sure to handle the situation in a way that would prevent death. Jaina sure as hell rushed it and Vereesa was more than happy to do it in the bloodiest way possible.

Not genocide, but it just further throws shit into the pit that is Vereesa's character.

Jaina is just beaten down by shitty writing, but isnt a shit character herself.

[Aucald]

the questgiver in question tells you to "slaughter those rats" surely a person who wanted to imprison people.

That quest occurs after a previous one in the chain, where Vereesa says:

Compliant Sunreavers will be sent to the Violet Hold. Defiant ones are put to the sword.

NONE are to escape.

The Sunreavers keep their dragonhawk mounts on Krasus' Landing. Take this dust, and use it to render them incapable of flying.

Or kill them. I don't care.

She also expresses brief shock in what seem to be Jaina's commands to eliminate the remaining Sunreavers that haven't sided with the Silver Convenant or voluntarily let themselves be detained in the Violet Hold:

While I can't say I agree completely with Jaina's methods, I do understand her motives.

Sometimes, you have to fight back.

I still think Vereesa and the Covenant were squarely in the wrong here, as was Jaina for going off half-cocked, but Vereesa was more conflicted about the Purge than is displayed to the Horde (as all the above are Alliance quests).

[Friendlyimmolation]

That quest occurs after a previous one in the chain, where Vereesa says:



She also expresses brief shock in what seem to be Jaina's commands to eliminate the remaining Sunreavers that haven't sided with the Silver Convenant or voluntarily let themselves be detained in the Violet Hold:



I still think Vereesa and the Covenant were squarely in the wrong here, as was Jaina for going off half-cocked, but Vereesa was more conflicted about the Purge than is displayed to the Horde (as all the above are Alliance quests).

the only person who comes out of the purge worse than Vereesa is Aethas. Why the hell didnt Rommath mercy kill him.

[DeicideUH]

I never said there was genocide, Vereesa couldn't do it if she tried, she'd get ground into the dirt. What I am arguing against is that anyone trying to say the SC and Jaina made sure to handle the situation in a way that would prevent death. Jaina sure as hell rushed it and Vereesa was more than happy to do it in the bloodiest way possible.

That, I agree. They didn't handle that as they should.

Not genocide, but it just further throws shit into the pit that is Vereesa's character.

But this, I don't agree. Vereesa has its flaws as a character (she's paper-thin in character development), yes. But considering all that was done to her, I understand her anger. In a modern setting, she would be a war criminal, but in Warcraft, she's just yet another angry fighter in a war. She never, for example, murdered someone defenseless or who had surrended. Compared to what other characters do but have strong fan bases, what she did is pretty light.

[Aucald]

the only person who comes out of the purge worse than Vereesa is Aethas. Why the hell didnt Rommath mercy kill him.

I think Rommath believes Aethas can be a great magister if he gets over his profound naivete and all-consuming love for the Kirin Tor. Other than that, I guess every court needs a Fool in its ranks.

[Friendlyimmolation]

But this, I don't agree. Vereesa has its flaws as a character (she's paper-thin in character development), yes. But considering all that was done to her, I understand her anger. In a modern setting, she would be a war criminal, but in Warcraft, she's just yet another angry fighter in a war. She never, for example, murdered someone defenseless or who had surrended. Compared to what other characters do but have strong fan bases, what she did is pretty light.

Its more along the lines of her being completely untalented, being arrogant when she doesn't deserve to be, a hypocrite in nearly everything she says about the blood elves, immature as hell most the time. Every single thing about her character boils down to Knaak needing Rhonin to have an elf wife. And her stupidity pretty much solidifies her as a character that will only grow worse the longer they keep the spotlight on her.

if she was angry thats fine, we have alot of characters. Simply put Vereesa is just a moron.

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I think Rommath believes Aethas can be a great magister if he gets over his profound naivete and all-consuming love for the Kirin Tor. Other than that, I guess every court needs a Fool in its ranks.

or he's keeping him alive for his kidneys.

[DeicideUH]

the only person who comes out of the purge worse than Vereesa is Aethas. Why the hell didnt Rommath mercy kill him.

Because, most probably, it was Rommath that put him in that position in the first place.

Aethas was loyal to Dalaran and Quel'thalas.
But the Horde used the Sunreavers to get the Divine Bell throught Dalaran's defenses.
Garrosh had no power to command the Sunreavers, so the order needed to come from someone on Quel'thalas.
Garrosh was threatening Lorthemar before the theft happened, yet Lorthemar was unaware of the events in Dalaran until the Purge. He was caught by surprise, according to the event that plays once the Sunreaver refuges arrive in Silvermoon. That was the breaking point for Lorthemar to begin acting against Garrosh.
So, considering Rommath is the leader of all magisters, including Sunreavers, he may be the one that ordered the theft so Garrosh would stop threatening his people.
And, due to conflicting loyalties, Aethas had to "look the other way". But, as leader of the Sunreavers, he was ultimately responsible for not intervening and stopping the theft.
The theft happened, Jaina found out and blamed Aethas and the Sunreavers.

Rommath may be a dick, but he cares for his people. I'm pretty sure that punishing an underling for a situation that Rommath may be responsible is not something that he would do.