Missouri to lower minimum wage from $10 to $7.70

[Logwyn]

... youre saying that startup money doesn't matter?
Well at least you've now demonstrated that you have no idea what you're talking about!

Please, try going to a bank and try to get a loan making minimum wage, no education, and the brilliant idea to sell burgers.

They'll laugh you right out of the place.

I think you need to remember what the conversation was about. I replied to someone saying you shouldn't expect someone to flipped burgers and support their family. I offered a scenario where you could possibly "flip burgers" and support a family.

Then you choose to take this off on a tangent about how to start up a business and what it takes. Which to the conversation of supporting a family while being a "burger flipper" was the topic at hand.

So yes. the idea of how they would start up the business and all the detail of this were not relevant to the topic. Oddly enough banks are not the only place you can get start up money for a business.

You don't even need a loan anyway.

[Shadowferal]

If I had the money, I'd have moved to Seattle by now

[Lochton]

All while the USA spends more money per capita( man woman and child) than anywhere else in the world by over double. Why is this? And you tell me ukraine is the corrupt country.

Health care is not a funding issue

Actually, I didn't tell you that Ukraine was the corrupt country.

As well, it is commonly know to the world, that the US spends more on things they overly don't need. You have the people to run a perfect healthcare system, yet doesn't get it to float.

No, healthcare is a people issue. If a low wage income can't afford it, or even get it for the taxes, then it is a flawed service.

[Toppy]

I'm definitely for raising the minimum wage and paying workers a livable wage. However, I have to inject one bit of logic. The reason why low wage earners do not earn more is also partly due to their own actions. If you willing to work for $7-8 an hour, then that's exactly what you are going to be paid. Most employers are not going to give you more than what the market demands, and will find anyway they can to give you less. I know there's plenty of objections to be had in that statement, however, it really boils down to that and until the people move forward with more unified, large scale, collective bargaining, then it will be business as usual making low wages. The government isnt going to fix this issue for anyone, its bought, sold, and paid for already by corporate entities and other special interest money groups. Only by creating an artificial shortage in the labor market can any improvement be had.

Unrealistic goal considering population numbers.

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Actually, I didn't tell you that Ukraine was the corrupt country.

As well, it is commonly know to the world, that the US spends more on things they overly don't need. You have the people to run a perfect healthcare system, yet doesn't get it to float.

No, healthcare is a people issue. If a low wage income can't afford it, or even get it for the taxes, then it is a flawed service.

I would give up with Anna, they can't hold a conversation past one quote. Even the Ukraine thing was related to something else entirely.

[Demithio]

Unrealistic goal considering population numbers.

Possibly unrealistic, very difficult at the least I would agree. However, its necessary. Two options here, change the government, which will affect the change by legislation (extremely unlikely in the US), or a national movement for the people to change it themselves through economic force (also difficult but perhaps not as unlikely as option A).

[elaina]

Because people seem confused

(1) Missouri is not in "the south", it's the Midwest, but is predominantly conservative. St. Louis is liberal.
(2) This is the state legislature stupidly overwriting a municipal law. Missouri state minimum wage is currently $7.70.

This is retarded. Part of the reason it is higher there is cost of living is also higher than most of the rest of the state.

[Toppy]

Simply put. Raising the minimum wage will be a hard thing. No doubt, some businesses will die. But, it is something that has to happen. We as a nation cannot grow, cannot prosper, cannot thrive without allowing our people to be able to live healthy lives.

You want to know why things are as bad as they are? Its because we ignored the problem. Not raising the minimum wage is continuing to ignore the basic problem of people not being able to spend in an econemy that sinks or swims based what people can spend. We are at a point where other nations look at us laugh over how poorly we treat our own people. Places where teenagers doing entry level work make more than adults here in the US who have been working the same field for over a decade.

We are a joke.

And we will not stop being a joke unless we stop and understand that a nation rises and falls upon the well being of its people. We cannot continue to spit on fellow Americans and praise their suffering. We are the wealthiest nation in the world but we have infrastructure worse than many third world nations. We are a nation of plenty that is not able to get to its people basic human needs such as safe drinking water.

And we are taking no steps to fix this. We are only taking steps to make it worse and continue to praise and defend those who caused the problem and offer no solutions at all other than ones that have over and over proven to not work, while demonizing those with a solution which in many areas have worked.

[Stormdash]

Why is it always conservatives that are trying to take money away from the poor? Isn't the "good book" pretty clear on it's stance of the poor?

They are raising the wages of those not getting hired at all for positions that are simply not worth $10/hr to have someone do, from $0.00 to $7.70. The true minimum wage is always zero, i.e. not hiring.

[Toppy]

They are raising the wages of those not getting hired at all for positions that are simply not worth $10/hr to have someone do, from $0.00 to $7.70. The true minimum wage is always zero, i.e. not hiring.

Businesses will need to hire, low minimum or not.

You know what really keeps people from hiring? No income coming in. Which happens when people arent making decent wages.

You're to focused on protecting the business (even though they are only hurting themselves) at the expense of the person.

Hell, $10 an hour is not much. At all. Have you tried living off that recently? I know I did, and it wasn't pretty.

[Demithio]

They are raising the wages of those not getting hired at all for positions that are simply not worth $10/hr to have someone do, from $0.00 to $7.70. The true minimum wage is always zero, i.e. not hiring.

So here's the catch. Fine, not worth $10, however, are the business owners going to work the jobs themselves? Some might, the very small ones. But how about say, a department store, or other medium to large business. So by raising the min wage to $10 or $15 an hour all these positions are going to disappear? The upper management / CEO / owners of said corporations are going to all go to each store and work the sales floor etc? Ok, I say lets test this hypothesis. I would like to see how it pans out if for nothing more than economic theory.

[Nihilist74]

Not knowing the usa, is that state one of those "special" states?

Yes its a very special state. One of the representatives from this state said that women who get raped can not get pregnant.

[shimerra]

If you make the minimum wage higher, it kills jobs. If it doesn't kill jobs, then just raise it to $50 an hour then, and prove it.

Ah yes the most idiotic counter to the economic reality that the real wage of the average American worker is at a 60 year low while the top earners is at a high and that for decades productivity increases have outstripped wage growth. The only solution to this must be MAKE EVERYONE'S WAGE A BILLION DOLLARS. Clearly Kansas's problem is they didn't cut taxes and public services hard enough!

By your 2 year old level application of economics I bet the concept of an inelastic good is a total mind fuck huh? Bit of advice when you turn to page two of Dr. Susses Micro econ you learn there's a world of difference between the numbers being talked about and 50. Might as well group you in with the group of folks that think keeping pace with inflation would crumple the economy.

[Moshots]

If I had the money, I'd have moved to Seattle by now

why would you want to move to a place where there are going to be no jobs soon???

raising the minimum wage by 5% or something is fine going $9 to $15 is causing alot of problems.... They are currently at $12 dollars and people are already being laid off/hours cut and Places like McDonald and such are starting to install those order your own machines to replace cashiers... By the time they hit $15 dollars in 3 years I bet Seattle has 6%+ Unemployment...

at 10 dollars an hour its not worth it for companies to go automatic with robots and do it yourself stations..... At 15 its not even a choice for the companies.

[SirBeef]

It's a way to get inexperienced people into the job market. You're not supposed to stay at $7.70 forever, just for a year or so, until you have something to write on your resume.

Wrong. Minimum wage was supposed to be the minimum wage needed to live off of. It has not kept up with the times in term of cost of living adjustments, inflation, or production. Businesses have lobbied hard to keep it down. It would be closer to $20/HR now if you account for those things. Frankly if business cannot afford to pay living wages they should not be in business.

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why would you want to move to a place where there are no jobs???

raising the minimum wage by 5% or something is fine going $9 to $15 is causing alot of problems.... They are currently at $12 dollars and people are already being laid off and Places like Mcdonands and such are starting to install those order your own machines to replace cashiers... By the time they hit $15 dollars in 3 years I bet Seattle has 6%+ Unemployment...

at 10 dollars an hour its not worth it for companies to go automatic with robots and do it yourself stations..... At 15 its not even a choice for the companies.

Automated kiosks were coming regardless of wage hikes. McDonald's had this in the works many years before these $15/hr talks.

[Theodarzna]

why would you want to move to a place where there are going to be no jobs soon???

raising the minimum wage by 5% or something is fine going $9 to $15 is causing alot of problems.... They are currently at $12 dollars and people are already being laid off/hours cut and Places like McDonald and such are starting to install those order your own machines to replace cashiers... By the time they hit $15 dollars in 3 years I bet Seattle has 6%+ Unemployment...

at 10 dollars an hour its not worth it for companies to go automatic with robots and do it yourself stations..... At 15 its not even a choice for the companies.

Something has to be done for there will always be poor people and they too need to eat and live something approximating a life on this earth.

[Moshots]

Something has to be done for there will always be poor people and they too need to eat and live something approximating a life on this earth.

raising the minimum wage by 50% though is doing nothing but making it unlivable for the super lower class/disabled/ect.... When someone who is disabled collecting a disability check/social security senior and now the cost of living goes up 50% because the minimum wage workers are making 50% more... Now all of a sudden you can't afford to eat...

Raising it slowly in a 10/15 year plan is good... Doing what Seattle is doing is gonna end up a massive failure and hurt those who can barely afford to live as it is.

[Tijuana]

Raising to an extreme is stupid and you know that good and well.

Raising the minimum wage regularly though does not kill jobs, the opposite has often been shown. Why? Because higher wage = more spending. And our entire economy is based on spending. If people can't spend. If they do not make enough money to even pay taxes, the country languishes.

You do realize that the country is slowly becoming a third world nation due to a crumbling infrastructure that cant support itself due to lack of incoming funds (because people cant afford to even pay taxes) as well as plummeting standards of living? Is that what you want? For the country to degrade down to a lower status and for its people to suffer and be incapable of bettering it as a whole?

If we raised the minimum by a dollar each year for a set number of years, jobs would boom after an initial drop.

Please, for the love of god, try to educate yourself and stop spouting off poorly informed rhetoric.

1. I agree that raising it to an extreme is stupid. That is why I am against $15.

2. I agree that it should be raised regularly, in small amounts, so as to limit the impact on unemployment. That is why I am against $15.

3. I disagree that the country is a third world nation, or that it is becoming one. If it was, that infrastructure is not the purview of federal government anyway. Take that issue to your local governor and state legislature. My state looks great. The concrete barely dries before they replace it.

4. Standards of living are not "plummeting". An American on welfare effectively makes wages that would be middle class in much of the EU. The poorest in the world worry they may starve. Our poorest have an obesity problem and they all have smart phones, TVs, AC, refrigerators, and many other things only the wealthy have in some nations.

5. If we raised the minimum in smart and small doses, as you prescribe, we would be doing exactly what Conservatives have been calling for all along. I'm glad we agree on something at least.

6. My education is quite good, actually. It looks nice on the wall, anyway. As yours grows, you will eventually learn that people can have different opinions, even when operating with the same facts. Nothing I have presented is outside the standard views of Conservatives and Libertarians. The fact that you seem unaware of their existence reflects on you, not me.

[Eliandal]

That's just sad!

Thankfully, provincial leaders up here - pretty much across the political spectrum, actually realize that paying a higher minimum wage is not detrimental, and for the record, in Ontario at least, there have been those that have complained at every major increase over the last two decades that it was going to kill business/productivity/profits. It hasn't!

[unfilteredJW]

Facebook

Google

Microsoft

Apple

Four companies started with nearly zero initial investment and all huge as fuck

This is what we like to call Survivorship Bias.

https://youarenotsosmart.com/2013/05...ivorship-bias/

[Shadowferal]

why would you want to move to a place where there are going to be no jobs soon???

I'm sure you want to believe that.